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Go Back   Spiritual Forums > Spirituality & Beliefs > Love & Relationships -Friends and Family

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  #1  
Old 04-08-2022, 05:34 AM
asearcher
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Taking defense

Hi,

just wish to share my thoughts on when/if an initial reaction to something, critique, brought your way if one take defense.

I've been in a relationship with someone who was always doing that, with me, that is. When I came hurt, confused, angry his reaction of defense would make it worse. It would later not be sorted out, all the way. I closed off because being hurt twice about something was more than enough for me and I did not want to "nag", bring it up again, to yet again be met by defense.

He came from a family where the defense-reaction always was.Then smoothing things over as if nothing had happened. But it lingered on. For me it did.

I think Taking defense creates less mental intimacy. In short and long terms.

The way I have felt is that I would take 5 steps forward, daring to be vulnerable, or what ever true emotion I had, and he pushed me 10 steps back.Just when I did not think it could get any worse, it just did.

It is the same as first I had been emotionally punched 1 time. Then I told him I've been that. Then he punched me again by being on the defense.

This is how it is: Taking defense is a sign of low self esteem. It is the opposite what to me he looked like, so secure, angry even, or bottled up.


As for me when someone comes to me I would say stuff like "I'm sorry THAT I hurt you". Or "I'm so sorry I hurt you". Because I was. I did not really then care who or what or when, but that alone I was sorry for, as I loved or liked and respected that person and had had no intention to hurt that someone. Almost immediately there would be a shift in that individual/those individuals faces. I think it was because I validated them, their truth, their feelings and I wanted to hear it, I could take it. I did not go to defense. So I never and never goes IF I hurt you (it is pretty clear I did so I don't know why people use the IF to start with, it is just to undermine someone).

Turns out we could sort it out and often the person coming to me that I had hurt would say stuff like she/he had thought about this and could now understand my side of it too. It always felt as if it was completely sorted out and out of the picture and our relationship remained intact, close.

I think everyone fights, disagrees, misunderstand and that is part of having a relationship with someone. It is how we react that detect more about ourselves than the other one and how we resolve things.

So please if you happen to be in a relationship with someone who always goes on the defense - know this - it's about them, their self esteem, not you, do not doubt your reality or your right to your experience and truth.

After he had taken defense he would be somewhat righteous about it. And then after that he would spin into despair, being apologetic, and being afraid to loose me.

He had been taught you take defense if someone says something to you, then you smooth things over. It made the relationship be "just so", and that was what he was accustomed to and that was his normal. He would say we were close, that he was not used to such a close relationship, when I would most def think we were not close, not how I would think of it. We used to be before before that is things got piled up, accumulating, in this manner.

I would not go to him, I would reflect, keep things to myself, would it be worth bringing up and so on? That's not being close. He would say that too, that he felt he was loosing me, then as if I came back a little bit and then loosing me again and that he did not understand why that was.

He has now changed. I can at this point think it is not something he is faking or is temporarily so. But something has changed. He has put in a lot of mental work deliberately wanting to change and wanting this relationship to work and now done so over quite some time. I'm thinking, hoping he's got a better self esteem these days :)

So do not take it personal if, when it happens, is all I want to say.

We're all mysteries I think, both fascinating, wonderful and terrible at times when we start to unfold reasons why we are the way we are.

Last edited by asearcher : 04-08-2022 at 06:22 PM.
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  #2  
Old 04-08-2022, 04:25 PM
lostsoul13 lostsoul13 is offline
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Definitely stems from low self esteem just we can’t always see these thing: but writing a letter to say about it or talking about it might help, although I know people run - when there’s something to talk about- they don’t want to be changed; I think we have to accept them for low self esteem and the faults that come with that- building them up instead of building them down—- the same could be said for the person with low self esteem (they trying to change me, or always pulling meetings to discuss while I’m not feeling 100% )

Understanding it’s esteem issues and allowing the person to grow and come about in their own time..

Being ‘pushed’ gets you no where so your left with rising above it and giving the benefit of doubt…

I have low self esteem and my defence would be because of that..

If your not ready to grow - your not ready…

Pushing won’t help!!!

