Non duality

[HITESH SHAH]

Scriptures say God created the world to have varied experiences which are possible only when there are many and not possible in solo . So He said "I am one and let there be many" . So he created myriad forms and shapes and have the varied experiences .

Nonduality is just description of this reality . When there are many there is fun and excitement of play . When one feels oneness one can experience the independent sustainable bliss and joy . If one carefully observes we need both independent sustainable bliss and excitement of play also and the quality of both need to be superior.

So non-duality is not denial of duality as God Himself wanted be many and we can not disrespect the wish/laws of God . At the same time God also is One only . So there is need to respect that also . This is possible only through careful orientation towards one-ness / non-duality while navigating the world of duality with par excellence.

As universe is vast and it is quite possible , many really enjoy the play of multiplicity duality and may not want or can not imagine the independent sustainable bliss/joy . That is perfectly ok . That is the experience of many (which God wanted to have as per His wish) . And there is no need to discard the same . At the same time there is independent sustainable joy/bliss in one-ness / non-duality also . There is no need to discard that experience as well. Because that too will be disregard of God's assertion of oneness .

In day to day real-life also there is greater satisfaction/bliss in life in moments of intense love/one-ness / non-duality in various apparently dual positions. Non-duality simply exhorts one to extend this routine experiences to spirituality .

[inavalan]

Does non-duality imply the belief in the existence of a god? Does oneness imply that too?

[Lord_Viskey]

I believe that both "non-duality" & "oneness" imply the existence of a higher intelligence, as well as a "subtle order" to reality.

For most people, it is easier to associate this miraculous occurance to a deity, most often reffered to as "God".

Personally, I think a "universal/cosmological/divine" order superceded "God" if for no other reason than everyone having a penchant to ... "identify with" ... their own unique concept of God - (even though we freely say that "God cannot be conceived") - the use of this word in and of itself implies a symbolism that must directly lead one to assume a duality in nature exists ...

that being : "God can only mean perfection; the flesh can only mean imperfection."

Whereas, my concept of "Intelligent Design" merely implies that there is a "pool" - a resource, if you will - where all potentialiaty, manifest and non-manifest originates from .... God is not the Intelligent Design (per se); God is the "Intelligent Designer" who has this pool of infinite potential at [Its] disposal.

This perspective of mine further allows the use of terminology such as "The Infinite Absolute" ... God, to most comprehension, is Infinite, non-definable, therefore, not Absolute.

Being Absolute infers substantiallity, objectivity, distinction - none of which can be directly associated to a definition which includes God - at least, "purely accurately."

Rather, it should be the case that the "Absolute is Absolutely Infinite" & the "Infinite is infinitely Absolute" (when any aspect of it becomes "phenominal" of course).

After this realization, it should be no feat to understand that "Consciousness" is at the center of it all, for without consciousness, nothing can ever be organized, or realized...

So, with consciousness "in play," non-duality and oneness are obtainable to the human mind ... the "root of self reference" implies that all we need to do is "look with it" to perceive reality properly.

My "Infinity Studies" (an as of yet unpublished work), attempts to explain the cycle between "self & soul & spirit" and how each contributes to the next in an endless progression of "insight through experience", "synthesis through spirit" & "illumination as a coincidence of being a soul".

[HITESH SHAH]

Originally Posted by inavalan

Does non-duality imply the belief in the existence of a god? Does oneness imply that too?

Yes .It certainly implies belief in God . Though we are the reflection of God and in essence no different from God , the difference is sheer scale and grandeur of God . He is way big and we are just tiny particles of it.

[HITESH SHAH]

Originally Posted by Lord_Viskey

I believe that both "non-duality" & "oneness" imply the existence of a higher intelligence, as well as a "subtle order" to reality.

For most people, it is easier to associate this miraculous occurance to a deity, most often reffered to as "God".

Personally, I think a "universal/cosmological/divine" order superceded "God" if for no other reason than everyone having a penchant to ... "identify with" ... their own unique concept of God - (even though we freely say that "God cannot be conceived") - the use of this word in and of itself implies a symbolism that must directly lead one to assume a duality in nature exists ...

that being : "God can only mean perfection; the flesh can only mean imperfection."

Whereas, my concept of "Intelligent Design" merely implies that there is a "pool" - a resource, if you will - where all potentialiaty, manifest and non-manifest originates from .... God is not the Intelligent Design (per se); God is the "Intelligent Designer" who has this pool of infinite potential at [Its] disposal.

