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Go Back   Spiritual Forums > Spirituality & Beliefs > General Beliefs

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  #21  
Old 22-10-2020, 08:13 PM
zorkchop zorkchop is offline
Guide
Join Date: Apr 2019
Posts: 698
 
Considerations Seven …

We did not forget …

Irritation Factor … moderate

- - o-0-O-O-0-o - -

With this post I am going to initiate using a scale I will call the Irritation Factor … because my posts on these topics are not going to set well with many on this board. I truly do not mean to intentionally set these people off … but if I am going to be true to my choice of offering at least just an honest touch of esoterica … what I offer in such posts may just go against what many believe and what is being widely taught. Please be advised.

I will offer the Irritation Factor only on posts I believe would be appropriate. I am not commanding anyone to believe. Just … consider. Plug in some of this information and any else I might offer … and let it roll around inside for a while … and observe how the puzzle pieces perhaps readjust.

- - o-0-O-O-0-o - -

Right at the beginning I will again clearly state … Soul is *not* mind … and mind is *not* Soul.

Period.

Soul does not have the “luxury” of having a brain that we in the human state of consciousness use for memory … and other features. Soul was not created with a ready set of knowledge … or even with a built-in awareness of how to gain said knowledge.

Therefore … Soul did not come here and forget everything. It never knew in the first place. Why else would this entire set of psychic worlds be designed for the gaining of experience for individual Soul … if Soul already knew. Soul was *not* created just for some toy puppetry to engage in this Psychic Wonderland. Soul was created for a definite purpose … and if it were not for the creation of Soul Itself … nothing would exist anywhere save for the Core Creator God ( simple generic term ) and ITS Essence … Divine Spirit … by whatever name you wish to call Pure, Divine Spirit.

To follow the sequence … Soul discovers what It (Soul) is by first discovering what It (Soul) is not. In these slower, lower, heavier psychic worlds … Soul discovers what It is not. (Please do not attack the messenger. I did not design the system.)

One of the great paradoxes on the Path is finally discovering and realizing that Soul is the greatest of all Creations … Soul … as the individual creation that It is … and yet initially it is the most apprehensive, ignorant, easily frightened, incapable Creation in existence … if one can put human emotions and reactions on Soul Itself. If you believe that a newborn infant “knows nothing” … a newborn is a genius when compared to an actual fledgling Soul … thrown here totally out of Its element … and left to flounder for eons.

Again … please do not get upset with me. I did *not* design the system.

Talk about a “clean slate” … Soul barely knows It has a slate at all … and I couldn’t state with assurance that It does know It has a “slate.” Since Soul first become aware through the mental awareness and then builds upon that mental system … it is impossible for Soul to know any difference.

Using an appropriate example … let’s say a fish is created in the Heavenly Worlds. Immediately after creation … the fish is not given a short time to swim around in a waterless world to discover just how wonderful this world is … and then is thrown down into a watery world on Earth … where it can now breathe and interact in a more stable environment. Both Earth and water itself would be a “heavier” world than the Heavenly Realms … and the fish in the fishbowl of the world cannot even see out of its own world much at all … if any. This fish will stay here until it can learn to breath air and climb up on the rim of the fishbowl … and then learn to exist there. This certainly might take a while.

And yet it is designed this way for reasons that become apparent after a long, long trek through these worlds … which is … part of the overall Path in the first place.

Soul Itself is not simply a more advance non-physical version of the human state of consciousness. Soul Itself has a vastly different set of faculties and perceptions that have been overshadowed by mind and the psychic worlds for eons. And how to finally realize this?

How else?

Personal experience.

A precept that one can count on during the duration of the Path … Truth must be uncovered and realized … deception is freely and popularly provided.

But even this … is a paradox. When one is young and everything is new … each step must be uncovered and discovered … and then lived. Trial-and-error. That’s the name of the game. Discernment leads to sensing beneficial truth and then knowing what is deceiving and what is not … and will also give clues as to ones next possible step.

So Soul did not know … and then forget. But since the mind is thoroughly capable of designing any scenario for the individual to believe in … the mind can easily claim top status and that nothing else exists. And here … in this hodge-lodge of psychic layers and levels … mind *does* reign supreme. Soul is out of Its element here and will allow mind to become the inner master.

One more time … I did not design the system. But consider this …

This system was designed … because it works … and effectively so. LIFE … and Soul Itself … is unconcerned with eons and seemingly endless lifetimes.