Just have to stick it out: being a understanding person makes you deal with a whole lot of sh*t..

Purpose being I get the defensive when my mothers to lazy or ill to do errands… she pushes 50% that’s probably enough to see her growing but she isn’t the most forward thinking person ( grouping items so less having to go out and run around) bulk buying.. unnecessary situations or buying - leaving her without.. I’m the same I spend spend and wonder where my moneys gone but lessons are already there and the change will become…little by little it will become inconvenient..

And it does- so it kinda sorts it’s self out..
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  #3  
Old 04-08-2022, 06:34 PM
asearcher
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I understand LostSoul13, can't be easy.

I found this article, page, title: Defensiveness is killing your relationships. Here's an excerpt of it:

"How to Deal With Your and Other People’s Defensive Behavior

Dealing with defensive behavior can be complex and exhausting because it’s hard to separate a person from their behavior or the situation. And as mentioned earlier, some people’s defensiveness is so deeply rooted in their behavioral patterns that there is little realistic chance they will permanently change. However, there are some helpful strategies we can use to deal with our own defensiveness and that of others:

Re-frame the behavior – Rather than label a person’s defensive behavior as bad, understand it for what it is – defensive. Once you understand it as defensive, then you can explore why the person is feeling threatened and work to address the threat(s). One of the reasons we get so frustrated with defensive people is we try to deal with the behavior without addressing the threat that is causing the behavior.
Reduce the danger – Once you’ve identified the threat(s) causing the defensive behavior, work to reduce the perceived danger. Be moderate in your tone, even-tempered, empathize with their concerns, be respectful, and respond non-defensively to avoid escalating tensions.
Develop self-awareness and emotional intelligence – Self-awareness is the foundation of emotional intelligence. Through self-improvement, counseling, training, or mentoring, explore the causes of your defensive behavior. What are the triggers that make you feel threatened? Having a better understanding of yourself will not only help you regulate your own behavior, it will give you better insight into the behavior of others as well.
Replace negative feedback with questions or offers to help – If you have to regularly deal with someone who reacts defensively, you’ve probably noticed that the slightest bit of negative feedback sets them off. Try replacing the negative feedback with a question or an offer to help. For example, instead of saying “Sally, you made a mistake on this report,” rephrase it by saying “Sally, I’m not sure I understand this section on the report. Could you help me figure it out?” Remember, a person acts defensively because he/she perceives a threat. Try to make the situation non-threatening.
Move from dogmatism to openness – The less people feel boxed in to either/or, yes/no, right/wrong choices, the less threatening the situation. Of course there are times where things need to be done a specific way, but if you approach the situation with a spirit and attitude of openness rather than “my way or the highway,” you’ll get a more open response.
Treat people as equals – Approach other people in a collaborative manner, looking for ways to help them win in the situation. Take time to identify and recognize their needs, discover what’s important to them, and validate their concerns.

Defensiveness destroys relationships from the inside-out. It creates a climate of contention and tension that eventually leads to a loss of trust, alienation, and separation. The opposite of defensiveness, openness, creates an atmosphere of freedom, growth, respect and trust. Identifying the root of defensiveness in our relationships, and working toward addressing and removing those issues, will help improve the overall quality of our relationships and the productivity of our teams and organizations.

by @RandyConley"

:)
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  #4  
Old 04-08-2022, 07:11 PM
lostsoul13 lostsoul13 is offline
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It’s a good quote- that’s what I was talking about defusing the situation…

But they might feel victimised..
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  #5  
Old 06-08-2022, 04:41 AM
asearcher
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yes

I can fully understand taking defense if, when you're being disrespected to at the every beginning of an argument, fight, if let's say the person want to take advantage of your "disability" or what it now may be, and try to boost up themselves by stepping on you for some reason that is not the real reason why the argument etc is about.

When I see that people try to come to others or me in a patronizing way in real life I look them straight in the eye and I keep it there. I keep it no matter what. That is us saying we're still equal here, and I keep my voice steady and I'm assertive. I don't yell. I know that when I have talked with the individual in my life who always took defense that I did that with but I suppose even that made him feel as if he was inferior to me.

