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Go Back   Spiritual Forums > Spirituality & Beliefs > General Beliefs

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  #761  
Old 11-04-2024, 04:12 PM
AnotherBob AnotherBob is offline
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Join Date: Oct 2014
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zorkchop
Friday April the 12th will be my last post here. LIFE calls me elsewhere.

Thank you sincerely for your efforts, may you prosper in all of your endeavors!

__/\__
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  #762  
Old 11-04-2024, 05:07 PM
zorkchop zorkchop is offline
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Join Date: Apr 2019
Posts: 1,038
 
Thank you, AB

On we goi.

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  #763  
Old 12-04-2024, 12:56 PM
zorkchop zorkchop is offline
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Join Date: Apr 2019
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4-12-24 …

This entire thread is drawing to a close with this post. May you all travel well.

* *- -* *- -* *- -* *


One of the biggest factors in advancement, growth, and discernment by Spirit … both levels … is a passion for learning … *wanting* to know the truth … and the willingness to take the necessary risks to find it.

Wanting to know more of what everyone else knows … is not true advancement. It might pass for it in today’s confused world … but willingness to go bend the masses … stands out.

The human state of consciousness is taught to be skeptical, wary, critical, and an eagerness to obtain goodies … on any and all levels promoted by business, religion, and society. To gather ones independence and individuality to go beyond the masses … is a rarity within the overloaded stance of the masses.

One practice that begins to develop what will forever lead one more deeply into finding the actual, viable Truth is … learning to intentionally investigate and experiment … things that might not “sound” or “seem” to be right or alluring to you … but has the possibility of opening doors beyond where you are at present. *Listening* to those that ate where you wish to be … even if you are reluctant in acknowledging that within yourself … considering what they suggest as a “next step” for you … which is … if they consider such-and-such important and you do not … that should be a red flag … or at least a yellow one … and then gearing up to plug in the new information or stance just to see what happens in your own daily life … in your perspective on life … if it does open a door or two … or helps to slide puzzle pieces into place.

Just quietly accept the suggestion and consider accepting it to the point where you can determine just what results it will lead to … if the viewpoint broadens.

Just … TRY it. Experiment with it. You don’t have to stake your life on it … but you can allow it into your life enough to see if it would be beneficial or not.

Get used to just trying something out to see how it fits … certainly not recklessly … but with an eye towards expansion. People tend to put up such resistance to accepting even the most minor of changes. Why? Find out *why* … for YoU.

Few points that need to be expanded are physically life-threatening. No one needs to know. Just try it and see … and develop as a pattern an eagerness … a curiosity … a passion to grow.

This would be a preliminary step to even revision … where you are going to go in and revise your reactions / responses to become more beneficial. This experimentation stage is before all of this. You can certainly take it inside and play with it … see how it works in the situations and conditions you believe it might be useful.

Let Spirit see that you are eager to at least … try.

Wherever there is greatness to be experienced … preliminary error is just as great. There is no automatic “ascension.” More often than not … what is supposed to lift overall humanity … backfires. Most simply cannot continue the new beliefs and disciplines involved. The “old ways” pull them back.

* *- -* *- -* *- -* *

This being my last post for perhaps a very long time … it will be much longer than usual … and I wish to say again here … every post I have offered … every thread … had more truth in it that many might have wanted to see or believe. If it weren’t true … it would have been a tremendous injustice to LIFE … for which I am unwilling to pay for in karmic implications.

Most every post offered valued opportunity … those were very real. Opportunity is either taken … or lost.Opportunity is to be gained when presented … and not when you just happen to have time. Clarity read and clarity interpreted are two vastly different perceptions. Opportunity is neither ever-present nor ever-lasting. It will appear … and then disappear.

It is always of interest to ponder by anyone … “I had a chance … what did I do with it?”

Greater truth guides someone to live their life according to the Laws of LIFE … to do it right according to the foundations and principles of LIFE … and not necessarily towards what is popular and conventional. True “guidance” does not necessarily make one feel “good” about oneself … only in what has to be done.

You do not become more popular when doing the above … you become less popular … because you are promoting beyond the traditional. You strength and value then come from knowing that you are living Life according to the Law.

