Embodied soul.

[Michael K.]

Soon after taking up meditation back in 1974 i soon realised that I was a SOUL with a body, and not a body with a soul, I realised there was a big difference, with the soul being an immortal principle and the body just a vehicle to enable the soul to gain purchase here, nothing more than that.
I began to discover by going deep within the self that we are all on a basic three fold awakening or realization, the first one we are all on which is that of ego realization, seeing that the mind and the ego are one of the same thing, and realizing that individuality is an illusion that millions of us share, then we can move onto the next stage in awakening which is soul realization, and there are very many of us already there at this moment, realizing the truth through conscious contact with the immortal soul. And the last realization is that of SELF realization where we know that we are the immortal absolute SELF SOURCE of all life, becoming fully conscious of this fact while still being an incarnate relative expression. Of this noble ones there is but a handful wandering this Earth.
regards michael.

I suppose we all rationalise our development in our ways - which suggests that individuality is no illusion. Our spiritual awareness starts with different triggers and our accumulated experiences in life on the mundane give us our out-front public personas and the way we present ourselves in the different roles we are made to play.

You're right that the body is just a vehicle through which our souls can act but I believe the soul is individual. That's just my belief as is that I/we have souls, but I tend to the Voodoo view that the soul is made up of two blended parts - that of the cosmos (the universal soul - the gros bon ange) and a component that is uniquely individual, (the petit bon ange), the latter of which suggests some preceding characteristics brought forth into us - or, in the world of pure spirit, it has been prepared for us individually. (I imagine this is the reason identical twins are so synchronised.)

I don't see awakening or enlightenment as single eureka moments in our lives but a succession of empowerments or initiations, if you like, that we acknowledge either at the time or later as milestones in our development.

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[ayar415]

QUOTE Post 2 EXCERPT:

Originally Posted by Lorelyen

I suppose we all rationalise our development in our ways - which suggests that individuality is no illusion.

Individuality is an illusion due to attachment to (your) way. Every snowflake has a unique pattern but it is essentially snow. Similarly, every human face and body is different from the next. Sensory perception is the killer in splitting apart the oneness of humanity. Each body has it own visual point of view which is reinforced by the sounds heard in one instance but not another. The rap on one head is not felt by another. To cap it off, you just won't let go of your opinion that you are right and I am wrong.

[ayar415]

QUOTE Post 1 EXCERPT:

Originally Posted by Michael K.

Soon after taking up meditation back in 1974 i soon realised that I was a SOUL with a body, and not a body with a soul, I realised there was a big difference, with the soul being an immortal principle and the body just a vehicle to enable the soul to gain purchase here, nothing more than that.

I agree with you, in principle. However, it is the verbalization of your realization that is an issue for me. Words have meanings, and those meanings open doors to a fictitious reality. But words – invented by the deluded human mind trapped in an illusory world - are all we have. So, how can a “noble one” verbalize his perception using the words of “the fool”?

What you call “soul”, I would prefer the word “consciousness”. It all begins with the consciousness which is neither yours nor mine and it has nothing to do with the human brain. The fool would insist that it is his own unique individual consciousness generated by his personal brain. And he can prove it by holding a thought that only he knows. And the authority of prevailing science supports him. At this point, the noble one needs to shut up and that spiritual inquiry ends.

Originally Posted by ayar415

Individuality is an illusion due to attachment to (your) way. Every snowflake has a unique pattern but it is essentially snow. Similarly, every human face and body is different from the next.

Not worth discussion with you. You've showed the fallacy of your own point. Think about what you said: "Every snowflake has a unique pattern but it is essentially snow." Doesn't that make each snowflake individual? Is that difference an illusion?!
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[ayar415]

QUOTE Post 5 EXCERPT:

Originally Posted by Lorelyen

Think about what you said: "Every snowflake has a unique pattern but it is essentially snow." Doesn't that make each snowflake individual? Is that difference an illusion?!

The pattern may be different but every snowflake is essentially snow. How about raindrops? None are exactly the same but they are all water. Why would one drop insist on being an individual by virtue of its shape and position in the falling rain?

Lorelyn, are you with me?

Originally Posted by ayar415

QUOTE Post 5 EXCERPT:
The pattern may be different but every snowflake is essentially snow. How about raindrops? None are exactly the same but they are all water. Why would one drop insist on being an individual by virtue of its shape and position in the falling rain?
Lorelyn, are you with me?

You seem to like the simplest possible similes. Here's mine: People are all made from the earth. But I'd say it's unlikely that you look like me, even less so that you think like me; and even less likely that you've had identical life experiences to mine. If you think the differences are illusory then I'll leave you to your musings. I don't and am thankful for that.
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[ayar415]

QUOTE Post 7 EXCERPT:

Originally Posted by Lorelyen

But I'd say it's unlikely that you look like me, even less so that you think like me; and even less likely that you've had identical life experiences to mine. If you think the differences are illusory then I'll leave you to your musings.
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Me look like you? I recall feeling an unforgettable tinge of uneasiness when I was 8 and looking at "me" in the mirror. All I could see was a human head with eyeballs looking at "me". I gazed at the eyes and peered into the pupils. They were dark holes. I shrank back with that tinge of uneasiness that still remain with me today. It's not "me" in the mirror, Lorelyn. It's a non-personal human body. I didn't have the confidence to assert that fact back then.

The human body that has become "you" is a symbol named Lorelyn. It invokes in "you" the same emotional attachment that the unique American flag does to "patriots". And "they" will kill and die for "America" just as you will defend "Lorelyn" against my attempt to annihilate "you". As long as there is this attachment to being unique drops of water, the ocean will not become one.

This is my summation. Let the jury decide.

^^^ Ok. Carry on. I like your weird analogies...!
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