On Conception and Abortions --- From A Spiritist Perspective

My twin sister was born dead. But she is very much with me in spirit.

[BigJohn]

Originally Posted by Elfin

My twin sister was born dead. But she is very much with me in spirit.

In our screwy world, some might say you were born 'dead' - not aware of the spirit world whereas your sister was born 'alive'.

Is it not your sister who looks over you daily? So who is watching out for the other? The one watching out over the other is the one with the 'advantage'.

Who owns a woman’s body? Is it the woman? Is it her fetus? Is it Jesus? Is it our leaders?

Presupposing any other argument about abortion, this is the fundamental question, because it always turns right back around to control of a woman’s body — who owns it.

There's a word for someone owning another person’s body, a very old word that anyone in the light of today says they loathe, though it still goes on in the shadows, and sometimes still in broad daylight posing as something else; morality, righteousness, piety, justice — but they all are used to justify the very same disenfranchising of a woman from her own decisions about her own life and her own body, and here we are, still fighting over who owns a woman's body.

Originally Posted by Kioma

Who owns a woman’s body? Is it the woman? Is it her fetus? Is it Jesus? Is it our leaders?

Presupposing any other argument about abortion, this is the fundamental question, because it always turns right back around to control of a woman’s body — who owns it.

There's a word for someone owning another person’s body, a very old word that anyone in the light of today says they loathe, though it still goes on in the shadows, and sometimes still in broad daylight posing as something else; morality, righteousness, piety, justice — but they all are used to justify the very same disenfranchising of a woman from her own decisions about her own life and her own body, and here we are, still fighting over who owns a woman's body.

I haven't seen anyone fighting.....

Originally Posted by leadville

I haven't seen anyone fighting.....

It is a MAJOR issue in the US.

Originally Posted by BigJohn

In our screwy world, some might say you were born 'dead' - not aware of the spirit world whereas your sister was born 'alive'.

Is it not your sister who looks over you daily? So who is watching out for the other? The one watching out over the other is the one with the 'advantage'.

Guide and teacher Silver Guide said something like being born into this cold, dreary world is seen as a death by those who are watching from 'the world of the spirit'. But the premature return of a would-be incarnating spirit is hardly likely to be a situation of rejoicing unless it was the plan.

That would be at least a possibility in the case of twins, one intending to watch over the other and both having planned it before their births.

Originally Posted by Kioma

It is a MAJOR issue in the US.

Did anyone suggest anything different? What you had said was "...and here we are, still fighting over who owns a woman's body."

I don't see that WE were fighting the way you suggested.....

Originally Posted by leadville

Did anyone suggest anything different? What you had said was "...and here we are, still fighting over who owns a woman's body."

I don't see that WE were fighting the way you suggested.....

My apologies for the confusion leadville.

In the UK abortion has been legal for decades. It was settled in the US once as well, but there are various groups who have made it a divisive issue for various reasons.

No, 'we' are not 'fighting' at this time - but read the thread. You will see various opinions, some which compare abortion to murder. Do you not think that is sufficient motivation for some to FIGHT to see it ended?

It seems there are two kinds of people in politics these days - those who think people can make decisions for themselves, and those who think they should make decisions for everyone else. In the court of US public opinion the fight is very real, and very fierce.

[BigJohn]

Originally Posted by leadville

Guide and teacher Silver Guide said something like being born into this cold, dreary world is seen as a death by those who are watching from 'the world of the spirit'. But the premature return of a would-be incarnating spirit is hardly likely to be a situation of rejoicing unless it was the plan.

That would be at least a possibility in the case of twins, one intending to watch over the other and both having planned it before their births.

I think Elfin will enjoy reading your encouraging, upbuilding comments.

[Rah nam]

I would agree with Native spirit, that this subject is a highly emotional one, and best left alone. But I am not emotional, in fact have very little emotions.
So I will try to look at it form a factual point of view.

Life as I understand it, is an independent existence in this reality. A fetus can at best be seen to be on it's way to this existence. Do I kill a chicken if I eat an egg? It is a potential life, is it not? But then we don't have a problem with killing chickens in this society.

Some lament that spirits are lost in the non physical earth realm, or what ever they might name this realm.

In my understanding a spirit connects with the fetus in most cases around 4 month and after.

Even if the spirit is connected and the baby is still born the spirit is pulled out of this reality. Up to a point where the body/mind/spirit complex makes it's own choices.