Bodhisattva Vows

[sky]

Originally Posted by ayar415

How are we to be together when you insist on being apart?

Individuality in oneness.

[The Cobbler's Apprentice]

Originally Posted by ayar415

You are me, my friend. You insist on being someone else, another human being distinctly separate from every other. THIS is the suffering. Fragmented, as Krishnamurti said. Each piece with its own peculiar beliefs.

How are we to be together when you insist on being apart?

As I see it, nonsense. Individuation/diversification after touching base remains. The realisation of non-duality within duality.

Back to where we started, but knowing it for the first time

So what is different?

"In every particular is the universal"....James Joyce. You need not be a Buddha.

If we were both hungry, you eating a sandwich would leave me still hungry.

[sky]

Originally Posted by ayar415

But what is the point of this? Apart from a means for Dogen and His Holiness, and some forum members here to escape and space out for a few moments of ecstatic joy

Grasping the Dharma wrongly is like grabbing a snake by the wrong end, the wrong grasp of those teachings will lead to suffering.

[The Cobbler's Apprentice]

Originally Posted by sky123

Grasping the Dharma wrongly is like grabbing a snake by the wrong end, the wrong grasp of those teachings will lead to suffering.

Yes, Sir Edwin Arnold in "The Light of Asia" simply got it wrong.

"The dewdrop slips into the shinning sea"?

Bah! as James Joyce would say!

The shinning sea slips into the dewdrop!

Ahh!

[ayar415]

Originally Posted by The Cobbler's Apprentice

The shinning sea slips into the dewdrop!
Ahh!

How does that work? It's poetic but definitely metaphorical, right? Discuss this, if you would, as a Professor of literature to a class of students. The Professor would, if he values his tenure and his credibility. But this is an obscure internet forum and you have no obligation to impart anything (unless you take yourself seriously).

[ayar415]

Originally Posted by The Cobbler's Apprentice

"In every particular is the universal"....James Joyce. You need not be a Buddha.

If we were both hungry, you eating a sandwich would leave me still hungry.

So, what does that mean? Do we accept this strange way of life as is? One person has billions, another nothing, as AbodiSky said?

It's quite the opposite in the material world of Maya. One person invents the wheel, all humanity gets to use it. If it were not for the guy who invented the internet, building on the knowledge acquired from others, we wouldn't have the wonderful ability to talk to each other and share ideas from all over the world. Humanity is materially powerful in that way. Spiritually, it is each man for himself. If you don't get it, tough.

[sky]

Originally Posted by ayar415

How does that work? It's poetic but definitely metaphorical, right?

Right, think of a journey from ego back to oneness

[The Cobbler's Apprentice]

Originally Posted by ayar415

How does that work? It's poetic but definitely metaphorical, right? Discuss this, if you would, as a Professor of literature to a class of students. The Professor would, if he values his tenure and his credibility. But this is an obscure internet forum and you have no obligation to impart anything (unless you take yourself seriously).

I think a large part of any serious spiritual path is not to take yourself seriously. Paradoxical I know, but that's the way I see it.

The dewdrop slips into the shinning sea.

The shinning sea slips into the dewdrop.

Both are "poetic" and "metaphorical" yet I find the second a better representation of reality. The first seems to suggest the complete dissolution of a "self", the entire loss of all identity, all diversification. The beauty of difference is lost.

The second speaks to me of grace, the gift of love. We "share" love with Reality-as-is.

"The Tao can be shared but not divided".

(I would quote a little poem by Dogen, about a dewdrop on a crane's beak, but I'm being watched....😀)

[ayar415]

Originally Posted by sky123

Right, think of a journey from ego back to oneness

There is no oneness, sky. There is only you: your ego, your family, friends, and your dog, if you have one. Be real, get real, take care of your health, and make sure you have enough money to live on for the rest of your life.

[The Cobbler's Apprentice]

Originally Posted by ayar415

You are me, my friend. You insist on being someone else, another human being distinctly separate from every other. THIS is the suffering. Fragmented, as Krishnamurti said. Each piece with its own peculiar beliefs.

How are we to be together when you insist on being apart?

Let us get back to this.

What do you mean?

I'm you? If I don't see that I am in fact "you" I will suffer? If I don't, I'm suffering, as a "fragment"? We must be "together." ?

The thing is, I am most certainly NOT you in a very certain context.

Here, in dialogue, I am seeking to bridge the "gap" between you and I (which DOES exist) by positing a "ground of being" (or non-being... ) which we in fact share. This recognises our unquestionable difference without descending into what Sartre once said:- Hell is other people.