Yale Scientist abanding Darwin's Evolution

[Moonglow]

Originally Posted by Greenslade

When I watch the videos I get the feeling that NH is very Spiritual and he goes p[laces most scientists don't, because he talks of science and consciousness in the same sentence. I guess he doesn't want to look too hippyfied in front of his peers. One of the things he did say that made me wonder when he was talking about quantum entanglement, according to him consciousness is in a feedback loop with the Unified Field, which started me thinking on all kinds of things. If we used the words Unified Field/Field of Probability for God, how different would Spirituality look?


If you like this stuff, have a gander at Rupert Sheldrake too. His background is religious and he spent a lot of time touring India and the like, but he's a scientist too. I like his morphogenic field stuff, that's pretty thought-provoking.

Hi Greenslade,

That is what seems to be some of the division that arises when getting into "spiritual" talk. Thie physical gets divided from the Ethreal or what some may say energy.

If seeing it as all being intertwined and unified it does and has for me changed the perspective of things.

I believe through the years here I have expressed such, in my own way. At times met with the sounds of crickets chirping. Well atleast they enjoyed it, lol.

Enter into the mix probababilities, then the field blast open to any number of events. But, there are those that go on facts and figures. Has me asking; just what are these based upon and as exploration and research shows these have and continue to change, to a degree. Atleast how it may be understood or taken.

The other thing that has me wonder is that NH spoke about how there is no empty space. He alluded to the premis that space is filled with energy, as I recall.

As much as some say science is mostly theory, so is Spirituality mostly philosophy and theology. As much as scientists may debate over theories and what is and may be. So, it seems the same among some who practice and study spirituality. As much as some scientists are alluding to a Unified Field, so some speak of God as being All. Not much difference, just different approaches.

As it enters into our awareness, doesn't it enter into our consciousness? To me it takes some kind of consciousness to create and make things happen. Perhaps not in ways that have been taught or one may think consciousness is.

Has me thinking and I most certainly don't know it all. Which makes life interesting.

Be checking out Rupert Sheldrake as well when time allows.

Thank you

[Still_Waters]

Originally Posted by inavalan

Most people parrot others. That may suggest that humans may have evolved both from apes and parrots ... maybe with some higher intelligence involvement. Was that a successful endeavor? The jury's still out on that ... :)

That is hilarious !

[Still_Waters]

Originally Posted by BigJohn

CREATION VS EVOLUTION

Creation lost ground in the Jewish, Christian and Muslim arena due to losing ground
dealing with the Great Flood story. The geological records does not support such a
flood but what is more devastating is Jesus reference the Flood several times.

At the same time, Hindu/Buddhist faiths have been able to hold there own.

Surprising, Evolution has been moving fast to answer difficult questions as more information emerges to support their
positions. While at the same time, the various religions, in many cases, have a difficult time to support their positions.

I think religion might be losing............

Could you elaborate on the Geological Records not supporting the Great Flood. I had thought that there was geological evidence of A FLOOD but it wasn't clear exactly how much of the earth was actually flooded. Your posts generally trigger thoughts and questions with me.

Regarding "Creation versus Evolution", could it be a combination of both? Are you familiar with Rupert Shedrake and morphogenetic fields relating to the evolution of forms involving something akin to Jung's collective unconscious to explain what appear to be "missing links"?

[Still_Waters]

Originally Posted by Shivani Devi

In my philosophy, my religion and my understanding, the only "Universal Truth" is called Brahman. It is something beyond words..nobody can speak about it without everybody being "wrong" and hence why it is a "Universal Truth".


Meanwhile, I honestly know that speaking about spiritual things on a spiritual forum isn't really doing me any favors either, but it is one way to pass the time..one of many ways..

I agree that Truth "is something beyond words... nobody can speak about it".

It seems that the best way to communicate it is in the Great Silence as in the case of Dakshinamurti.

[Shivani Devi]

Originally Posted by Still_Waters

I agree that Truth "is something beyond words... nobody can speak about it".

It seems that the best way to communicate it is in the Great Silence as in the case of Dakshinamurti.

*HUGS*

मौनव्याख्या प्रकटित परब्रह्मतत्त्वं युवानं
वर्षिष्ठांते वसद् ऋषिगणैः आवृतं ब्रह्मनिष्ठैः ।
आचार्येन्द्रं करकलित चिन्मुद्रमानंदमूर्तिं
स्वात्मारामं मुदितवदनं दक्षिणामूर्तिमीडे ॥१॥

Mauna-Vyaakhyaa Prakattita Para-Brahma-Tattvam Yuvaanam
Varssisstthaam-Te Vasad Rssigannaih Aavrtam Brahma-Nisstthaih |
Aacaarye[a-I]ndram Kara-Kalita Cin-Mudram-Aananda-Muurtim
Sva-[A]atmaaraamam Mudita-Vadanam Dakssinnaamuurti-Miidde ||1||

Meaning:
1: Salutations to Sri Dakshinamurthy, Whose Exposition through Profound Silence is Awakening the Knowledge of the Supreme Brahman in the Hearts of His Disciples.
2: .Who is Himself Youthful, but is Sitting Surrounded by Old and Great Sages who are Devoted to Brahman.
3: The Hands of the Supreme Spiritual Teacher is Forming the Chin-Mudra (gesture of the Knowledge of Brahman) and Whose Appearance is Still and Blissful.
4: Who is Rejoicing in His Own Self which is reflected on His Blissful Face; Salutations to Sri Dakshinamurthy.

