A true silent black enveloping conscious

[Starman]

iamthat, excellent, you have described the three veils precisely, in accordance with the Hebrew Kabbalah, and no they are not to be avoided. The Third Sephirah on The Tree of Life is Binah, which is depicted as a black sphere. It is the sphere of understanding, also known as the “foundation of primordial wisdom.” There is a direct path on The Tree of Life between Understanding and Wisdom.

Binah proclaims that “filled with Understanding of perfect law, I am guided, moment by moment, along the path of liberation.” So yes, the blackness plays an important role in our understanding and gaining wisdom. As I have said in another thread, the first stage of enlightenment just may be the darkness, as there would be no need for enlightenment without the darkness.

In Kabbalistic thought, as well as metaphysics, it is said that the first material thing to manifest was sound, and sound at a certain frequency turned to light. So from this perspective light is subordinate to sound, and sound is nothing more then vibration. So light is a popular human perspective of God written in most called “sacred texts.” But actually sound or vibration, is the first manifestation of what we may call “GOD.”

That sound is called “the beginning of the whirling” in Kabbalah; it is called whirling because in comes out of nothingness in a circular spiral whirling motion. Sufi Muslims emulate this with their whirling dervishes dancing. I feel like everything is an adaptation of everything else, everything comes out of everything else, and everything goes back into everything else. Sound becomes light, divine light refracted becomes a powerful image, and in human existence we give various separate names to all of the adaptations of the one presence as though they were separate things.

iamthat, I appreciate your references to Kabbalah.

[Ewwerrin]

I have found the most primordeal to be vibration aswell.
But there are vibrations which transcend linear dimensions. And so looking what caused the initial vibration, one finds it to be equally infinite and expanding as the effect of it.
The most primordeal vibration I have found, resembles what science calls a "time crystal".
I have heard it here to be referenced as the billions or trillions of years of cycle between God Source/Absolute emmenating and not emmanating in cycles.
But because it is free from all dimensions, it's starting and beginning and ending happens in infinite dimensions. So one can say infinite universes were created in 1 second, depending on what dimension you look at it.

Vibrations extend from beginningless endlessness to something, like this time and space. But all other time and space exist simultaneously.

Every individual has a slightly different relativity/vibrational relationship with the totality of all that exists here and now. We can for example have our soul create uncreate and recreate this reality from different nodes of the pre-creation or pre-universe. Those pre-universes are so infinite that one can even say that they are created from the soul's point of emmanation. But their potential is such that they insist that the Source/Soul of individual must eventually tik from noncreating to creating.

An eternity in non creating means nothing, because it is timeless and from there time is recreated as if only 1 second passed. That being just one of the infinite many possibilities/relativities.

I found, through all of this, that there is a sort of inevatability to everything. Because the freedom to create is actually activated or better said, it is excited, inevatable. Eternity is too long for the primordeal darkness or void to remain there eternally with an eternal freedom to emmenate again and vibrate again. Even tho it is the Source, ultimately, it keeps recreating everything, including its own greater Source. It awakens and sleeps and awakens in endless variying ways and dimensions. Simply because it can.

But that is just one of infinite many possible Source's. Billions per second, new Source's awaken. There is no end to a greater Source. In the ultimate void, one finds it to merely be the longest cycle of non emmanation/vibration. But when that extremely long rest ends, all that is recreated shows that only a second may have passed. And asking, "Why create again?" The Source points at a nonphysical time crystal, an eternal clock that tiks from zero to one, from nonexcited to excited. But to then ask, did Source create this cause or did the cause cause Source to create, thereby revealing a greater Source?

I find that there is always a greater Source. Infinity and eternity seems to be the most absolute thing there is.

[Ewwerrin]

Originally Posted by Miss Hepburn

Unsolicited advice?...
... Open, Preparing 101[/i].

You're right. Never is a bit too extreme. And I do want to expect it and be open to it. but I don't want to be dissapointed anymore. I am actually a bit looking up against it. Resistant. If it were to come now, I'd be angry with it. "Why didn't you come sooner!"
I'm tired of it always being my fault. I know I'm the one blocking it, but I will never say that that blockage is my fault. If it were my fault, I would atleast have the power to unblock myself.
I can forget things, but forgiveness means a total embracement of all my suffering. And that means an embracement of eternal suffering. Such a thing is not possible. I would be lying if I said "I accept my eternal existence with suffering and I forgive it in advance."
I don't even have the power to do such a thing.
I have actually foolishly thought to have done that in the past, it's what started all the trouble for me. It is naive. To walk straight to hell and expect hell to freeze just because I want it to. But me being naive is also not my fault. With no one left to blame, I turn to God for answers. It's that which I need. And it's that which is not coming. I don't need bliss, it already exists. I need a way to make peace with all that exists.
Bliss? I'm sure there is infinite of that. Always will be. But I can't look bliss in the eye anymore. Without answers to my life. And everything that I've experienced. Not just the couple of bursts of bliss. I want to have a way to make peace with all of it. Remain in peace. I need an eternal refuge. Want to find it.

