Non Duality and Spiritual Bypassing ?

[Joe Mc]

This idea or topic is not new especially within Non Duality and Neo Advaita. Although it is a perennial problem, I haven’t seen anyone tackle it in quite awhile, its as if folks realised the gravity of saying that the majority of spiritual enquirants are bypassing psychological trauma in favour of a collection of attitudes and spiritual sayings connected to Non Duality and preferred to steer clear of such a convoluted subject.

I have a strong feeling this morning that our woundedness, in all its many forms and guises often bars the way to the spiritual treasures that we seek. We can dismiss our psychological and traumatic wounds at our own peril and expense. On the other hand, I can see the therapeutic thread milling and money making of course that goes on to clear away this woundedness. So just in that light alone who can blame people making a bolt for the centre of their own beings and hearts in the hope to resolve the suffering that the world has often visited upon them?

Just putting it out there. Any views on this ? Joe.

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[iamthat]

This raises a good point.

What is the purpose of spiritual enquiry? Perhaps to discover the nature of Consciousness and to become a clear expression of Consciousness on the physical plane.

What stands in our way? Amongst other things, our unhealed psychological traumas. There are many examples of spiritual enquirers who become teachers without having healed their own wounds. This does not usually end well, although it provides much learning for everyone involved.

But healing our psychological traumas can be a long slow process, perhaps a lifetime's work. If we all waited to become whole and healed before engaging in spiritual enquiry we might never embark on such enquiry.

I see spiritual enquiry and self-healing as going hand-in-hand. Spiritual practices are not an escape from our issues. Spiritual practices usually involve some level of introspection, and we are forced to deal with whatever lies within.

Some Advaitists may argue that all psychological trauma is just part of the illusion and has no real existence, and therefore does not require healing. This is fine on an intellectual level, but I prefer to consider myself a practical Advaitist. If I have to function through a human form then that human form may as well be whole and healed.

There is the idea that genuine practices involve the descent of spiritual energy into the human form. The pressure of such spiritual energy pushes everything to the surface to be released. Which is one reason why the spiritual journey is so difficult. We may want to bolt to the centre of our own beings and hearts to bypass all our issues, but at some stage we have to deal with all of it.

Peace

[Joe Mc]

Originally Posted by iamthat

This raises a good point.

What is the purpose of spiritual enquiry? Perhaps to discover the nature of Consciousness and to become a clear expression of Consciousness on the physical plane Peace

Thank you for your reflections on this subject. I agree with everything you write here and your post is sobering and inspiring as well. You reminded me that the Spiritual Path is no cake walk because of various traumas that we all have suffered but despite the suffering or trauma, it seems that love is very powerful and once experienced, especially at a spiritual level, leaves an impression that impels us to take up our staff and bundle and journey.

Isn't there an Indian analogy which says that once we have entered the Spiritual Path, it is like placing your head inside a tiger's jaws and it cannot be removed !

The stories of fallen Gurus etc. has become very widespread now and it definitely harkens us back to what it is to become more mature psychologically. To know there are no free lunches, if that is not being too crude and that with pleasure and power comes responsibility. Thanks once again. Joe.

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[iamthat]

Originally Posted by Joe Mc

...despite the suffering or trauma, it seems that love is very powerful and once experienced, especially at a spiritual level, leaves an impression that impels us to take up our staff and bundle and journey.

Isn't there an Indian analogy which says that once we have entered the Spiritual Path, it is like placing your head inside a tiger's jaws and it cannot be removed !

Indeed. I like that. Once we are on the journey then something within impels us to keep going. Occasionally we may sit down and rest, occasionally we may go on a detour, but we cannot ignore this inner impulse for too long.

And it can be a very uncomfortable journey. In my younger days when I struggled with so many aspects of the "spiritual" life I would sometimes look at people who seemed quite content with their everyday lives and envy them, because their heads were not in the tiger's jaws, so to speak.

But it is all worth it.

Peace

[Joe Mc]

Originally Posted by iamthat

Indeed. I like that. Once we are on the journey then something within impels us to keep going. Occasionally we may sit down and rest, occasionally we may go on a detour, but we cannot ignore this inner impulse for too long.
Peace

Yes that's for sure. It's difficult to stay on track, even a monk or an ascetic probably can't always stay on track especially during his early learning phase. I remember one time ..someone becoming obsessed with someone's else's beautiful pair of sandals in a Hare Krsna retreat centre. I think they eventually stole them such was the allure of those sandals ! !!