People get mad when someone else makes them face themselves. This is why so many point their finger at someone else “making” them act a certain way or do something bad or that they do not want to do. Someone else *makes* them do it and they blame that other person … when it is that other person that is simply showing them to themselves.

The posts that perhaps offended … there was rarely inquiry as to why or what for. Confusion, misinterpretation, and judgement that resulted should have been addressed at the moment. LIFE does not suffer because of your misinterpretation … or because of your passivity in moving forward. Misinterpretations, feuds, dismissals … were launched and continued without inquiry and clarification.

A few members preferred such reactions … grudges, feuds, and misinterpretations. LIFE took notice of those who resisted, dismissed and rejected … more than most might believe. Most people enjoy being unaware. It dismisses the responsibility of being right.

Those who considered these posts as simply another “opinion” … know too that development of discernment comes slowly. Choice … has more value … than most wish to believe. It is neither no ones loss but their own that posts and points were misinterpreted or dismissed. No one is responsible for what another may misunderstand.

It will be easy to dismiss all that I say in this last post as the ravings of the ego. Please feel free to do so.

Valued advancement does not come by way of social popularity or personal demands of the way it should be presented. Advancement does not come by personal near-sightedness. Neither does it come by waiting for it to happen.

You have to make your own advancement … and this does not come through continuous juggling of mental opinions. If you cannot discern greater from lesser truth … then let that be your goal from this point on. ALL information is not of equal value.

Wherever there is greatness … great error is also to be found.

If the information is of the popular … the conventional / traditional … you will remain in that realm. If the information is of the individual … there is a distinct difference … that can be seen … if the single eye is interested in it … and not the double vision of the physical body experience.

From administrator, to moderator, to long / short-term members … it is *your* job to find the way forward. It is *not* the job of LIFE to *make* you discover it. It is *your* discovery to design and make. That is the prime goal of anyone and everyone … myself included.

You mostly end up looking for information that will make you feel good about yourself … and where you are. That is finally replaced by wanting to answer the questions that have perplexed mankind forever … you wish to finally answer the mysteries … with a perspective that is valid … and beyond the conventional … a perspective that holds … that is eternal. This is not found by mind.

In the end … knowing your weaknesses is of much greater value than knowing your strengths. Many things are pointed out to most of us … but we refuse to see them. As the old Beatles song suggested … “Living is easy with eyes closed … misunderstanding all we see / know.” Of the human experience … this is very true.

As reported earlier … LIFE calls me elsewhere. For the foreseeable future … this closes this thread. I hope to return … but when … I cannot say.

With this … I will make my exit and say goodbye.

Zork
4-12-24

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  #764  
Old 03-05-2024, 03:19 PM
HITESH SHAH HITESH SHAH is offline
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Join Date: Apr 2019
Posts: 1,353
 
sabbatical leave

Quote:
Originally Posted by zorkchop
4-8-24 …

I am heading out of state this coming weekend to participate in some projects that the remaining members of my family are involved with. Demands on my time will be elsewhere. It will be at least two to three months … and perhaps a *lot* more … before I will be able to return … if and when I can.
* *- -* *- -* *- -* *

While we miss you and your esoteric whispering during your sabbatical leave and I am probably very late to wish , we wish you have good time and come back with much more vigor and fervor.

Wish a very great time ahead
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  #765  
Old 05-05-2024, 01:33 AM
JoeColo JoeColo is offline
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Join Date: Dec 2020
Location: Colorado, U.S.A.
Posts: 138
 
I've visited this thread occasionally, will miss being able to come here to see new posts. Surprising to me, I see that this thread has in number of posts surpassed your other thread, zorkchop, Body, Emotions Mind ... and Beyond. (BEMB)

Which btw can be found just below halfway down on Page 7. The indexes, on pp. 37 & 50, are very helpful to find info about specific subjects.

JoeColo
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  #766  
Old 10-06-2024, 01:05 PM
zorkchop zorkchop is offline
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Join Date: Apr 2019
Posts: 1,038
 
6-10-24 …

Hello to all …

Family projects are on short-term hold … waiting for some family members to complete and fulfill their documents and personal stands. I am back home for two weeks and will try to get some new posts in during my time here.