भूरम्भांस्यनलोऽनिलोऽम्बरमहर्नाथो हिमांशु पुमान्
इत्याभाति चराचरात्मकमिदं यस्यैव मूर्त्यष्टकम्
नान्यत् किञ्चन विद्यते विमृशतां यस्मात्परस्माद्विभोः
तस्मै श्रीगुरुमूर्तये नम इदं श्रीदक्षिणामूर्तये ॥९॥

Bhuur-Ambhaamsy-Analo-[A]nilo-[A]mbaram-Aharnaatho Himaamshu Pumaan
Ity[i]-Aabhaati Cara-Acara-[A]atmakam-Idam Yasya-Eva Muurty[i]-Assttakam
Naanyat Kin.cana Vidyate Vimrshataam Yasmaat-Parasmaad-Vibhoh
Tasmai Shrii-Guru-Muurtaye Nama Idam Shrii-Dakssinnaamuurtaye ||9||

Meaning:
Salutations to Sri Dakshinamurthy Who Awakens the Glory of the Atman within us through His Profound Silence.
9.1: Earth, Water, Fire, Air, Space, Sun, Moon and Jiva (embodied Consciousness);
9.2: All are Verily His Eight Manifestations Shining within all of the Moving and the Non-Moving forms.
9.3: Apart from Him (i.e. Atman) there Cannot Exist anything; The Yogis who Meditate and Look within, Discover Him as the Essence From Which Everything Originates, ... they Discover Him as Existing Beyond Everything as that Eternal Essence .
9.4: Salutations to Him, the Personification of Our Inner Guru Who Awakens us into This Knowledge through His Profound Silence; Salutation to Sri Dakshinamurthy.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=LH05t-5C-8E

*cries*

Aum Namah Shivaya

[BigJohn]

Originally Posted by Still_Waters

Could you elaborate on the Geological Records not supporting the Great Flood. I had thought that there was geological evidence of A FLOOD but it wasn't clear exactly how much of the earth was actually flooded. Your posts generally trigger thoughts and questions with me.

Regarding "Creation versus Evolution", could it be a combination of both? Are you familiar with Rupert Shedrake and morphogenetic fields relating to the evolution of forms involving something akin to Jung's collective unconscious to explain what appear to be "missing links"?

I live in a basin surrounded in each direction by at least 1 mountain range.
There are some rock formations that date back 1.7-1.9 billion years old - that is the approximate
age of the Grand Canyon at her deepest point - over 6000 feet/1850 meters.
I have found absolutely no evidence of a flood.
I have asked others; there just is no evidence.

[BigJohn]

To calculate the amount of water per inch for the flood, use the following simple calculator.

A. Highest mountain at that time _______
B. Elevation of the Ark before the flood _______

C. Subtract B from A _______

D. Divide C by 1000 _______ inches of water/hour

Example

A. Highest mountain at that time _29000_
B. Elevation of the Ark before the flood __1000_

C. Subtract B from A _28000_

D. Divide C by 1000 _28____ inches of water/hour

[davidsun]

Originally Posted by Shivani Devi

The Hindu mythology also includes a flood story:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flood_myth

Geological records DO show evidence for a great flood which occured at the end of the last Yunger-Dryas era, some 11,000 - 12,500 years ago submerging cities like Dwarka off the coast of India...just ask Robert Shoch... he will tell you..

I just think that the Christians exaggerated the flood a tad....just a bit...

However, the Hindu creation myth involves a lotus sprouting from the navel of a sleeping God while an ocean of milk gets churned using an upturned mountain resting on the back of a giant tortoise with a huge five-headed snake for a churning rope..

How we Hindus have still managed to be taken seriously and to "hold our own" is totally beyond me.

However, we don't need to support our positions, because God does.

You are in fine form (humor) there, SD. Very enjoyable.

[Moonglow]

Originally Posted by Shivani Devi

Honestly? Brutally? Sincerely?

The focus of modern scientific thought (as it has pretty much ALWAYS been) is to "demystify the mystical" thus bringing things like beauty, love, awe, inspiration, wonderment and joy into the domain of cold, hard, unemotional, empirical rationalism. Modern neuroscience is notorious for it.

I just read an article called "This is Your Brain on God" in which neurotheologists (see, there is even a SCIENCE for it) compared the brains of devout believers in God to those of Atheists and measured all of the chemicals. They found chemical differences, structural differences and then said that feelings of love, Grace, devotion etc were nothing more than just chemicals in the brain...and a thousand fluffy kittens just died.

