Why does my awareness constantly turn into a vision?

[Maisy]

I've never experienced anything like a chakra so I don't believe they exist at this time. My transcendental experiences all seem to be far away from my physical body. One time I went really deep inward but I lost all sense of time and place and even there I seemed to be in a vast space, not centered in some physical body energy location.

I also experience my energy body as a singular unit. I've never experienced energies broken up by physical body and organ location. I also feel my physical body and consciousness have totally different sources and natures so I don't believe there are higher energies mingling with the lower vibrations and form of this physical body. I don't believe there are any centers of spiritual power in the human body. I think the center of spiritual power is our source, God, which is connected to our true selves or consciousness which is energy by nature and not physical. Just my beliefs which can be totally wrong.

[Maisy]

Originally Posted by FallingLeaves

today's lesson was on the feelings surrounding 'surrender' near the nose lol.

I've had my nose broken 4 times so it does seem to be a focus point for others!

[FallingLeaves]

yeah i'm a big believer in not trying to create things that don't already exist too... if i don't sense it there is no point to believing in it... and there is no point running around trying to sense stuff that others tell me is there either... but I don't know how successful I've been in that endeavor as this whole place seems designed to encourage us to put stuff in our own way lol...

I don't go deep within like you and others, I'm kinda stuck on the edge between 'inside' and 'outside'.... my energy bodies (I think I sense multiple independent ones) are all messed up though which is a big part of my struggles...

gotta have something to do I guess... lol...

[iamthat]

Originally Posted by Maisy

My feeling is that I am in my head behind the eyes. Or even slightly in front of the physical eyes. Probably because sight is our strongest sense in a way. I don't think I could imagine myself as "looking" from the chest or heart area. "Being" way down there.

Yoga teaches that the Atman (the Self) is connected to the physical body through the sutratma (the thread of Atman) via two main threads.

1. The thread of Consciousness connects to the brain via the head centres. This thread withdraws from the head every night when we sleep, which is why we become physically unconscious, and reconnects when we wake up.
2. The thread of Life connects to the heart via the heart centre and remains thus connected throughout our incarnation. Death occurs when the thread of Life withdraws from the heart.

So the head is naturally the location of consciousness, as you say. But the heart area is naturally the location of Life or Being. We do not need to "look" from the chest area - that is the function of the eyes as the physical sense organs of sight. We are only required to Be.

Peace

[iamthat]

Originally Posted by FallingLeaves

I only know the daoists put emphasis on the dan tien as being the 'center' of physicality of human beings. The dan tien is slightly below the belly button.

I am no authority on this subject but Taoism refers to three dan tien (also spelt dantian). Most people who refer to the dan tien mean the lower one below the navel. These three dan tien are energy centres where energy is built up and stored and then transmuted upwards.

These three dan tien are:

1. The lower dan tien which is just below the navel. The energy stored here is called Jing. Jing depletes with age. Practices such as Qigong, Tai Chi, Yoga, and meditation replenish Jing and convert it into Qi (vitality). This vitalises various physical functions.
2. The middle dan tien which is located in the chest area. Excess Qi generated by the lower dan tien rises to the middle dan tien and vitalises various other physical functions. The middle dan tien refines this Qi and converts it into Shen.
3. The upper dan tien which is located behind the centre of the eyebrows. Excess Shen generated by the middle dan tien rises to the upper dan tien. This Shen energy provides clear intention and calm thinking. The upper dan tien refines this Shen into Wu Wei or emptiness, and is related to consciousness.

This is a different approach to that of Yoga but the similarities are obvious.

Peace

[iamthat]

Originally Posted by Maisy

I did a google search on it and found out that Ramana Maharshi said that the Heart is the seat of the Self but I read what he said and my take on it is he was talking about love, not the chest area or physical body or the heart organ. Just my take on it. Ramana also said the self in not in the physical body.

Yes, Ramana Maharshi has much to say on the Heart as the seat of the Self, and while he indicates a physical location (slightly to the right of the centre of the chest) for the still small space, he does emphasise that the Self is not found in the physical body.

Being-consciousness, which is authentic bliss, and which is shining in the Heart, should be taken to be the target of your attention at all times.

Heart is another name for Reality. It is neither inside nor outside the body. There can be no in and out for it, since It alone is. This world is not other than the mind, the mind is not other than the Heart.

In the centre of the cavity of the Heart, the sole Reality shines by itself as the Self

The Heart is the centre of spiritual experience, according to the testimony of sages. The spiritual Heart centre is not an organ of the body. All that you can say is that it is the core of your being, that with which you are identical, whether you are awake, asleep or dreaming, whether you are engaged in work or immersed in Transcendental consciousness [samadhi].

Know that consciousness which always shines in the Heart as the formless Self, "I". It is known by one's being still, without thinking about anything as existent or non-existent.

Plenty more to be found at

https://www.inner-quest.org/Ramana_Wisdom.htm

Peace

[FallingLeaves]

Originally Posted by iamthat

Most people who refer to the dan tien mean the lower one below the navel. These three dan tien are energy centres where energy is built up and stored and then transmuted upwards.

oops my guides didn't explain that one to me... but i suppose it makes sense lol

[Ewwerrin]

I have experienced the heart as an energy field that connects to all other hearts and all other frequencies on planet and in creation. So it's not really a personal identity that was revealed to me. More like a chain reaction energy tendril that is infinitely connected and inseperable. Where all other heartbeats affect the one next down the line.

But this doesn't give me a center to focus upon as my true self. It feels similar to getting visions. But instead I get heart beats or rythms of creation. frequencies, pulses. Which is a changing thing.

I am looking for an unchanging identity. But I believe it cannot be known. I have to maybe accept that all is it. And since there is no outside to it... It cannot be known or objectified or experienced or made aware of. I don't know why I want to become aware of the absolute tho.

[Maisy]

As an aware perceiver I enjoy change in what I am aware of and perceiving. I also think there are amazing mind blowing things to be aware of and perceive I have not experienced yet. Bring on the new and the amazing!

The thought "I don't want to change" is confusing to me. What if you could change not wanting to change! But also I'm not sure I would call what I am changing. What I am experiencing is always changing but am I?

I think I'm like a unchanging movie screen. A new movie every week. I am not really changing at all. I'm the unchanging movie screen. Or I am like a mirror placed in a forest or on a busy street. What is reflected on me is constantly changing but I am not. The only way I could change is if I had dust on me, dirt on me, and that got cleared away so I could reflect more accurately the things reflected on me.

I think I am unchanging. I think I'm the same identity now as when I was 4 years old. I think nothing has changed at all. Like a mirror the things I am perceiving and so experiencing change a lot, but it's the same old me I have always been and always will be in my opinion. I just know myself to be a point of perception.

I think being in a physical body lends itself to some idea I am changing but then I would not say I am this body. I don't think learning is changing either. It's just having different stuff reflected on the mirror. At five years old, simple sense stuff, fear, laughing, crying, at 22 college, math and English, tests, dating... same mirror to me.

[FallingLeaves]

Originally Posted by Ewwerrin

And since there is no outside to it... It cannot be known or objectified or experienced or made aware of. I don't know why I want to become aware of the absolute tho.

you can certainly learn what it is NOT though... that might help clarify things...