[Starman]

Ewwerrin, I feel similar to much of what you shared, although I view eternity as the absence of time and infinity as the absence of space; they may or may not be long or short, but since they have no concept of time or space they can not be measured. What we call the void is an example of this.

Time can not exist without space, and as I have previously shared here at SF, all motion is circular, beginning with the first appearance of matter in a vibrational whiling motion to the current spinning of the Earth on its own axis, and also the Earth traveling around the sun; all in a circular motion.

Scientists say that outer space is curved, and we can see the circular effects in our daily lives, e.g. what goes around comes around, etc. In my opinion the whole thing is a circle game, we end up where we started only maybe with renewed perspective.

Creation has always been thought of as a trinity; simply bring to things together and normally they will create a third thing. Paper and paint, or pencil and paper, clay and water, male and female, although some plants are androgynous. I have also seen hermaphrodite human babies, when I worked in newborn at University Hospital in Denver.

A hermaphrodite is a baby born with both male and female genitals and they can not produce children themselves. But normally a fertilized egg can produce offspring. So basically creation is bringing at least two things together, which in turn creates a third thing. Gender is said to exist on every plane, and in every realm, of existence. But I can not address matters, or the lack of matters, beyond existence or what humans may define as existence.

[Unseeking Seeker]

#10 @ iamthat ~ interesting.

From direct experience, I can say that in the inky black void, there is nothing negative per se. On the contrary, we feel a benign higher presence and can communicate. Manifestations may or may not appear, it depends on what we seek at subtler levels of heart’s desire.

This said, the void is yet duality, since we as formless presence are there and a higher presence is there ~ so a hierarchy and dualistic. I recall communicating and having my questions answered satisfactorily.

I wouldn’t know about the types of veils etc. but yes, space itself is a veil, which can be penetrated, revealing a shimmering white all pervading light behind the screen, so to speak. At least, this is how I see it. Moreover, space flickers and we can, if we’re aware, know the exact moment when a subtle shift within occurs ~ for example, in my case the palms and soles of feet were activated/energised in one second, correspondent to a flicker in space. However, if we are not attentive, the moment escapes us even though the enablement occurs anyway.

Then of course the Self. A singularity, luminous, beyond time, ineffable peace (rather than bliss), renewing itself within itself, requiring no doing to be done whilst yet retaining freedom* (*unlike Samadhi, which is also a singularity but without freedom). I would say that it is this (Self) that ‘appears’ in active cognition, when identity drops. The dropping away is like a silent click, like a leaf falling off a tree ~ we can notice it.

I would not know how to classify these as related to any scripture ~ I’m sure the information is out there in some esoteric Buddhist or Kashmir Shaiva text I don’t know about.

[Ewwerrin]

Originally Posted by Starman

Ewwerrin, I feel similar to...
... humans may define as existence.

Perhaps the circular appearance of infinity is due to our expansion into and as the infinite shape from the center point of view, the infinite shapeless becomes circular into and as it. And it appears to repeat because it is "self similar" infinite fractal. Which means it is going to repeat for eternity but always become slightly more than what it used to be, each new cycle. Basically if this is so, and I see no counter evidence (unfortunately, because I don't know how end my expansion) then that means that in actual fact, true repetition does not exist. Everything is always infinitely unique. Tho it is still always the same one whole infinite inseperable thing, we are expanding our experience of it to evermore higher frequency and density and resolution the deeper we go into it. But everything is going to be forever the same (duality and fractality) and yet evermore new, and ever More and More of the same. Ever slightly so different. And since the expansion is different, the experience is going to be forever different aswell. But because it is a fractal, the difference is always going to be more of the same. More variations of the same one thing. That same one thing can be dualistic. Because of our experience, as awareness, and the fractal is basically a duality which makes it possible and allows it to expand.

An infinite ever expanding evermore and new becoming duality that repeats in infinite varrying ways for all eternity in infinite expansion of self similarity, but never self exactness. Evermore slightly different. The only absoluteness in this, is that everything is forever new here and now. But because it is forever new of the same one infinite thing, there appears many similarities aswell. Because every expansion, is an expansion of the previous level of expansion (frequency).

You can watch a fractal zooming in on youtube and you will see the same happening in two dimensions. And since everything is a fractal, we are expanding like that too, from the center, evermore of our own frequency. But there is also free will, it can become interested in observing, and expanding thus, in the direction of circularness, and the result is that what expands reflects the way it is being observed/expanded upon. That is why you say what goes around comes around.