This perspective of mine further allows the use of terminology such as "The Infinite Absolute" ... God, to most comprehension, is Infinite, non-definable, therefore, not Absolute.

Being Absolute infers substantiallity, objectivity, distinction - none of which can be directly associated to a definition which includes God - at least, "purely accurately."

Rather, it should be the case that the "Absolute is Absolutely Infinite" & the "Infinite is infinitely Absolute" (when any aspect of it becomes "phenominal" of course).

After this realization, it should be no feat to understand that "Consciousness" is at the center of it all, for without consciousness, nothing can ever be organized, or realized...

So, with consciousness "in play," non-duality and oneness are obtainable to the human mind ... the "root of self reference" implies that all we need to do is "look with it" to perceive reality properly.

My "Infinity Studies" (an as of yet unpublished work), attempts to explain the cycle between "self & soul & spirit" and how each contributes to the next in an endless progression of "insight through experience", "synthesis through spirit" & "illumination as a coincidence of being a soul".

It may be true people use word God as intelligent designer of universal order because it becomes easier to understand explain lot of miraculous happenings easily.

With consciousness in play human mind can accomplish one-ness/non-duality provided efforts are genuine ,persistent and honest. It is very difficult to find people with such real uninterrupted experiences .

[Lord_Viskey]

. With consciousness in play human mind can accomplish one-ness/non-duality provided efforts are genuine ,persistent and honest. It is very difficult to find people with such real uninterrupted experiences .

there are some who believe “uninterrupted experiences” are not practical in real physical life (day to day) relationships with other humans or human social interactions because the one with “oneness/non-duality” “going on” places them in a perceived disconnection with their (those other’s) thoughts and feelings .... though appearing sympathetic, they are often left with their “hands tied” as to what necessary help they could offer to the less enlightened... a perceived “ungracious” social arrangement, by most standards.

[HITESH SHAH]

Originally Posted by Lord_Viskey

there are some who believe “uninterrupted experiences” are not practical in real physical life (day to day) relationships with other humans or human social interactions because the one with “oneness/non-duality” “going on” places them in a perceived disconnection with their (those other’s) thoughts and feelings .... though appearing sympathetic, they are often left with their “hands tied” as to what necessary help they could offer to the less enlightened... a perceived “ungracious” social arrangement, by most standards.

I don't think its impractical in real life . However its definitely challenging and difficult in view of tremendous power of lure and threats this world poses each and every moment & our limited span of attention. Only a person with good understanding , dedication and commitment can put it into day to day life. At base level we do have some non-duality in-built in us considering daily sleep hours , ability to be non-dual with kith n kin / near and dear ones / with the work one likes/facinate . However it is difficult to find people taking it to different levels in terms of intensity , scale and granularity .

[Lord_Viskey]

However it is difficult to find people taking it to different levels in terms of intensity , scale and granularity .

probably mostly due to the fact there are no really good road maps telling us how to do it, that fits every life style or our various attitudes (typically traceable back to our “bio-social” upbringings)

Originally Posted by HITESH SHAH

So non-duality is not denial of duality as God Himself wanted be many and we can not disrespect the wish/laws of God . At the same time God also is One only . So there is need to respect that also . This is possible only through careful orientation towards one-ness / non-duality while navigating the world of duality with par excellence.

This is most excellently- stated.

As they say, it hit the nail right on the head. Thanks HITESH SHAH.

Originally Posted by HITESH SHAH

I don't think its impractical in real life . However its definitely challenging and difficult in view of tremendous power of lure and threats this world poses each and every moment & our limited span of attention. Only a person with good understanding , dedication and commitment can put it into day to day life. At base level we do have some non-duality in-built in us considering daily sleep hours , ability to be non-dual with kith n kin / near and dear ones / with the work one likes/facinate . However it is difficult to find people taking it to different levels in terms of intensity , scale and granularity .

I experienced it once, for fairly good periods of time. I was in Sadhana for months so I guess that helped, and it was...in the past...easy once I applied myself.

But it's been years now and every day I feel the loss of losing that feeling...but also know what you say is 100% Truth...

It pains me but I am so heartened to see so many people of true Understanding and Light on this forum. It sustains me somehow to be in touch.

thank you.

JL