More later.
  #22  
Old 24-10-2020, 03:40 PM
zorkchop zorkchop is offline
Guide
Join Date: Apr 2019
Posts: 698
 
Considerations Eight …

Duality …

Irritation Factor … high to extreme

- - o-0-O-O-0-o - -

It is not my intention to just come here and post contradictions to a lot of the posts on this board. My intention here is to try and portray the best I can … an overview … a looking down at the puzzle from a more broad, comprehensive perspective … gained from actual personal experience … and at the same time knowing that these perspectives are many times incredibly difficult to consider … simply because they are *not* what is widely and favorably taught … and the current teachings have been around for a long, long time … developed through a logically perceived continuous manner to appeal to the human condition.

Since the time of the first human stepping onto this planet … and up through the ages … man has been plagued with a mind running wild. The mind can endlessly spin all on its own … all by itself. The chief facet feeding the mind are the eyes. The mind was given to Soul so that It could analyze and compare what was going on around it in the daily life of the individual here in the psychic worlds. When an individual sees something and has a reaction to it … or later relives the incident and has mental reactions to it … the mind can continue to just jabber endlessly. We’ve all been through this … and many continue to do so.

Not only was a respite from the daily hardships highly sought after by the human animal … but there was also a massive desire for the mind to just shut up … even for a few moments.

( Don’t worry … I’ll get to duality. )

So the religions and philosophers slowly constructed some lofty goals for the religious teachings themselves. One … to stop the mind … and two … the end goal of all is to return to God and just float endlessly without responsibility or adversity. Just float about without thought in the arms of God … and forget all … for eternity. Total and perpetual R&R. Complete relief and absolving all.

My point being … that the meaning of duality was hijacked to mean separation from God … since many of the religions teach that unity with God is the end goal.

That is *not* the case … and I am going to clearly state here … that this does *not* make these religions wrong … no more than a high school sophomore is “wrong” in the educational progression from kindergarten to college graduate … or whatever terms are used in your personal locale. People have taken to these eastern religions because they are a “next step” in their own sequence … providing a much deeper discovery of karma, reincarnation, and the various psychic energies than the previous religions and philosophies. One builds upon the next. On it goes.

People also recognize the teachings of the eastern religions because we have all had *many* lifetimes in them … and they are familiar. That often brings comfort.

Duality is not separation. No one can actually separate themselves from God. Everything is theoretically a part of God … and technically speaking … that is also true … to an extent. Regardless … nothing can be separated from LIFE. Perception of separation is just that … perception. The Core Creator God ( generic term ) did not create Soul to eventually come back to IT and become one with IT and then surrender all experience to God and just … become a floating entity without responsibility to its own stance within LIFE as the Whole that IT is. God did not create Soul to discover all of this through experience … and then get to the point where you unplug and float. Even to mind … that does not make sense … but one cannot dismiss the incredible desire for endless R&R … a cessation to the turmoil and struggle … and the endless mental chatter. Without doubt … there is the extreme desire to find total respite from the perpetual hassles of daily life … and union with God would fill that bill perfectly.

That’s just not the way it turns out to be.

And to find an end goal in stopping the mind brings some relief … but it is only a step in the overall progression. One does not step beyond mind by simply stopping the thought process … no more than one automatically steps out of a car if s/he simply allows the car to slow to a halt.

When one returns from the deep trance state where mind has slowed to a stop … all the mental beliefs are still “there” within the individual. It is these beliefs (etc) that must be controlled and revised … although I will say … the slowing and stopping of the mind is a technique we all learn … eventually. It is a necessary step.

So … what is duality? And why does it pertain only to the psychic worlds … of which Earth is a part?

In a nutshell … duality is polarity. Duality is … that something exists only in relation to its opposite. There is no low without a high … there is no fast without a slow … there is no valley without a mountain … there is no male without female … there is no young without old … etc. x however long you wish to carry that out. Everything in these psychic worlds has its opposite … somewhere. Everything has its dual nature … in relation to its opposite.

The basic premise … in these worlds … there is a positive and a negative element to the atom … and this allows for an interaction for manifestation … from thought right down to the physical vehicle.

And as difficult as it may seem … there is no negative element or an “energy atom” in the Pure God Worlds. The formation of those worlds … for lack of better words … is not geared out of “energy” as we know it.

