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  #1  
Old 09-02-2016, 07:36 AM
Gem Gem is offline
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Which me is me?

I took this idea from Echart Tolle's autobiographical account of his experience of going from deep depression and suicidal thoughts to a life of happiness in less than a day.

This is what he describes

“I cannot live with myself any longer.” This was the thought that kept repeating itself in my mind. Then suddenly I became aware of what a peculiar thought it was. “Am I one or two? If I cannot live with myself, there must be two of me: the ‘I’ and the ‘self’ that ‘I’ cannot live with.” “Maybe,” I thought, “only one of them is real” (http://ir.nmu.org.ua/bitstream/handl...pdf?sequence=1). (Audio book: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pexwgk6pabQ)

Discuss.
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  #2  
Old 09-02-2016, 08:33 AM
vespa68 vespa68 is offline
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It definately was not in a day. There are many steps involved in letting your higher self take over but he could not explain all that in a book. I did like his book however because he did explain how things work but its not so easy as he says. He is talking about facing fears, facing oneslef to find the highest truth of who you are. This takes a long time and what he describes was only the first time it happened to him. But belive me he had much further to go along.

Not sure I undrrstood your title by the way.
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  #3  
Old 09-02-2016, 10:53 AM
Gem Gem is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vespa68
It definately was not in a day. There are many steps involved in letting your higher self take over but he could not explain all that in a book. I did like his book however because he did explain how things work but its not so easy as he says. He is talking about facing fears, facing oneslef to find the highest truth of who you are. This takes a long time and what he describes was only the first time it happened to him. But belive me he had much further to go along.

Not sure I undrrstood your title by the way.

The title is explained in this sentence:

If I cannot live with myself, there must be two of me: the ‘I’ and the ‘self’ that ‘I’ cannot live with.” “Maybe,” I thought, “only one of them is real”.

He claims there was an overnight transformation from the night before, which is described in the the quote in the OP.
The next morning he describes as:

I was awakened by the chirping of a bird outside the window. I had never heard such a sound before. My eyes were still closed, and I saw the image of a precious diamond. Yes, if a diamond could make a sound, this is what it would be like. I opened my eyes. The first light of dawn was filtering through the curtains. Without any thought, I felt, I knew, that there is infinitely more to light than we realize. That soft luminosity filtering through the curtains was love itself. Tears came into my eyes. I got up and walked around the room. I recognized the room, and yet I knew that I had never truly seen it before. Everything was fresh and pristine, as if it had just come into existence. I picked up things, a pencil, an empty bottle, marveling at the beauty and aliveness of it all. That day I walked around the city in utter amazement at the miracle of life on earth, as if I had just been born into this world.

Tolle describes the whole episode on page 8 (highlighted in yellow) on the pdf here:
(http://ir.nmu.org.ua/bitstream/handl...pdf?sequence=1)
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  #4  
Old 09-02-2016, 11:00 AM
naturesflow naturesflow is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gem
I took this idea from Echart Tolle's autobiographical account of his experience of going from deep depression and suicidal thoughts to a life of happiness in less than a day.

This is what he describes

“I cannot live with myself any longer.” This was the thought that kept repeating itself in my mind. Then suddenly I became aware of what a peculiar thought it was. “Am I one or two? If I cannot live with myself, there must be two of me: the ‘I’ and the ‘self’ that ‘I’ cannot live with.” “Maybe,” I thought, “only one of them is real” (http://ir.nmu.org.ua/bitstream/handl...pdf?sequence=1). (Audio book: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pexwgk6pabQ)

Discuss.

I haven't read his autobiography and didn't realize this about him.

In this realization, I can see how that kind of shift and awareness can reveal itself simply by speaking the way he was to himself. Some might deem this as negative self talk leading to wanting to die, but in fact it was leading him to end his own separation and the point of *surrender* in training his mind to not want to live with himself any longer, opened the self he could live with.. I guess his separation/depression/willingness to give up, took him *deep* enough to open a gateway of awareness spontaneously which is not uncommon for people who are deep in depression and have lost the will to live. The pain body I imagine has consumed them to a point where the true self takes over. A point of surrender as I call it. Or as I use to have noted it at times, kind of like a bridge within, where you actually cross over from the pain body and open awareness of the real you.
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Gods one and only voice are Silence. ~ Herman Melville

Man has learned how to challenge both Nature and art to become the incitements to vice! His very cups he has delighted to engrave with libidinous subjects, and he takes pleasure in drinking from vessels of obscene form! Pliny the Elder
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Old 09-02-2016, 11:07 AM
naturesflow naturesflow is offline
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Actually I may have read it in the power of now. Reading your other extract I think I read that in this book.
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Gods one and only voice are Silence. ~ Herman Melville

Man has learned how to challenge both Nature and art to become the incitements to vice! His very cups he has delighted to engrave with libidinous subjects, and he takes pleasure in drinking from vessels of obscene form! Pliny the Elder
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  #6  
Old 09-02-2016, 12:28 PM
Gem Gem is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by naturesflow
Actually I may have read it in the power of now. Reading your other extract I think I read that in this book.