I am amazed to see that there has been over 50,000 views on Whisperings since I have left … give or take a few hundred or so. That is astounding. Yes … there is a lot of information in those posts of the past and the information for the most part is timeless … applicable no matter where one is on the path. Hitesh Shah and JoeColo … thank you for the kind remarks. Yes … I check on the BEMB thread occasionally and watch the view go up.

That entire thread ended sadly when a handful of forum members drew accusatory judgements on a few of the last posts without ever asking the “why” or “what for” of those posts. Without clarification … their assessments were understandable and certainly valid according to their viewpoints. They felt qualified to assess without knowing the full story … the “behind-the-scenes” aspects. It is a stance favored by many … to accuse on only a half-story or misunderstanding.

In years and decades past … I have been caught up in enough of these “misinterpretations and assessments” and now lean much more towards the approach of asking questions … for various reasons and towards various ends … to determine why a person did or said what they did … before drawing conclusions. In today’s world … this is *not* a common approach to use.

I am somewhat surprised by Miss Hepburn’s bringing the old BEMB thread forward to the current page. It ran its course … and I would have preferred that it had stayed where it was. “Whisperings” has simplified and brought more focus into specific areas of interest. People know that BEMB exists now … for those who didn’t know. If possible … I would ask that Miss Hepburn return it to page 7 … or wherever it was.

Lessons are everywhere … even in the most innocent of reactions. I have mentioned many times that the Negative Forces will mislead individuals to compel them to maintain and deepen current limitations. So many believe that “Life” is hard enough and few have any real idea how much “life” is directed to keep and maintain their current limitations and traps intact … to keep them from growing or advancing. To say that one of the “jobs” of the Negative Forces is to keep Soul Itself trapped within the Lower Psychic / Metaphysical Worlds by any means available or necessary … is an understatement … but it seems to take forever for this statement to be accepted as valid within anyone. Most just dismiss it all as the “ups and downs” of life … and let it go at that.

No one ever said the path was “easy.” The old statement that “Truth is simple but not easy” is valid. The simplicity of actual truth is shocking … and old mental patterns and habits finds the simplicity exceptionally suspicious … leading to almost instant disbelief. The “basics” of actual … advanced … foundational … stable and unchanging Truth is simple … but the mind complicates … the minds demands that there has to be “more” to the basic principles … and so … the tangents, the variations, the “maybes”, the “how about’s … “, the “what if’s” … are given birth … all in the hopes of finally understanding the simple by making it more complicated … more analysis … more dissection … more definition by developing “new” words or phrases to explain what old words failed to adequately portray … to the habitual mental patterns. Without a doubt … mind is the greatest tool given to Soul Itself to understand what is going on around It ( Soul ) depending on where It ( Soul ) is at the moment. The old principle of “the greater the tool when used correctly holds again to the opposite” … meaning … the more it misleads when used incorrectly” … is valid and true. This discovery is left to the individual in their own time, place, and effort.

I will try to get in another few posts before I must again travel south and my time must again be focused elsewhere. This “return” will be *very* short … hopefully a couple of weeks.

On we go. More tomorrow.

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  #767  
Old 11-06-2024, 01:01 PM
zorkchop zorkchop is offline
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Join Date: Apr 2019
Posts: 1,038
 
6-11-24 …

Two recent forum posts re of note. Commentary for both will be short and sweet. I do not have the time to elaborate further.

One … “knowing self as consciousness” … is multi-faceted. An example … “you” stand on the front doorstep of your house / apartment. “YoU” … as “YoU” stand there … will have to accept the multiple definitions of just what this “YoU” is … a dreamer / observer / viewer / undefined something … or … Soul Itself encased in Lower Psychic / Metaphysical Worlds bodies … the identification of which is mostly the reason for “the path” in the first place.

