Ego is a good thing

[freebird]

Originally Posted by ketzer

Perhaps we did, I think that is entirely possible, but I do not remember it. Now, perhaps, I will get more from having the conversation without remembering our agreement, or perhaps less, but what is certain is the context and therefor qualia of the conversation will be different one way vs the other.

Yes, bring them on, perhaps you can get me to form and retrieve a memory of that conversation. However, that should not convince me or anyone else with certainty that it actually took place.

Perhaps if you enlist Julia to help you.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NfPLTtlo2oY

For sure I'll hire Julia, but perhaps I do remember right before getting kicked out of the spacecraft, that we agreed to have a conversation.

Maybe you in another Everettian world do realize this, and I don't...

[A human Being]

Thanks for the feedback, guys, though I'm familiar with the theory - I was just confused by the wording of that one sentence. Appreciate your responses though

Originally Posted by freebird

Regarding OBEs...then again, how do we know they're nothing more than simple brain 'hallucinations'? caused by some imbalances within the brain?

Sure it's possible but...

1 - OBEs during NDEs and when the brain is for all intents and purposes shut down like in cardiac arrest or the Pam Reynolds case. https://youtu.be/WNbdUEqDB-k

2 - My OBE was at four months old and it's hard for me to believe a brain at that age was able to have the cognition of that OBE.

3 - I've had my share of artificially induced altered states of mind and I suppose in a way that qualifies as a chemical imbalance in the brain. In no way, shape or form do any of those experiences have the clarity, vividness or retention of my OBE from over 60 years ago and survivors of NDEs pretty much say the same.

Originally Posted by A human Being

Thanks for the feedback, guys, though I'm familiar with the theory - I was just confused by the wording of that one sentence. Appreciate your responses though

I hear ya. Language is often a stumbling block in these discussions.

[A human Being]

Originally Posted by Miss Hepburn

Hi, ( I think I've known you longer than anyone here!!)

I'm persistent like a rash, Miss H (and only about twice as irritating, ahem!).

[A human Being]

Originally Posted by ketzer

I can't speak for JASGsper, (... though I like to think about the silly things he would say if I could) but I think I would have to say yes. Yet that does not mean it is not real. The "I" we think of as "I" is just a collection of thoughts and associated feelings that the mind has created and bounded off from all the other thoughts and feelings and designated as "I", "me", or "self".

The forum would be all the poorer without your silliness, ketz

[A human Being]

Originally Posted by JustASimpleGuy

I hear ya. Language is often a stumbling block in these discussions.

Ain't that the truth!

[freebird]

Originally Posted by JustASimpleGuy

Sure it's possible but...

1 - OBEs during NDEs and when the brain is for all intents and purposes shut down like in cardiac arrest or the Pam Reynolds case. https://youtu.be/WNbdUEqDB-k

2 - My OBE was at four months old and it's hard for me to believe a brain at that age was able to have the cognition of that OBE.

3 - I've had my share of artificially induced altered states of mind and I suppose in a way that qualifies as a chemical imbalance in the brain. In no way, shape or form do any of those experiences have the clarity, vividness or retention of my OBE from over 60 years ago and survivors of NDEs pretty much say the same.

Interesting video I have to say.
Regarding OBEs...why aren't they validated within the scientific community then? As far as I'm aware they're not accepted as evidence, let alone proof.

Whatever happens seems that the ego, the sense of 'I am' is gone...and I guess this is where philosophical materialism and idealism agree...Now some say that the sense of 'I am' still persists...yet those who say this were Near death experiences, not biologically dead...death doesen't seem to be like an on/off switch but mostly like a process...As far as I'm aware nobody came back from the dead (dead enough) to say that they retained their ego...There are those materialists like myself who think consciousness is nothing more than a byproduct of matter., which is sort of weird because we assume atoms are not aware nor do they feel something, yet we believe we as humans do..so the ego dies when the brain dies in this former materialistic case, so does the sense of "I am", so no possibility of being happy or sad so this might lead to nihilism such as there are no ethics and no purpose, then are those people who believe their ego will persist death, and now some materialists might be sad about that and living as an individual after death is sort of a paradox, which makes death sort of futile for the individual, then there are those people who just want to be dead and gone, some are happy that their ego perishes and some are not... and also...those who believe that whatever is thought of or wished upon death happens, so everyone gets what they wished for...though I have not won the lottery despite me wanting to win it, and tried so many times....maybe I'm not "allowed" by those selfish angry spirits.

Thus these mediums could contact dead scientists to help us out...but guess what...they'll use the excuse that they are not allowed to intervene in earthly business...

Going back to OOBEs I'd suggest the following experiment within the scientific community....say that a shape is drawn on a piece of paper, or a picture is printed out and enclosed within a room, then those OOBEs should have no problem to figure it out...unless they excuse themselves by qualia....yet OOBEs, mediums and channelers should have no issue in getting some details at least basic about that picture. Yet all what they say is conjecture, and to my disappointment am not trying to play James Randi's role here...I came a while ago with an open mind to find some answers but I couldn't, so far nothing shattered my materialistic shell...despite me wanting to have it cracked open

Think about it this way....some humans fool themselves believing all kind of made up stuff...some might have genuine experiences and some don't....so who is right? here I have to agree that there's no objective reality....yet in many cases science seems to be more rational and logic than just filling in the gap with human psychology stuff...

The materialist says that he/she is right, the idealists on the other hand says that he/she is right....For the materialist is quite simple...everything is matter full stop. Some idealists say that there is only consciousness...but yet I have to say that this consciousness is kind of silly....stabbing itself daily....committing suicide, hunting itself....all for the sake of 'experimenting', it gets just too complicated, as for the materialists we assume atoms are not aware and don't feel anything, yet we as humans believe we do...

I had some agreements while some of my relatives were alive that if there's something beyond, they'll come at least in my dreams...
Now of course I could have dismissed that as well...being something induced by my memories and desires....still to this day no medium and no dream was able to confirm that my deceased relatives were okay...so what can I state about their individuality? What happened to their sense of "I am?"
1) Dead and gone.... 2)Not allowed to intervene... 3) Not themselves anymore... I'd give more probability to either 1 or 3, as a guy who is using science on a daily basis for a living 2) seems ridiculously folly....just filling in the gaps

Originally Posted by freebird

For sure I'll hire Julia, but perhaps I do remember right before getting kicked out of the spacecraft, that we agreed to have a conversation.

Maybe you in another Everettian world do realize this, and I don't...

Could be, there are many worlds of possibilities.

I would rather not talk about that spacecraft though. Those lizard aliens are known for more than just rigging elections. I have no desire to start probing my head to retrieve some memory I am suppositorily suppressing.

Originally Posted by freebird

Interesting video I have to say.
Regarding OBEs...why aren't they validated within the scientific community then? As far as I'm aware they're not accepted as evidence, let alone proof.

Whatever happens seems that the ego, the sense of 'I am' is gone...and I guess this is where philosophical materialism and idealism agree...Now some say that the sense of 'I am' still persists...yet those who say this were Near death experiences, not biologically dead...death doesen't seem to be like an on/off switch but mostly like a process...

Physics can't nail down matter/energy. Neuroscience & psychology have an even harder time with consciousness. While I don't see an inherent conflict between science and spirituality it's best for each to stay within their own domain. One examines objective reality and the other subjective reality and in the end it seems to me neither can ever come to terms with whatever's at the very bottom of reality in a way it can be objectively examined and agreed upon and I'm perfectly comfortable with that.

If you're interested poke around my YouTube channel (link in my sig). I have a small playlist on NDEs and a large playlist on consciousness. Maybe you'll find something of interest?