God had a Beginning. (John chapter 1)

[Hexagon222]

Response to post #27

Originally Posted by charly233

It is about transcending literal thinking, which is thinking with the flesh with symbolic thinking which is thinking with the Spirit.

Thats a good one!

Originally Posted by charly233

This passage, like the whole bible in fact, can be read metaphysically or symbolically. Your children could be your thoughts.

That’s true, and there are teachers that teach it that way

There’s a book called Diagrams for Living by Emmet Fox for more of a symbolic understanding.
In Chapter 1 (pages 1–2), he writes:

“The Bible is written in symbol and allegory. Some people know that, yet they continue to read the Bible in a literal way and consequently miss its message of spiritual power. The veil is still over their hearts, as Paul remarked.”

The saying milk for babes and meat for men comes to mind, similar to 1 Corinthians 3:2 and Hebrews 5:12–14. In the preface of Diagrams for Living, Emmet explains that the Bible is written to meet people at different stages of spiritual development. Those who are not yet spiritually mature still need milk (literal understanding), while those who are spiritually mature are ready for solid food (symbolic and spiritual understanding). Emmet and others say that the Bible is a biography of you, that you are on every page. He notes that many people have given up on the Bible because they only understood it literally, when it was meant to be understood spiritually.

Every location, Egypt, Palestine, Israel, Assyria, Babylon, the Mediterranean, as well as every river, mountain, lake, desert, character, and number has symbolic meaning. Every character’s name in the Bible carries significance. Colors represent our emotional state.

For example, in the story of Esau and Jacob, Esau means “red earth” and represents the material man. Red, in symbolic terms, points to the lower nature, physical sensuality, love of the world, the desire for power, domination over others, and love of money. These are the things that halt spiritual progress and union with God. Other uses of red include the red dragon and red horse, and in Revelation 17, Babylon is described as a woman clothed in purple and scarlet, riding a scarlet-colored beast.

Psalm 137 can be read symbolically as well. Babylon represents confusion and exile, what happens when we forget or turn away from God. The yearning for Jerusalem (God’s home), is the desire to return to union with God.

So the final verses may not be about literal revenge. Instead it could be about destroying delusion before it matures. The “infants” of Babylon represent new, forming thoughts, seeds of delusion or sinful thoughts (sin meaning “missing the mark” or falling short of God). To “dash them against the rock” is to eliminate delusion at the root, before the sinful thoughts can take hold and grow stronger, causing further separation from God. The rock symbolizes our spiritual foundation, as in Matthew 7:24–27, where the wise man builds his house upon rock rather than sand, able to withstand storms and floods. Psalm 18:2 God is my fortress and my rock, Psalm 132:13–14 Zion is God’s dwelling place.

Emmet teaches the Bible as both literal and symbolic, whereas someone like Neville Goddard reads it almost purely as symbolic and metaphysical. If and when I find authors who offer symbolic or metaphysical takes on Psalm 137, I’ll post them here.

I also agree with you that the Bible is about healing the separation between people and God, removing the blockages (sins) that prevent unity with God.

[charly233]

Originally Posted by Hexagon222

To “dash them against the rock” is to eliminate delusion at the root, before the sinful thoughts can take hold and grow stronger, causing further separation from God.

Thanks for your interesting reply and kind comments.

[BigJohn]

Originally Posted by Miss Hepburn

diaspora?
"the dispersion or spread of a people from their original homeland.''

The Diaspora is a major aspect of Judaism and Christianity.

One Diaspora that doesn't seem at first to be recognized is the Diaspora of the Northern Kingdom of Israel. It seems some people are aware of the Diaspora of the Judahites. Another Diaspora that doesn't get talked about deals with the events in the 1st century.

[Hexagon222]

Originally Posted by charly233

Thanks for your interesting reply and kind comments.

And thanks for your post, it kept me busy this weekend reading about Psalms 137. Apparently, Psalms 137:9 is one of the worst Bible verses that Christians get attacked for, with people saying, “Your Bible literally says to smash babies against rocks!” So yeah, the “infants” are not literal human babies but thoughts, like you said.

Also, correction from my last post: Esau means “hairy.” He sells his birthright for a bowl of red lentil pottage, and his name becomes Edom, which means “red” in Hebrew.

Found symbolic/allegorical takes on Psalms 137:9:

A Surprising Beatitude: Dashing the Little Ones upon the Rock by Kevin M. Clarke, Ph.D., who is an assistant professor at Kenrick–Glennon Seminary in St. Louis.
https://www.hprweb.com/2019/01/a-surprising-beatitude/

“Christian antiquity turned to allegorical readings of the letter (to gramma) of texts like Psalm 137 in order to discover the Spirit (to pneuma) hidden beneath. Certainly, this text is not to be interpreted as though a bloodthirsty war party should cast little children to a gruesome end upon the rocks. The practice of Christian allegory provides an alternative reading that draws forth a meaning hidden — and intended — by the divine author.”

And by Susan Gillingham, a Reverend Canon Professor in the Faculty of Theology and Religion at the University of Oxford, Psalms being a focus of her research:

Jewish and Christian Approaches to Suffering in the Reception of Psalm 137 by Susan Gillingham.
https://scielo.org.za/scielo.php?scr...92019000200010

About halfway down, there is a detailed breakdown of the allegorical meaning of Psalm 137 under the title “Christian approaches to suffering through teaching spiritual lessons.” It states again here that the infants/children are not literal babies but are our thoughts.

[charly233]

Originally Posted by Hexagon222

So yeah, the “infants” are not literal human babies but thoughts, like you said.

I didn't realise there was a whole academic literature about the Psalm 137. My gut feeling told me that the infants were thoughts, not babies. It's reassuring to learn that serious bible scholars have reached similar conclusions.

My approach to the bible is to play with it and to let my feelings and intuition flow.

I have just read the bible from cover to cover and agree with Neville Goddard and others that the text is actually all about me.

Some of the passages that are a problem for me when taken literally take on whole new meaning when they are explored metaphysically. For example there are passages in the gospels where Jesus says that disbelievers will go to hell. For me hell is the underworld or unconscious. And disbelievers are those who don't believe in themselves and who also fail to believe in the oneness of people and God. So nobody goes to a literal hell to be tortured for all eternity. Rather people go into their unconscious realms where they receive healing.

[charly233]

Another passage that is problematic when taken literally is this:

"He that spareth his rod hateth his son: but he that loveth him chasteneth him betimes." Proverbs 13:24.

Here the rod reminds me of the wands cards of the tarot which represent intuition. For me chastise is simply to guide.

So the passage reads something like this. He that denies their intuition hates his son but he that loves him guides him wisely.

[sky]

Originally Posted by charly233

Another passage that is problematic when taken literally is this:

"He that spareth his rod hateth his son: but he that loveth him chasteneth him betimes." Proverbs 13:24.

So the passage reads something like this. He that denies their intuition hates his son but he that loves him guides him wisely.

Lack of discipline for your Children is lack of concern for their well being , imo.

[charly233]

Originally Posted by sky

Lack of discipline for your Children is lack of concern for their well being , imo.

Absolutely. The rod of true disciplne is a rod of guidance and understanding rather than a rod used for beating and corporal punishment.

[Hexagon222]

Originally Posted by charly233

My approach to the bible is to play with it and to let my feelings and intuition flow.

I have just read the bible from cover to cover and agree with Neville Goddard and others that the text is actually all about me.

I did something similiar a while back, read the Bible front to back with new eyes.