Now days, "Spiritual Awakening" means having more DMT in your pineal gland, combined with dormant genes switching on in your "Junk DNA" combined with better connections across the synapses leading to increased serotonin and dopamine levels...so cold! so clinical! and all of that child-like innocence, to appreciate the beauty, wonder, magic and "newness" is replaced with "oh, it is just my brain doing its 'brain thing'...big deal!"

The scientists have taken it from the realm of the 'spiritual' into the realm of the 'physical'...."oh, that NDE thing? that's just what happens when your brain is starved of oxygen.." "oh you say that valerian helps you to sleep? That is just the placebo effect.." there is a freaking explanation for EVERYTHING and the internets puts it all out there...oh yes it does!

Back when I was 17 when I felt what I did...I became "enlightened" because nobody knew all this stuff..the mystical was still mysterious, the occult was still esoteric and not exoteric..people didn't downplay experiences by saying "oh, you just had a rush of dopamine..no biggie"..they downplayed experiences by saying "oh, I see you can still talk about it! back to the meditation room you go!" LOL

How times have changed...

Hi Shavani Devi,

You make some good points here.

Wonder if at times if the search for reason(s) diminish the sense of wonder in ways. Over rationalizing.

I mean when explaining a sunset and what causes it, kills just enjoying the beauty of it. Would find myself if someone did this while enjoying it saying;"shhh, just take it in." Or words along that line.

To never lose the wonder and magic. Yeah, can become a little stale. This is when I feel a nudge to be more creative to experience it or something comes along that blows my mind. Find in these moments, the magic and wonder is still there.

Then as said, some things can not be placed in words or be boxed into an equation. It just is there and experienced. As I see it.

[Still_Waters]

Originally Posted by Shivani Devi

*HUGS*

मौनव्याख्या प्रकटित परब्रह्मतत्त्वं युवानं
वर्षिष्ठांते वसद् ऋषिगणैः आवृतं ब्रह्मनिष्ठैः ।
आचार्येन्द्रं करकलित चिन्मुद्रमानंदमूर्तिं
स्वात्मारामं मुदितवदनं दक्षिणामूर्तिमीडे ॥१॥

Mauna-Vyaakhyaa Prakattita Para-Brahma-Tattvam Yuvaanam
Varssisstthaam-Te Vasad Rssigannaih Aavrtam Brahma-Nisstthaih |
Aacaarye[a-I]ndram Kara-Kalita Cin-Mudram-Aananda-Muurtim
Sva-[A]atmaaraamam Mudita-Vadanam Dakssinnaamuurti-Miidde ||1||

Meaning:
1: Salutations to Sri Dakshinamurthy, Whose Exposition through Profound Silence is Awakening the Knowledge of the Supreme Brahman in the Hearts of His Disciples.
2: .Who is Himself Youthful, but is Sitting Surrounded by Old and Great Sages who are Devoted to Brahman.
3: The Hands of the Supreme Spiritual Teacher is Forming the Chin-Mudra (gesture of the Knowledge of Brahman) and Whose Appearance is Still and Blissful.
4: Who is Rejoicing in His Own Self which is reflected on His Blissful Face; Salutations to Sri Dakshinamurthy.

भूरम्भांस्यनलोऽनिलोऽम्बरमहर्नाथो हिमांशु पुमान्
इत्याभाति चराचरात्मकमिदं यस्यैव मूर्त्यष्टकम्
नान्यत् किञ्चन विद्यते विमृशतां यस्मात्परस्माद्विभोः
तस्मै श्रीगुरुमूर्तये नम इदं श्रीदक्षिणामूर्तये ॥९॥

Bhuur-Ambhaamsy-Analo-[A]nilo-[A]mbaram-Aharnaatho Himaamshu Pumaan
Ity[i]-Aabhaati Cara-Acara-[A]atmakam-Idam Yasya-Eva Muurty[i]-Assttakam
Naanyat Kin.cana Vidyate Vimrshataam Yasmaat-Parasmaad-Vibhoh
Tasmai Shrii-Guru-Muurtaye Nama Idam Shrii-Dakssinnaamuurtaye ||9||

Meaning:
Salutations to Sri Dakshinamurthy Who Awakens the Glory of the Atman within us through His Profound Silence.
9.1: Earth, Water, Fire, Air, Space, Sun, Moon and Jiva (embodied Consciousness);
9.2: All are Verily His Eight Manifestations Shining within all of the Moving and the Non-Moving forms.
9.3: Apart from Him (i.e. Atman) there Cannot Exist anything; The Yogis who Meditate and Look within, Discover Him as the Essence From Which Everything Originates, ... they Discover Him as Existing Beyond Everything as that Eternal Essence .
9.4: Salutations to Him, the Personification of Our Inner Guru Who Awakens us into This Knowledge through His Profound Silence; Salutation to Sri Dakshinamurthy.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=LH05t-5C-8E

*cries*

Aum Namah Shivaya

I sensed that the mention of Dakshinamurti would resonate well with you.

Om Namah Shivay !