If someone wishes to continue to banter about the ideal of separation / non-separation … as becoming wholly one with the experience … that certainly can continue to the extent that one can encounter and experience it. An individual will certainly become more adept at this … but there is never a total immersion into a level of consciousness where one actually does lose oneself in the Core Creator God … and lose the individuality ( not separateness ) (not part ) that was given to each at the moment of the creation of each individual Soul.

The religions and philosophies are marvelous arenas of learning. What can be learned with any of them … is seemingly endless. There are lessons within each that *must* be learned because many Souls will eventually reach the “end” of the Path … so to speak … traveling into and becoming wholly acquainted with the Pure God Worlds (another generic term) … and will return to the lower worlds to assist. One needs to be completely familiar with the ongoings here in order to stay on top of it all … even after the “end” has been attained. Though it is rare … it is entirely possible for one who has indeed attained the “end” … to slip and forget when coming back into these worlds to assist … and to get trapped in it all over again. It takes ongoing work to stay out of the traps and the pitfalls.

Such is the nature of the lower psychic worlds.

Please try not to belittle, condemn, or dismiss any of religions or philosophies just because there is “something beyond them” or there is “another level” above them.

I have one more possible irritation topic to discuss and then I will ease back a bit.

More later.
  #23  
Old 24-10-2020, 06:58 PM
janielee
Posts: n/a
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by zorkchop
...When one returns from the deep trance state where mind has slowed to a stop … all the mental beliefs are still “there” within the individual. It is these beliefs (etc) that must be controlled and revised … although I will say … the slowing and stopping of the mind is a technique we all learn … eventually. It is a necessary step.

One needs to be completely familiar with the ongoings here in order to stay on top of it all … even after the “end” has been attained. Though it is rare … it is entirely possible for one who has indeed attained the “end” … to slip and forget when coming back into these worlds to assist … and to get trapped in it all over again. It takes ongoing work to stay out of the traps and the pitfalls.
Thanks zorkchop, I don't think anything you are saying is controversial or irritating (personally speaking)
Can you speak more about above? (in green)
Thanks,
JL
  #24  
Old 24-10-2020, 10:12 PM
zorkchop zorkchop is offline
Guide
Join Date: Apr 2019
Posts: 698
 
janielee …

I truly appreciate and applaud your questions and your interest. I don’t have much farther to go in trying to somewhat lay a foundation … and then I will try to address some more personal issues … to me … and to others. I have kept copies of all your questions and keep them in the rather large and growing folder where I try to put together these posts. I will get to your questions … I promise … or I will try my best to do so.

Have patience. I should be getting into this phase this week … but keep making your queries. They help give these posts Life.

Until them … try to understand … that often the mind just wants to “know” and then when it finds out the answer it turns out to be a huge let-down. Understanding greater reality has more to do with simplifying it … and not analyzing it more. A deeper analysis … a parting out of the Whole … is what actually destroys our ability to see the Whole.

But even knowing that … there *is* a place for an answer or two. Your sincerity shows. You are to be commended.

Zork
  #25  
Old 25-10-2020, 02:27 AM
Johnathanrs Johnathanrs is offline
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Join Date: Mar 2016
Posts: 360
 
Zorkchop, I think your posts are incredible. I find a lot of truths in them. It feels like though you are getting ready to join what I call the intra-verse. I see a lot of Advaita Vedanta philosophies in your teachings.

What you label as high and low energy can be inverted. A question, what happens then?

If fire is high energy, and water is low energy.
If water is high energy, and fire is low energy.

What truth exists now?

Quote:
Originally Posted by zorkchop
Duality is not separation. No one can actually separate themselves from God.

What I am asking above might completely change your perspective. Even open up a whole new frontier of possibilities. Enjoy the ride my friend.
  #26  
Old 25-10-2020, 03:28 PM
zorkchop zorkchop is offline
Guide
Join Date: Apr 2019
Posts: 698
 
Johnathanrs …

Thank you for your input. I’m glad you find some value in what I put out.

If you have read many or most of my posts … you will have seen by now that all is a progression. LIFE teaches … and people long ago collected some understood-at-that-time concepts and principles and made the “Advaita Vedanta” philosophies out of them. They are to be commended … they have established a widely-known religion / philosophy that many can learn from.