All the quotes are from The Power of Now. I linked a pdf of it, and the audio book read by Tolle himself, in the OP.

I was really trying to focus on his turning point, where he was so depressed and suicidal, and then he came across that question:

I cannot live with myself any longer. This was the thought that kept repeating itself in my mind. Then suddenly I became aware of what a peculiar thought it was. Am I one or two?"
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  #7  
Old 09-02-2016, 12:33 PM
Lorelyen Lorelyen is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by naturesflow
Actually I may have read it in the power of now. Reading your other extract I think I read that in this book.

It can happen to us all. I was a teenage were-gerbil until I discovered condensed milk and I was instantly transmogrified.



Well, not so far fetched. I started out as a moderately abused rebel, hating my parents. I was placed with new parents and even now am surprised at how quickly I slammed the door on that past. The me was bursting to get free and - very luckily - was given the chance. I look back to see only a spiritual prison.
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  #8  
Old 09-02-2016, 12:36 PM
Gem Gem is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by naturesflow
I haven't read his autobiography and didn't realize this about him.

In this realization, I can see how that kind of shift and awareness can reveal itself simply by speaking the way he was to himself. Some might deem this as negative self talk leading to wanting to die, but in fact it was leading him to end his own separation and the point of *surrender* in training his mind to not want to live with himself any longer, opened the self he could live with.. I guess his separation/depression/willingness to give up, took him *deep* enough to open a gateway of awareness spontaneously which is not uncommon for people who are deep in depression and have lost the will to live. The pain body I imagine has consumed them to a point where the true self takes over. A point of surrender as I call it. Or as I use to have noted it at times, kind of like a bridge within, where you actually cross over from the pain body and open awareness of the real you.

From that quote I made in my previous post, it seems to me that he lived as a person broken into two halves, 'I' can't live with 'myself'. He then thought, now that is strange; is there two of me? Surely not. It sounds to me like he very suddenly realised that this can't really be true, and it all collapsed on himself. I was never a big fan of Tolle, but I like everything he says, and this question, that turned his life around, is particularly interesting.
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  #9  
Old 09-02-2016, 12:38 PM
naturesflow naturesflow is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gem
All the quotes are from The Power of Now. I linked a pdf of it, and the audio book read by Tolle himself, in the OP.

I was really trying to focus on his turning point, where he was so depressed and suicidal, and then he came across that question:

I cannot live with myself any longer. This was the thought that kept repeating itself in my mind. Then suddenly I became aware of what a peculiar thought it was. Am I one or two?"

Oh ok I didn't open the link more was focused in his words you laid out for us to focus on.

So in your focus what arises to share about this?

My focus was on looking at understanding it from my perspective but I am interested for you to share further your own thoughts on this?
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Gods one and only voice are Silence. ~ Herman Melville

Man has learned how to challenge both Nature and art to become the incitements to vice! His very cups he has delighted to engrave with libidinous subjects, and he takes pleasure in drinking from vessels of obscene form! Pliny the Elder
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  #10  
Old 09-02-2016, 12:43 PM
naturesflow naturesflow is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gem
From that quote I made in my previous post, it seems to me that he lived as a person broken into two halves, 'I' can't live with 'myself'. He then thought, now that is strange; is there two of me? Surely not. It sounds to me like he very suddenly realised that this can't really be true, and it all collapsed on himself. I was never a big fan of Tolle, but I like everything he says, and this question, that turned his life around, is particularly interesting.

Ok I see now. Yes I am with you, it is like he collapsed on himself, I would say I can relate to this personally myself, but not in the way he experienced it of course. I certainly understand how you can shift perspective when you become aware your own self talk in this way, as being something separate to your true self.

He was obviously someone who lead the way in opening up awareness of this in a more faster manifestation process. It shows that the depth of the painbody when you enter it deep enough can trigger a shift to let go or even look more closely at yourself through thought processors.

I mean we are it all and unless you make a connection to move yourself into a new direction with awareness in this way, it can be like being totally consumed by the painbody, which I fully understand.
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Gods one and only voice are Silence. ~ Herman Melville

Man has learned how to challenge both Nature and art to become the incitements to vice! His very cups he has delighted to engrave with libidinous subjects, and he takes pleasure in drinking from vessels of obscene form! Pliny the Elder
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