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Go Back   Spiritual Forums > Spirituality & Beliefs > Non Duality

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  #1  
Old 30-05-2020, 07:18 AM
JustASimpleGuy
Posts: n/a
 
The Essence of Non Duality

One without a second
Atman is Brahman
Thou art That

Conclusion: I am Brahman. You are Brahman. Everyone is Brahman. Everything is Brahman. There is only Brahman.

Difficulty: Shifting identification from the "I" of mind-body to the "I" of Atman and not from the perspective of mind but of being.

Is Samadhi the only way? https://youtu.be/BY2pEoUwEVM?t=3860
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  #2  
Old 30-05-2020, 12:48 PM
Iamit Iamit is offline
Master
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: West Wales. u.k
Posts: 1,002
 
Bunny

Quote:
Originally Posted by JustASimpleGuy
One without a second
Atman is Brahman
Thou art That

Conclusion: I am Brahman. You are Brahman. Everyone is Brahman. Everything is Brahman. There is only Brahman.

Difficulty: Shifting identification from the "I" of mind-body to the "I" of Atman and not from the perspective of mind but of being.

Is Samadhi the only way? [url]https://youtu.be/BY2pEoUwEVM?t=3860[ /url]

It seems that you already clearly see that Brahman is all without exception, then the "I" of the mind/body is also Brahman manifest! Yes?

No escape is possible from Brahman no matter what state you are in for Brahman is already all states. So to change from identification with the "I", to ending that identification produces no increase in connection to Brahman which is already unavoidably totally the state before the change.

The solution to the difficulty you mention is that Brahman is already totally whatever state you are already in.
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  #3  
Old 30-05-2020, 12:55 PM
JustASimpleGuy
Posts: n/a
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Iamit
It seems that you already clearly see that Brahman is all without exception, then the "I" of the mind/body is also Brahman manifest!

No escape is possible from Brahman no matter what state you are in for Brahman is already all states. So to change from identification with the "I", to ending that identification produces no increase in connection to Brahman which is already unavoidably totally the state before the change.

The solution to the difficulty you mention is that Brahman is already totally whatever state you are already in.

There are many "I"s of mind-body but only One "I" of Atman. So no, the ego self "I" is not the One "I" and identifying with the prior is not the same as identifying with the Latter.

It's like the difference in consciousness between a dream and a lucid dream, only much more profound.

EDIT: I've had dreams where I wished it was only a dream but didn't believe it was only a dream, hence I was caught up in the ups and downs, joys and terrors of the dream. I've had lucid dreams where I knew I was not the dream but the dreamer. At that point nothing in the dream could touch me. I was beyond the dream.

The first example is an analogy for intellectual understanding of Oneness and the second for experiential "knowing" of Oneness. Being Oneness.
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  #4  
Old 30-05-2020, 02:51 PM
Iamit Iamit is offline
Master
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: West Wales. u.k
Posts: 1,002
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by JustASimpleGuy
There are many "I"s of mind-body but only One "I" of Atman. So no, the ego self "I" is not the One "I" and identifying with the prior is not the same as identifying with the Latter.

It's like the difference in consciousness between a dream and a lucid dream, only much more profound.

EDIT: I've had dreams where I wished it was only a dream but didn't believe it was only a dream, hence I was caught up in the ups and downs, joys and terrors of the dream. I've had lucid dreams where I knew I was not the dream but the dreamer. At that point nothing in the dream could touch me. I was beyond the dream.

The first example is an analogy for intellectual understanding of Oneness and the second for experiential "knowing" of Oneness. Being Oneness.

You realze that if you exclude the many "I's" as not Brahman then you contradict your own statement that all is Brahman.
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  #5  
Old 30-05-2020, 03:11 PM
JustASimpleGuy
Posts: n/a
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Iamit
You realze that if you exclude the many "I's" as not Brahman then you contradict your own statement that all is Brahman.

How did I exclude? I just said, in essence, there's only One consciousness (technically speaking Turya), only One Self and it's not self of ego but Self that is Atman.

Identification with self of ego is dualism. Identification with Self of Atman is non-dualism. Knowing the latter on an intellectual level is halfway there. Being the latter is Realization.

Either there's One without a second or there are many. Either I'm Brahman experiencing Itself through Maya (a Power of Brahman hence Brahman) or I'm one of the many experiencing a higher, separate and superior entity (Brahman).

In essence there's only One "I" and many forms and names which borrow existence from the One, and only for a time. The One has no name or form and isn't limited by time, space or causation.
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  #6  
Old 30-05-2020, 04:57 PM
Iamit Iamit is offline
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Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: West Wales. u.k
Posts: 1,002
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by JustASimpleGuy
How did I exclude? I just said, in essence, there's only One consciousness (technically speaking Turya), only One Self and it's not self of ego but Self that is Atman.

Identification with self of ego is dualism. Identification with Self of Atman is non-dualism. Knowing the latter on an intellectual level is halfway there. Being the latter is Realization.