When one has learned most all one can from any set of teachings … they move on. The teaching of 1+1=2 is a teaching that even the advanced mathematician will use.

The collection of teachings called “Advaita Vedanta” are called that by those that follow them … or are well known to them. Those who have yet to discover their worth will call them gibberish. Those who have moved beyond them will call them some of the lessons to be learned in the psychic worlds.

As far as fire and water goes … fire is an enflaming energy … or can be … and water is a settling / resting energy … or can be. Fire can be all the way from the electrical impulses that fire through our physical bodies to the monstrous tail of the comet. Water can be a droplet in a gentle mist or the rage of a massive waterfall on the Amazon.

Energy is energy … to be used as necessary … and can be directed according to the abilities of those directing it. Energy … is of the lower psychic worlds and is a “tool” or an element that we learned to adapt to … and utilize. The inner symbols of “fire” or “water” can be inwardly used for many assistive behaviors and patterns.

“Energy” is certainly learned to be appreciated here … for what it is. It can be a complicated understanding … or a simplified, practical one. As always … truth is often a perception from where one “is” at the moment.

You have traveled well.

On we go.
  #27  
Old 25-10-2020, 04:25 PM
HITESH SHAH HITESH SHAH is offline
Master
Join Date: Apr 2019
Posts: 1,186
 
blog post

Hi Zorkchop ,

Must thank you for an elaborate blog posts about your spiritual journey and how it can help any one . It's highly appreciated and once again thank you very much .

I have a humble feedback on below remark .
Quote:
Originally Posted by zorkchop
The Core Creator God ( generic term ) did not create Soul to eventually come back to IT and become one with IT and then surrender all experience to God and just … become a floating entity without responsibility to its own stance within LIFE as the Whole that IT is. God did not create Soul to discover all of this through experience … and then get to the point where you unplug and float. Even to mind … that does not make sense … but one cannot dismiss the incredible desire for endless R&R … a cessation to the turmoil and struggle … and the endless mental chatter. Without doubt … there is the extreme desire to find total respite from the perpetual hassles of daily life … and union with God would fill that bill perfectly.

In religious circles generally there is an escapist path to God . Person is troubled here and as an escape to trouble route to God makes sense . There is nothing wrong in it so long as it leads one to real life purpose .

Side effect of that is a perception like person becomes a floating entity without responsibility to its stance within life . With true understanding of spirituality and any religion , person becoming one / non-dual with God is still full of energy charm cheers responsibility . If you would have studied the life span of great masters / God , you would realize they were full of life and responsibility when they lived .

There is another perspective that there is greater / better life with spirituality and to experience that better life one has to understand /appreciate and practice spirituality . With this perspective small and young people , rich /affluent/powerful /celebrities get to understand /enjoy and practice spirituality . With escapist perspective alone , spirituality simply remains weak mental psychological support system of the troubled / weak / sick /aged / poor .That's certainly not the point and focus of spirituality .
  #28  
Old 26-10-2020, 02:47 PM
zorkchop zorkchop is offline
Guide
Join Date: Apr 2019
Posts: 698
 
Hitesh Shah …

Thank you for your kind observations. Altho the posts are indeed about “my” spiritual journey … the posts are geared towards what most anyone will discover when the greater heights are reached. There certainly will be additional discoveries added to all of this.

Tho my gathering of posts may be “elaborate” … they can by no means be complete. Your points are valid and well taken. Individual perspectives on all of this is a great part of what makes the Path so endless.

Thank you for adding to what is being said here.
  #29  
Old 26-10-2020, 03:33 PM
Miss Hepburn Miss Hepburn is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnathanrs
Zorkchop, I think your posts are incredible. I find a lot of truths in them.
So do I.
__________________


.
*I'll text in Navy Blue when I'm speaking as a Mod. :)

Prepare yourself for the coming astral journey of death by daily riding in the balloon of God-perception.
Through delusion you are perceiving yourself as a bundle of flesh and bones, which at best is a nest of troubles.
Meditate unceasingly, that you may quickly behold yourself as the Infinite Essence, free from every form of misery. ~Paramahansa's Guru's Guru.


  #30  
Old 26-10-2020, 04:33 PM
zorkchop zorkchop is offline
Guide
Join Date: Apr 2019
Posts: 698
 
Considerations Nine …

God

Irritation level … moderate

- - o-0-O-O-0-o - -

To talk about God is to talk about the ineffable … there are no words that can accurately describe what God is.

