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20-12-2020, 08:20 PM
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Master
Join Date: Nov 2019
Posts: 2,301
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Quote:
Originally Posted by iamthat
Herein lies your confusion. Beyond mind is pure Consciousness. If you claim that nothing is beyond mind then that is a product of your imagination.
If you have not experienced these states beyond the mind for yourself then it is just theory. For some, this is knowledge gained through direct experience.
You come across as having a lot of intellectual ideas but no actual experience of these things.
Peace
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How do you know so called pure consciousness is beyond the mind? You are the one whom is confused because you think with your mind that pure consciousness is beyond the mind. If that is true what is the point of thinking with the mind that pure consciousness is beyond the mind, since it is beyond the mind?
Consciousness, pure or otherwise is only conscious of the seen physical existence/reality. Unseen existence/reality is only conscious of the seen existence/reality through Atman. The unseen existence and the seen physical existences are both/makes up Brahman/ultimate reality. How is that not personally experiencing Brahman?
You can not personally experience Brahman through your personal Atman when you dismiss or ignore the individual, mind etc etc, it simply does not work. Personally experiencing Brahman through the individual but not separate Atman is the whole entire point.
__________________
"Cosmos is perfect order, the sum total of everything"
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21-12-2020, 01:04 AM
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Master
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Golden Bay, New Zealand
Posts: 3,580
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeS80
How do you know so called pure consciousness is beyond the mind? You are the one whom is confused because you think with your mind that pure consciousness is beyond the mind. If that is true what is the point of thinking with the mind that pure consciousness is beyond the mind, since it is beyond the mind?
Consciousness, pure or otherwise is only conscious of the seen physical existence/reality. Unseen existence/reality is only conscious of the seen existence/reality through Atman. The unseen existence and the seen physical existences are both/makes up Brahman/ultimate reality. How is that not personally experiencing Brahman?
You can not personally experience Brahman through your personal Atman when you dismiss or ignore the individual, mind etc etc, it simply does not work. Personally experiencing Brahman through the individual but not separate Atman is the whole entire point.
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There are states of Being beyond the mind where thoughts do not exist but Consciousness is present. The mind pertains to form. Consciousness beyond the mind is Self-Awareness unmodified by form. If you ever want direct experience of this then you will need to surrender all your concepts.
We could discuss this forever but it gets somewhat pointless.
Peace
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21-12-2020, 02:50 AM
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Master
Join Date: Sep 2018
Location: Delhi, India
Posts: 10,939
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Quote:
Originally Posted by running
ego is the identity.
what one opens to is a deep silence and current that activates the nervous system as joy in the body and mind.
people refer to it as non dual because its causeless and endless.
whatever practice that opens one to it is good. for one its one thing. for another something else may work better. it takes time to open to it. takes more time to open to it to a point its causeless, endless, and does not become obstructed by the person in some way.
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Vibrant inner silence, ever present, yes!
__________________
The Self has no attribute
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21-12-2020, 03:42 AM
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Deactivated Account
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: in my truck. anywhere usa
Posts: 8,524
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeS80
The thing is, people do not seem to get that thier mind/ego that is preoccupied/filled up with false imaginary concepts/images about Self and consciouseness and dismissing/disassociating thier individual but not separate Self, is not being in a deep silence. It does not work, and for what, for a false imaginary sense of bliss, joy etc etc. Deep silence is having an empty mind.
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beyond mind simply takes the space or it can be interpreted as being overpowered by silence and joy.
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21-12-2020, 09:16 AM
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I have to chuckle at the lengths the self will go in order to maintain its primacy, even though that primacy is the root cause of suffering. I find this quote quite appropriate.
The path of awakening is not about becoming who you are. Rather it is about unbecoming who you are not. ~ Albert Schweitzer
Translation: It's not about becoming Self because That thou art. It's about unbecoming the self, dropping the masquerade and allowing Self to reveal Itself. As it's said, Self is self-revealing and once revealed it's self-evident.
It's not the mystical although there can be mystical experiences. It's the extraordinary hiding in plain sight, masquerading as the ordinary by wearing the cloak of the self. It's the Ineffable pretending to be the effable.
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21-12-2020, 12:08 PM
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Master
Join Date: Nov 2019
Posts: 2,301
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Quote:
Originally Posted by running
beyond mind simply takes the space or it can be interpreted as being overpowered by silence and joy.
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This is empty mind.
__________________
"Cosmos is perfect order, the sum total of everything"
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21-12-2020, 12:42 PM
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Master
Join Date: Nov 2019
Posts: 2,301
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JustASimpleGuy
I have to chuckle at the lengths the self will go in order to maintain its primacy, even though that primacy is the root cause of suffering. I find this quote quite appropriate.
The path of awakening is not about becoming who you are. Rather it is about unbecoming who you are not. ~ Albert Schweitzer
Translation: It's not about becoming Self because That thou art. It's about unbecoming the self, dropping the masquerade and allowing Self to reveal Itself. As it's said, Self is self-revealing and once revealed it's self-evident.
It's not the mystical although there can be mystical experiences. It's the extraordinary hiding in plain sight, masquerading as the ordinary by wearing the cloak of the self. It's the Ineffable pretending to be the effable.
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You believe in the made up imaginary concept of self (which is contents in your mind) in a negative separating and dividing way. self is not primacy, self is just incorrect conditioning, beliefs, thoughts, dogma etc etc about Self/Atman, consciousness, physical seen existence, unseen existence, Brahman etc etc.
The path of awakening is not about becoming your incorrect conditioning, beliefs, thoughts, dogma etc etc about Self/Atman, consciousness, physical seen existence, unseen existence, Brahman etc etc. Rather it is about unbecoming your incorrect conditioning, beliefs, thoughts, dogma etc etc about Self/Atman, consciousness, physical seen existence, unseen existence, Brahman etc etc. You do not need to become Atman/Self because obviously you are/were born as Atman/Self. You just need to unbecome your incorrect conditioning, beliefs, thoughts, dogma etc etc about Self/Atman, consciousness, Brahman, physical seen existence, unseen existence etc etc.
__________________
"Cosmos is perfect order, the sum total of everything"
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21-12-2020, 07:12 PM
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Master
Join Date: Nov 2019
Posts: 2,301
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JustASimpleGuy
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What beings? You said individual beings are not who we truly are.
__________________
"Cosmos is perfect order, the sum total of everything"
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21-12-2020, 08:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeS80
What beings? You said individual beings are not who we truly are.
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It's a Star Wars reference (Yoda quote). LOL!
Aside from that and in this frame of reference (relative/transactional reality) it just makes sense and flows more naturally to speak (and type) colloquially. Otherwise I'd sound like Sadhguru talking about "this one" and "this body". Sounds kinda pretentious.
You could click on the link and listen for 15 or so minutes. Better yet listen to Swamiji's entire six part series on the Mandukya Upanishad. It's the shortest and most powerful Upanishad.
Part 1 - https://youtu.be/scLipiyG6ns
Part 2 - https://youtu.be/Onm_8r7TiVE
Part 3 - https://youtu.be/MLuUl-mjk4k
Part 4 - https://youtu.be/5ieoVJ4dDSw
Part 5 - https://youtu.be/SSeT9Ewofu4
Part 6 - https://youtu.be/C9dIve89q9Q
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