But in actuallity, there is no shape, just an appearance of a shape. As you already have seen, zoom (become aware of/observe) deep enough into anything and it will always reveal itself (expand into) to be infinitely more than what it is. Or what it appears to be, because in essence, appearance is the only thing there is. Since everything is the same one infinite thing, it is shapeless, like an infinite fractal. Shapeless, because every shape has no end. Every shape is infinite.

So free will cannot affect much the current of our already eternal expansion. You can chase things circularly, but because the expansion is so infinite and eternal and absolute and having so much momentum, one cannot avoid the expansion into evermore and more and more of what is. It's like a train with infinite momentum or weight, that is unstoppable. It has one direction, expanding your frequency. Evermore of your frequency of your own awareness. Reflected (expanded upon) back to you evermore and evermore. And the result is evermore new frequency that is expanding in evermore self similarity but never self exactness. Same, but not same. Same, but not exactly same. Always higher frequency. Always higher resolution. Higher density.

But in expansion there is also the appearance of contraction. Because it will forever be the same one infinite thing that we are experiencing more of, and it is us. But the direction of your expansion is unique. You are always the only one in your own universe. the center of it. And your journey like all infinite frequencies (consciousness') is forever infinitely unique.

There are infinite variations of beginnings and endings. And densities during eternal expansion in and as the fractal/paradox of all that exists that we are.

[iamthat]

Originally Posted by Starman

In Kabbalistic thought, as well as metaphysics, it is said that the first material thing to manifest was sound, and sound at a certain frequency turned to light. So from this perspective light is subordinate to sound, and sound is nothing more then vibration. So light is a popular human perspective of God written in most called “sacred texts.” But actually sound or vibration, is the first manifestation of what we may call “GOD.”

Indeed. This is what I was taught when I first began practising Shabd Yoga. The first manifestation is Sound, the Sat Nam, the true Name of God. From the Sound comes the Light. From the Light come the ten thousand things.

I sometimes think that I should look more deeply into the Kabbalah. I imagine it would be very rewarding.

Peace

[iamthat]

Originally Posted by Unseeking Seeker

Then of course the Self. A singularity, luminous, beyond time, ineffable peace (rather than bliss), renewing itself within itself, requiring no doing to be done whilst yet retaining freedom ... I would not know how to classify these as related to any scripture ~ I’m sure the information is out there in some esoteric Buddhist or Kashmir Shaiva text I don’t know about.

Yes, the Self allows all things to exist and all things to be done while remaining untouched by any of it.

I like your emphasis on ineffable peace rather than bliss. I think that many people expect realisation to produce a state of neverending bliss in which the problems of life all vanish. It is more realistic to consider a state of ineffable peace, which remains present whatever arises in life.

And yes, no doubt there is much information in obscure texts which may never have been translated for our understanding. But then, how many of us actually read the texts which are available? So much to read, so little time.

Peace

[Ewwerrin]

Originally Posted by iamthat

Yes, the Self allows all things to exist and all things to be done while remaining untouched by any of it.

Question
I experienced this during a psychosis. I went through life review process of many kind of lifes. It happened so fast. Felt like utter random chaos to me, but in my center there was a profound unaffectedness. Going through the death process several times of different lifes in mere seconds. And then everything became fractal. But my center Self remained unaffected. As if there is nothing there. It felt like it was happening to me, like some higher intelligence was giving me a ride through random experiences. Showing that death is not real and fear is just a believe system that activates prior to death. It happened so fast and I remained like a nothing center, unaffected.

Is that what you mean by the Self? And if so, who was creating these experiences for me? A greater Self? It felt to me like I was in a simulation with all senses, my consciousness being callibrated. Certain moments or frames were frozen but with all 5 senses intact. Including emotion. Like prior to death. All the fear and taste in my mouth, even the sound was intact but frozen in time. These are just tiny little details of endless things happening to my consciousness in a short burst of time. And the center was always unaffected by it. Almost invulnerable.

Is that the Self you are talking about? This invulnerable unaffected center point of my consciousness?

[Starman]

Generally speaking; on the other side human life appears as a distant dream which our primordial self is unaffected by. Although in a life review, often but not always, visuals may be engaged with all 5-senses. Life reviews are frequently done in reverse, seeing our most recent death first and then events that happened right before that death, and so on to our birth and the death we experienced before that birth, etc. It is a reflection of our life and reflections are always in reverse.

We may have stored experience in a past to present sequence but when it unravels in the afterlife it is in reverse, most recent to long pasted experiences. It can be very confusing but often there is an entity there, a guide, angel, or other compassionate entity to help us with that review. This I have experienced in my out-of-body experiences and have also been told such my others who have had NDE’s and OBE’s. This process is also explained in the Hebrew Kabbalah in its lessons on birth, death, and rebirth.