But “You” … ultimately step inside your house / apartment … and now “YoU” have entered your current living environment … which is your consciousness … what you believe to be true for the current lifetime … how you will view it … etc. The colors on the walls, the furniture, the desks, the bookshelves and the books on them, the various rooms and what is in each room … what’s in the drawers … what’s in the closets … kitchen cupboards and drawers and what’s in them … etc. ALL of these choices were made by “YoU” … and this is *how you are living / viewing it* … and not “who you are” … Soul Itself unknowingly viewing through the Lower Psychic / Metaphysical Worlds bodies … thus … the multi-faceted layer of this query.

All the beliefs / values / opinions / facts / figures / morals / values / ethics / capabilities / etc … is the landscape of your consciousness.

You know who “YoU” are by viewing “where and how” “YoU” live at the moment … although this rarely takes into account just what “you” is. But in these worlds … you “view” or accept yourself as a man by knowing your manners / ethics / morals / values towards others as a man … equally true of all females. How “YoU” view, approach, understand, and interact with all around “YoU” … is what “YoU” are living at the moment … and simple “awareness” will answer these queries. Why you have made such choices to live this way “YoU” may never know for sure. Thousands of lifetimes ago … “YoU” took part in setting these patterns into place.

The best approach?

Deal with NoW. The “why” makes little difference … all that “YoU” have ever been … is viewable NoW. Do your best to deal with that. Let the past remain the past … just try not to repeat or perpetuate it.

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The second interesting query was the question of “I AM.”

Many will have great difficulty in coming to terms with this because they will want to define the “ I “ totally as ego … which is not quite right at all … but is popular to hold to … and leads to all sorts of subsequent internal issues. Soul Itself is created as an individual “unit” of LIFE … or Existence … and has full ability to know Self as Soul Itself … but first has to scratch Its way out of the Lower Psychic / Metaphysical Worlds … where mind / emotions / body leads each individual off onto andante tangents that will tie them up forever.

The “I AM that I AM” … is merely a declaration of the “IS-ness” of God. No one at the time that phrase was offered … and few even today … can fully accept that God just … IS. Try to leave it t that. God … Exists.

The True Core Creator God does not “reside” within the Lower Psychic / Metaphysical Worlds … so when we try to incorporate this “God” or “Existence” into the worlds … we step into a mis-definition … a trap … that will last for more lifetimes than you would care to discover.

Each of us lives by the principle of “I am … “ whatever … or however. Everything you accept as true about yourself and the world about you … is accept through the principle of “I am this” or “I am that” … or “I am NOT this or that.” Other words maybe used to hold to this same principle … such as “I believe so-and-so” or “I don’t like this-or-that” or “Why do I do this-or-that” … etc x whatever number you wish to put on this concept.

The whole principle is based on identification … “What am I” … and more specifically … “What do I believe myself to be … ” … perhaps “What do I accept as true within my understanding at the moment” … and continues to branch from there. Many wish to kill off identification … and that’s a great adventure. Soul Itself was not created to be the most powerful single creation in all of Existence for the purpose of accepting Self as a total blank floating through Existence … unknowing / incapable of just what that self-identification is … but … telling Itself ( Soul Itself ) that it’s impossible to understand … it’s a popular approach that mind will take part in as it tries to “kill off” all that it ( mind ) doesn’t understand.

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Both of these queries are encountered by all at one time or another. Any individual can live for many, many lifetimes within each … or both. There is no criticism here … nor judgement. This is the same as encountering heavy physics or the medical studies of a doctor or of that of a lawyer … or any other deep, involving study in our educational systems. Levels of learning and ability are everywhere.

We make it as simple or as complicated as we wish … with mind being the main manipulator of our understanding.

More tomorrow.

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  #768  
Old 12-06-2024, 12:57 PM
zorkchop zorkchop is offline
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Join Date: Apr 2019
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6-12-24 …

In the Pure God Worlds … in an “area” or “level” that is *very* high indeed … just a touch below where Divine Spirit is created … is the region where Soul Itself is created … each given individuality … not separation … but an individual distinction … and the very basic or fledgling Soul Itself could be understood to simply be an eye … with ears. In other words … Soul Itself can “see” and “hear” … a visual viewpoint that can hear … and is given the ability to choose what it views and hears. Though there is a bit more to Soul Itself … this is the fundamentals of us all … in any of the worlds of Existence. In other words … Soul Itself does not automatically see or "know" … anything.