Either there's One without a second or there are many. Either I'm Brahman experiencing Itself through Maya (a Power of Brahman hence Brahman) or I'm one of the many experiencing a higher, separate and superior entity (Brahman).

In essence there's only One "I" and many forms and names which borrow existence from the One, and only for a time. The One has no name or form and isn't limited by time, space or causation.

Ok so we have established that if Brahman is all there is then the I you regard as problematatic must be Brahman. If you are clear about that then there is no difficulty with identifying with that I because doing so is completely connected to Brahman because that I must be Brahman manifesting as that I.

Its just a question of including all that appears as Brahman manifest, even the things you regard as problematic, and the action of seeing them as such. Then seeing all as Brahman will be complete rather than seeing the things you regard as problematic as somehow other than Brahman and in need of some sort of modification rather than already perfectly Brahman.

Last edited by Iamit : 30-05-2020 at 08:02 PM.
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  #7  
Old 30-05-2020, 05:16 PM
HITESH SHAH HITESH SHAH is offline
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Join Date: Apr 2019
Posts: 1,296
 
example of non-duality

Quote:
Originally Posted by JustASimpleGuy
One without a second
Atman is Brahman
Thou art That

Conclusion: I am Brahman. You are Brahman. Everyone is Brahman. Everything is Brahman. There is only Brahman.

Difficulty: Shifting identification from the "I" of mind-body to the "I" of Atman and not from the perspective of mind but of being.

Is Samadhi the only way? https://youtu.be/BY2pEoUwEVM?t=3860

I liked the thread heading very much and your overall approach also .

I am bit simple guy and I understand more with examples . So I give how God feels non-duality with us .

HTML Code:
Entity 1 Entity 2 State Experience Entity 1 Experience Entity 2 God Individual Sleep Non-dual Non-dual God Individual Mediation Non-dual Non-dual/dual God Individual Awake Non-dual Dual

This is how God keeps his promise to entertain and have joy in the life of seeker (even atheist is covered in this ) . This is just God's non-duality with one person . Added to these is multiple entity and groups of entity bringing amazing excitement and fun in life.

And spirituality is to be /like God in some measure (Nobody can just match God in Full measure ) . So a true seeker also will like to acquire such non-duality in life though his/her thought/speech & actions .
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  #8  
Old 30-05-2020, 05:40 PM
JustASimpleGuy
Posts: n/a
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by HITESH SHAH
I liked the thread heading very much and your overall approach also .

I am bit simple guy and I understand more with examples . So I give how God feels non-duality with us .

HTML Code:
Entity 1 Entity 2 State Experience Entity 1 Experience Entity 2 God Individual Sleep Non-dual Non-dual God Individual Mediation Non-dual Non-dual/dual God Individual Awake Non-dual Dual

This is how God keeps his promise to entertain and have joy in the life of seeker (even atheist is covered in this ) . This is just God's non-duality with one person . Added to these is multiple entity and groups of entity bringing amazing excitement and fun in life.

And spirituality is to be /like God in some measure (Nobody can just match God in Full measure ) . So a true seeker also will like to acquire such non-duality in life though his/her thought/speech & actions .

Great chart but allow me to break the sleep category down.

HTML Code:
Entity 1 Entity 2 State Experience Entity 1 Experience Entity 2 God Individual Deep Sleep Non-dual Non-dual God Individual REM Sleep Non-dual Dual God Individual Mediation Non-dual Non-dual/dual God Individual Awake Non-dual Dual
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  #9  
Old 30-05-2020, 05:54 PM
HITESH SHAH HITESH SHAH is offline
Master
Join Date: Apr 2019
Posts: 1,296
 
update appreciated

Quote:
Originally Posted by JustASimpleGuy
Great chart but allow me to break the sleep category down.

HTML Code:
Entity 1 Entity 2 State Experience Entity 1 Experience Entity 2 God Individual Deep Sleep Non-dual Non-dual God Individual REM Sleep Non-dual Dual God Individual Mediation Non-dual Non-dual/dual God Individual Awake Non-dual Dual

Thanks for clarification .
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  #10  
Old 01-06-2020, 12:51 PM
Iamit Iamit is offline
Master
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: West Wales. u.k
Posts: 1,002
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by HITESH SHAH
I liked the thread heading very much and your overall approach also .

I am bit simple guy and I understand more with examples . So I give how God feels non-duality with us .

HTML Code:
Entity 1 Entity 2 State Experience Entity 1 Experience Entity 2 God Individual Sleep Non-dual Non-dual God Individual Mediation Non-dual Non-dual/dual God Individual Awake Non-dual Dual

This is how God keeps his promise to entertain and have joy in the life of seeker (even atheist is covered in this ) . This is just God's non-duality with one person . Added to these is multiple entity and groups of entity bringing amazing excitement and fun in life.

And spirituality is to be /like God in some measure (Nobody can just match God in Full measure ) . So a true seeker also will like to acquire such non-duality in life though his/her thought/speech & actions .

From the perspective of nonduality Oneness is the only reality so the differences you mention are an illusion of difference (maya) where there are no differences whatsoever.
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