It sounds like that after you got over your flashes of envy of 'worldly' peoples lifestyles that you learned to wear the robe of spirituality well. I remember this too, perhaps a little different of course, but before the age of the internet you felt as if you were swimming against the tide or going against the grain when you practiced a spiritual path etc. Perhaps spirituality had more of an edge back then. it seems nowadays everybody on social media etc. is posting and copying spiritual aphorisms ad infinitum. Perhaps its not such a bad thing but you feel the embodiment is not always there.

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Originally Posted by Joe Mc

its as if folks realised the gravity of saying that the majority of spiritual enquirants are bypassing psychological trauma in favour of a collection of attitudes and spiritual sayings connected to Non Duality

Frankly, it's all bonkers. Non-Duality IS Duality, the mind creates Duality in the first place then attempts to resolve the paradox it has created by creating another 'layer' of Duality/paradox. There is either no Duality to begin with - Advaita Vedanta's 'Not Two' - or there is Triality - which is three. If you're going to stay with Duality vs non-Duality then psychological vs Spiritual is Duality. Everybody has a lot to say about consciousness but forget that in the dichotomy - not Duality - it becomes emergent. That's the third 'component'.

Psychology is the 'framework' of one's Spirituality, but then how many self-ware Spiritual people are aware of that?

What the majority of Spiritual people don't want to understand is that the ancients didn't have a word for psychology because they didn't see it as something apart from their religion/philosophy. Jung based his model of the ego on the Ahamkara and his model of the self on the Atman. Jung was a scholar of Advaita Vedanta and gained much credibility from the higher echelons of the Spiritual world because of his work.

If you're going to talk about so-called non-Duality then perhaps the subject of ignorance/denial being Spiritual enlightenment would be interesting.

[Joe Mc]

First thing that sprung to mind reading your post is the idea of a framework such as Duality - Non Duality or other frameworks Atman –Brahman, The Absolute and the Relative etc. etc. And it made me think perhaps people might be best served using other belief systems or Frameworks rather than Duality/Non Duality ? The spin I pick up from the Non Duality movement is that things can be put to bed quite quickly you can gain realisation in a short space of time… and it is often put across as some kind of final and definitive thing from which you will never look back.

However true that may be there is such a thing as guilt for example to varying degrees. Not sure what the study on this is though but I would wager a bet that this concept is inherent in human beings from birth. One Non Duality teacher whom I deeply respect says that we can never leave a blemish upon the Non Dual state, it’s impossible but I would say we can leave a blemish imagined or otherwise upon our mind. It seems to me we are charged somehow to work with our minds too even if it is just be aware of the mind's thoughts and emotions ?

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Originally Posted by Joe Mc

First thing that sprung to mind reading your post is the idea of a framework such as Duality - Non Duality or other frameworks Atman –Brahman, The Absolute and the Relative etc. etc.

There is no Duality, it was created by the Ahamkara/ego, which is differentiated consciousness. The one and only inherent attribute anything has is Isness, the rest is a kara or 'invention'. Duality is binary thinking - 'this' vs 'that'. If there is Oneness then there is no Duality.

The Absolute only exists because of Relative, Atman only exists by virtue of Brahman, love and hate are the same emotion, dark is the inability of our human eyes to perceive light..... Every example of Duality can be resolved in the same way.

Out of the so-called Duality comes consciousness. In the space of Absolute and Relative we are conscious so that's three, not two. The Pre-Taoist Alchemists called it Triplex Unity, it's been called Triality, Triune nature, Trinity.... 1+1=3, can't anyone count?

The best way to achieve a so-called non-Dual state is to not create it in the first place.

A very wise woman once told me that it's as bad to take offence as it is to give it. Buddha also said that we should question everything including what he says, so if we are not questioning the reasons we do things?

[Joe Mc]

Originally Posted by Greenslade

... 1+1=3, can't anyone count?

This is a useful pointer for me, seems closer to the truth speaking from experience. So I've had experiences of were you couldn't say light exists nor darkness exists etc. but both existed at the same time, stuff like that so yes. 1+1 = 2 seems a given in our world that people live and die by. I came across this quote the otherday.

"My thoughts are nothing like your thoughts," says the Lord. " And my ways are far beyond anything you could imagine. " - Isiah 55.8

I am not a reader or subscriber to the Old or New Testaments btw. But there does come a point or certain times perhaps for a period of time where you have to stop trying to describe these things Why ? Because you can't. Regards, Joe.

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