This simply means … that whatever you are living now … YoU have learned and chosen to do so … knowingly on not. Any stance … any position … any belief … any situation, condition, or experience is more than likely a result / effect of an action you initiated … and now … within these Lower Psychic / Metaphysical Worlds … must learn the effects and responsibilities of these actions / choices. In other words … Soul Itself is created to be “Cause” … to set situations / conditions / experiences into motion by focusing It’s viewpoint into the resulting action … “Effect” … and then It ( Soul Itself ) lives the results … effects. Use action / reaction if you wish.

The Lower Psychic / Metaphysical Worlds are worlds of opposites … highs / lows … good / bad … right / wrong … etc forever … and are based solely on our perception of what is happening to us … more often than not because of the society / culture / world we are born into at the moment … and the beliefs we bring with us into our current lifetime. These worlds of “duality” are *not* illusionary to those that are living within them at the moment. A bullet from a gun is not illusionary to the physical body. The fact that the physical body may be “illusionary” to Soul Itself is quite another perspective … but the principle decree is to understand how all of these Lower Psychic / Metaphysical Worlds facets work together … and for what purpose … how to understand them and use them as intended … and it is *not* how many of them can we dismiss as “unreal” and needless that is the goal to be found.

A schoolroom / schoolhouse is authentic and real … whether we agree to its lessons or manners of teaching … or not.

Since EVERY-thing must be learned … every little detail … every little “why” and “wherefore” and “how come” … mostly by trial-and-error … it is the advanced student that can begin to take charge of their own actions and reactions to somewhat speed-up personal growth. Most just let LIFE hammer them on the head until they are almost forced unwillingly to learn the lessons involved. Taking charge of all of this … eases the hardships and struggles of the Lower Psychic / Metaphysical Worlds … whether one wishes to acknowledge that struggles are real or not.

Common discussion sometimes revolves around the dreamer vs the dream … what is real … what isn’t. What you personally *see* … during a dream at night or during any out-of-the-body experience … IS real … at the level it is being experienced. Your dreams are *your* experiences in the other dimensions / planes. Even here in the physical … what you see and hear around you during daily interaction still involves the emotions ( astral ) you use to interpret it … the habitual mental patterns ( mind ) you would hold to here in your reactions … but it is all “based” in the physical because you are aware of the physical. Take the physical out of it while dreaming … and it’s pretty much the same thing … until you move above the astral by letting go of emotional responses … and then you are holding to the preferred mental patterns.

Dreams are *not* some random firing of neurons … as scientists love to declare. The human brain does not “see and hear” on its own. Something must be directing the individual attention … and that central focus is Soul Itself … sidetracked by the preferred emotions and mental patterns … using the Lower Psychic / Metaphysical Worlds bodies to do so … since Soul Itself has never experienced Itself in a pure form since It’s individual creation. That … is the purpose of the schoolroom.

And since mental interpretations have been the only approach of all but a few … it’s no wonder that we all tend to hold to our mental patterns. It’s all we have ever known … refined by the many, many lifetimes and sets of experiences.

More tomorrow.

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  #769  
Old 13-06-2024, 09:46 AM
hazada guess hazada guess is offline
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Join Date: May 2022
Posts: 681
 
Excellent zorkchop.


PS Welcome back,even though it only for a brief time.(very much like me).
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  #770  
Old 13-06-2024, 12:53 PM
zorkchop zorkchop is offline
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Join Date: Apr 2019
Posts: 1,038
 
6-13-24 …

* *- -* *- -* *- -* *

Hazada … thanks … it’s nice to be back. The family is already clamoring for my return but I’m going to stretch my stay here out through next week.