When I'm hurt etc I have not been someone who would come up to the other one with tears in my eyes and so on, he says I always look as if I could kill him (my eyes alone) which used to make it difficult for him to realize behind the anger was the hurt and me feeling humiliated by his actions. My questions were also not so innocent and neutral. It could be something like "Why you asked me to come there in the first place? To humiliate me? What did I ever do to you?" So quick questions, one after another, loaded. As for him I think he could only tell I was hurt,sad or vulnerable if I looked that way to him. Few times over long, long time was he ever seeing tears in my eyes, and then his own would show up, which he said he would never be that "soft" before. I think it had to take that for him to understand before: OK she's actually hurt. Then he would not be someone who took defense but try to make a mends, apologize, wanting to hug while I told him to get out of there. Did not want him to see that, me like that.

When I was in a past relationship with a psychopath I would for the life of me not wanting to show that I was afraid, which I was, but now I know it would not matter as if he truly was a psychopath then he would not recognize what that facial expression etc looked like, but to me it was I think all I had, because I was desperate to keep us equal, as he was trying to be superior. I know there were times he was really pressuring me and I would not back down.
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Old 06-08-2022, 08:42 AM
saurab saurab is offline
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relating to someone is not the same as being in a relationship. Being "in" a relationship means that the person loves drama and the see-saw of emotional ups and downs, even though they may say otherwise.
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  #7  
Old 06-08-2022, 08:42 AM
Izz Izz is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by asearcher
.
When I see that people try to come to others or me in a patronizing way in real life I look them straight in the eye and I keep it there. I keep it no matter what. That is us saying we're still equal here, and I keep my voice steady and I'm assertive.

I know that when I have talked with the individual in my life who always took defense that I did that with but I suppose even that made him feel as if he was inferior to me.

Hello

I think I also understand asearcher. Reminds me of the former friend I told you about

Before the time I cut her off completely - she would be very patronizing and when I needed a few days away off from her patronizing behavior because I was busy with other things happening in my life (funny that it seemed like when she sensed I was having a good time with certain changes, she was resentful) - she took my quiet "assertiveness" as offense

She launched into a full verbal assault. Mocked my issues and goals as unimportant compared to hers, even went as far as mocking something that I shared with her which I thought was sacred - nevermind the toil I did in sharing certain knowledge albeit my limited knowledge just to help her God only knows -- She then used my way of trying to help (I even emphasized to her my knowledge was limited) as a way to shame me. And verbally assaulted about how I wasn't there for her real life issues - because suddenly everything in my life paled in comparison to hers

The nerve of demanding someone for emotional help while patronizing their code identity - can't even check the mirror, I suppose - I honestly wish I didnt give her a chance and let her patronize to a void

I even at some point through enduring her barrage of subtle mockery and insults, felt like she was punishing me for attempting to help her with her "more serious matters in life" as she DEMANDED me to. Like "what did I ever do to you? Why even request, demand, throw a TANTRUM over needing my help when you honestly just see me as an immature, unhinged person lower in structure or whatever compared to your mature and superior self?"

I called her out, she apologized albeit a weak one by saying something like sorry for not being sensitive. Tried to help her again. She still repeated the behavior. I then cut her off permanently, no explanation because that's exactly the right thing to do

People who get by, by patronizing others endlessly, get upset and offended if you react like "no don't patronize me" and then they react back in a sick way as if youre the villain. There's that tone of "how dare you don't accept the place I've given you"

Sorry, maybe went off on a tangent there

Btw asearcher sent you DM. hugs
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  #8  
Old 06-08-2022, 08:58 AM
asearcher
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Yes saurab, good point, you're right
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  #9  
Old 06-08-2022, 09:10 AM
asearcher
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Thanks for sharing, Izz, God yes that sounds terrible, good you have that in your past now. If someone projects out that much for that long who knows when, if they will be able to detect their patronizing is about them and not you or others.

Good too I think you gave concrete example of what it can be like, if someone else is too in your shoes, to see it then for what it was, is.

Last edited by asearcher : 06-08-2022 at 07:12 PM.
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