Enlightenment, attachment and entanglement

[iamthat]

Originally Posted by Starman

...some are born or maybe even most are born, enlightened. Most children, in my opinion are born with divine wisdom, their light is shinning brightly, then comes their decent into the knowledge of this world, and a moving away from innocence and divine wisdom.

I do sometimes wonder about this. If we accept the doctrine of reincarnation and the gradual evolution of consciousness then I have to ask myself why someone who died in ignorance in their previous life would be reborn in an enlightened state.

And the idea of being born in a state of innocence suggests that we are a clean slate, and we develop according to whatever gets imprinted on this slate. Yet we are also told that we bring with us various tendencies from the past. So the personality develops afresh in each incarnation but it is coloured by whatever we might bring with us, for better or for worse.

I do believe that the consciousness of a baby is still very much centred in an astral state and it can take some years for that consciousness to become fully anchored in the physical body. So babies and small children may have an otherworldly awareness which is usually lost by the age of about seven. But that astral state is not necessarily a state of divine wisdom.

I'm not actually disagreeing with what you say, and the idea that babies are born in a state of enlightenment is popular in New Age thinking. But it does raise certain questions which I have yet to resolve for myself. And of course, there are those advanced Souls who are born with a deep connection to higher consciousness which becomes more apparent as they grow up.

Peace

[Starman]

iamthat, That is one reason why I said some and maybe even most, but did not say all. Some who reincarnate may not be enlightened while others who reincarnate may be enlightened. I think it may depend on what they may have learned in a previous life and how many times they may have reincarnated.

Now, in my opinion, there are also those who consciously come directly from the source, and they may not have any previous human life experience and may have never reincarnated before. They may exude wisdom just as much as those who have evolved over countless life times and are now consciously returning to our source.

Please note that I have used the word “may” many times in this post, because I believe possibilities are limitless. What about a genuine Sat-guru, or someone like the Dali Lama, who is said to be born enlightened over and over again. I have been in the presence of genuine Sat-gurus who exude incredible love and light, and their darshan, or presence, is very powerful. Some became gurus as a child, especially in India or places like Sri Lanka.

You know, I think there are some things that are fixed, immutable, and some things that are not fixed, changeable, especially in this physical world where change seems to be the only constant. As far as innocence, innocence in this world is one thing an spiritual innocence is something else. A new born baby exudes innocence. We adults can also experience innocence in meditation. So the worldly definition of innocence is just like the worldly definition of love, in my opinion.

Peace

[iamthat]

Originally Posted by Starman

What about a genuine Sat-guru, or someone like the Dali Lama, who is said to be born enlightened over and over again. I have been in the presence of genuine Sat-gurus who exude incredible love and light, and their darshan, or presence, is very powerful. Some became gurus as a child, especially in India or places like Sri Lanka.

Indeed. As I said: And of course, there are those advanced Souls who are born with a deep connection to higher consciousness which becomes more apparent as they grow up.

But such cases would seem to be the exception.

Peace

[Miss Hepburn]

Ah...Darshan.
Magical...grace transmitted or given just being in the presence of a master... being open...tuned in.

Oh man. It's like being Yogananda meeting Yukteswar in the alley!

[FallingLeaves]

Originally Posted by Maisy

Human's are social animals that do better in groups. Happier and so forth. We come from the great apes that live in groups. Cat's are happy alone.

that is why the powers that be haven't yet fixed our problems for us... we hang on to each other really really tight... and it is very hard to find someone who will walk further away instead of closer... even though there is tremendous pressure to do so...