All of Existence can be somewhat described as a massive sphere … and the word “massive” falls WaY short. Considering the size of just the physical universe … the spawning of all that exudes from the Core must be simply ineffable … indescribable … beyond words. That is a main reason why the entire Existence of the Core Creator God (CCG)(generic term) is often termed as just … IS. IT IS … IT simply exists.

From the Center this Existence of God gives off what might be called an Essence … somewhat like an aura … and this exudes outwardly … radiating from the center like an ever-expanding Life Force. This Force has been called many things … from Divine Spirit … Pure Spirit … Holy Ghost … etc. This Force has nothing to do with any negative element as of yet. The expansion is given IT’s outward expression by the Force of the CCG giving IT off in the first place.

The farther away from the Center … the “slower” it gets. It finally arrives at an “area” where the negative element is added … obviously an “area” of much upheaval.

From here … things can now be manifested … and “energy” is established as we know it. It continues to slow … and eventually resolves into the ever-expanding solidarity of the outer rim … the physical universe. A handy observation of this is the point of entry … where the Astral slows enough to manifest the physical. This upheaval is often given the term of Big Bang. You can imagine the various occurrences of the previous dimensions slowing to form each one. An astounding … quite beautiful expression. Truly amazing.

The CCG that sets all of this in existence remains as IT IS. A hierarchy is carried on down through the levels and by the time the psychic worlds are created … a separate, “Negative Energy” is manifested there … to deal with the negative element in the lower worlds manifestations.

There are hierarchal “gods” that maintain and control all of this. These are the gods of the various religions and philosophies. They each have their place. They each have their duties. Without their interaction … these psychic worlds would dissipate.

These psychic gods can certainly perform miraculous things within their own designated worlds. Since these lower worlds all revolve around balance … karma … and the establishment of reincarnation allow for the originating and the settling of the karmic influences within the realms themselves and all the way to the individual … an amazing number of names and declarations / responsibilities have been given to these various gods at and within their various levels.

For the most part … the “bad things” that happen are of our own volition … often spawned from ignorance. We often “pay off” karmic influences from lifetimes ago … without knowing the “why” of it in the present lifetime. Slowly the influences are balanced and things greatly ease up … altho while here in these worlds … each individual must adhere to the Laws of Karma … by whatever name one wishes to use there. Even the “gods” running this show will eventually have to resolve their positions.

So … is there a God?

Yes.

Is or are their Gods that fulfill what the religions and philosophies promote?

Yes.

Are they the same?

Absolutely not.

The lower world Gods are here to maintain the psychic realms with which we interact here … and we each constantly get ourselves into our own designed messes from which we invariably ask for relief. When we work our way out of each karmic influence … we will get relief. Until we get this under our control … we habitually just pile influence upon influence.

(Again … don’t shoot the messenger. I didn’t design this.)

Each individual will follow the “gods” of their choice. I will say this … as I have often said … this entire schoolroom is absolutely ruthless … and that is an understatement.

- - o-0-O-O-0-o - -

I’m going to be moving away from the rather contentious topics for a while. A post just above gave another reference to these entries being more of a “blog” post … and I will admit … I don’t … and haven’t … read any “blogs” so I don’t really know what makes these posts as such. It might be that I initially asked to not comment on these posts and just let me put my information in “unopposed” in a sense.

If that’s the case … then I will state here … in my observation … this is the reason why many of posted topics get side-tracked and waylaid … and lose the impact that the topic could have. Many people just want to oppose … to counter … and then the entire post gets caught up in a bickering match. Maybe 10-20 posts later … it somewhat gets back on the initial topic.

Hopefully many who have read these posts can now get a sense that this whole Path scenario *does indeed* follow somewhat of a sequential, progressive order … and the bickering destroys the overview perspective of that. Someone wishes to get caught up in *this* puzzle piece whereas if they waited a bit and see how and where that puzzle piece fit … he contention may ease up a bit.

One thing one does discover over time … you have to let this stuff work *for* you. Every little facet can be confronted and argued over. Ego wishes to believe that *I* know what’s right and *you* don’t.

Doing this just makes discovery all the more difficult … but it is also a deep, deep part of the human condition. It will never stop.

But as you can see … I do not mind comments … and have tried to respond. Feel free to do so. I try to post every 2-3 days.

More later.
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