* *- -* *- -* *- -* *

One foundational principle any serious student that wishes to get into the advanced teachings needs to learn is … it is not so much a matter of seeing new “landscapes” with either or both of your “visions” … as mind always wishes to find something “new” to consider … but it is a matter of seeing with new eyes … setting the “old” aside and disciplining the mind to agree to do that … while you “learn” the vision of Soul Itself to “see” whats beyond the Lower Psychic / Metaphysical Worlds. You will not … and cannot … see beyond the Lower Psychic / Metaphysical Worlds with mind. Mind cannot see beyond itself no matter what it would like to believe and claim. It is very common for mind to simply claim that “I am experiencing non-duality … ( the Pure God Worlds ) … when it ( mind ) … is just slowing everything down to a stillness that it has been seeking forever … or perhaps it ( mind ) has stepped into a void … of which there are many. Learning what is beyond mind … is NOT what mind wishes to do.

This is *not* just words. Most everyone on the board is familiar enough with alcohol and substance abuse to know that when you are completely immersed within either … or both … you cannot “see” beyond that stance … you cannot “see” what and how it is to be without drugs or alcohol … you might interact with a few people that are “straight” but your whole world is colored by your immersion which keeps you from fully knowing what it is to be sober, etc.

It is the same with walking the Lower Psychic / Metaphysical Worlds … mind, body, emotions … and never knowing what the “Pure” worlds are like. You’ve never been there … so how could you know … yet mind will work hard to convince you it is more than reasonable to mentally understand the Whole of Existence … when it ( mind ) cannot.

This is why … once you have been trained enough by someone who has “been” there and whose job it is to lead those who are ready to walk into those worlds … which is the job of the authentic Master … it is only *then* that you can recognize what you’ve been up against all those many, many lifetimes. Before you make that step … mind has no chance of “knowing” the full extent of Existence … no matter what it claims or is led to believe.

You live within these Lower Psychic / Metaphysical Worlds … you have known nothing other than these worlds … you can claim that EVERY-thing is an illusion and it will not help you at all. The “suggestion” or revelation or claim that certain aspects of experience here is an “illusion” was *not* meant to be all-inclusive. Mind will happily hold to it being so … so it can dump anything that it doesn’t understand into the category of “illusion” so it can then believe it doesn’t have to deal with / understand it.

Wrong !

Various aspects of experience here are *not* illusionary so you can dismiss them. The concept of “it is an illusion” was meant for a very specific factor when dealing with these worlds … but mind saw its opening and wants to apply it to as much as possible so it ( mind) can not be bothered / concerned with it. Mind will simply dismiss it as unimportant … because it is an mental “illusion” …

You will slowly come to find that true advancement does not come by way of the statements and phrases you uncover … via some knowledgable individual, guru, intellectual adept … who has offered some familiar concepts and you have found recognition and warm feelings / resonance within those words. You will more often than not find that true advancement comes by way of you making a step beyond your comfort zone … stepping beyond what you usually do … applying yourself in just a slightly but noticeably different angle or degree or way … than you have always used or come up to in the past. Applying the knowledge … the statement … applying the awareness … and finding that it is a door that opens to new … previously unknown or un-practiced viewpoints and approaches.

By you taking this unfamiliar step … you go beyond your state of consciousness … and gain … enlarge … hopefully rise … although you can use the same approach to lose … or go downhill.

“Moving beyond” anything … religion / philosophy / work place / relationship / general belief … you do not have to ridicule / disapprove / condemn / or become resentful of anything … no more than becoming resentful of basic math after discovering physics. All adds to the whole of your individual experience … you build upon each step … and the feeling that you may not have “liked” something means little. That “feeling” will work against you more than just moving beyond a previous stance.

You advance … by walking into the greater. When you allow the old phrases / beliefs to pull you back … the advancement is often lost. Each level of advancement nudges you to find replacement support phrases, beliefs, and stances. You constantly build.

Yes … there are many, many lifetimes when each wishes to simply ride what they believe … and let it go at that. To “just get by” and little else. For those that wish to “go beyond” … it takes decided effort. With discipline and training … you are able to “see” … anything. You are not responsible for anyone else’s viewpoint … only your own. The path is an individual one … as you walk more and more into the Whole of Existence.

The statement that you are responsible only for your own viewpoint is obviously *not* a popular approach. We feel we can jam on anyone to manipulate how they view and believe … hence … karmic implications are set in motion that will be balanced … somewhere … sometime … somehow … between both ( or more ) parties.

More tomorrow.

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