Meaning of unison between good and evil

Originally Posted by Jyotir

Not true.

The colloquy between Krishna and Arjuna which constitutes the entire contents of the Bhagavad Gita, represents Krishna’s instruction to Arjuna on the nature of Reality and Yoga for the express purpose of accomplishing this resolution, evident in Arjuna’s acquiescence and assent to participate in the battle of Kurukshetra. Not only that, but Arjuna apologizes to Krishna and thanks him for the clarity of his instruction.


~ J

Perhaps, but that is not what I took away from the story. Arjuna wanted to know the rightness and wrongness of the path he would choose. He wanted to know the fruits of his actions and whether they would be fair or foul. This is a metaphor for what we all struggle with in life. Knowing what is the right thing to do to get the right or righteous result? Krishna tells him to realize it is folly to be attached to the fruits of ones actions. It is not within the mind of a human being to understand the ultimate result of their actions. Therefor, one is to keep God in mind when doing all things, and not to seek credit for the fruits of ones actions. Do ones duty as best as one can discern it, but always do it with the right intent in mind. Why you do something, doing it in alignment with what one believes to be the will of God, is more important, and more in ones control than is the results of those actions, which though you take credit or blame, are not really within your realm to know or control.

To translate that from Krishna to Jesus, we might say, whatever one does, they should try to do through love. One may take actions that are mistakes and do not turn out the way one intended, but if one did their best, based on what they thought was right (i.e. in alignment with the will of God on their mind as best as they can understand it), with a loving intention, then that is the best one can hope to do.

[inavalan]

Originally Posted by ketzer

Perhaps, but that is not what I took away from the story. Arjuna wanted to know the rightness and wrongness of the path he would choose. He wanted to know the fruits of his actions and whether they would be fair or foul. This is a metaphor for what we all struggle with in life. Knowing what is the right thing to do to get the right or righteous result? Krishna tells him to realize it is folly to be attached to the fruits of ones actions. It is not within the mind of a human being to understand the ultimate result of their actions. Therefor, one is to keep God in mind when doing all things, and not to seek credit for the fruits of ones actions. Do ones duty as best as one can discern it, but always do it with the right intent in mind. Why you do something, doing it in alignment with what one believes to be the will of God, is more important, and more in ones control than is the results of those actions, which though you take credit or blame, are not really within your realm to know or control.

To translate that from Krishna to Jesus, we might say, whatever one does, they should try to do through love. One may take actions that are mistakes and do not turn out the way one intended, but if one did their best, based on what they thought was right (i.e. in alignment with the will of God on their mind as best as they can understand it), with a loving intention, then that is the best one can hope to do.

I think in terms of attending school. No matter my loving intention, nor my suffering, if my answers / actions aren't "right" (whatever that means) I still fail that class, and I'll have to take it again. I don't believe that we get any wavers for good intentions (love), nor for working hard (suffering).

[FallingLeaves]

Originally Posted by inavalan

I think in terms of attending school. No matter my loving intention, nor my suffering, if my answers / actions aren't "right" (whatever that means) I still fail that class, and I'll have to take it again. I don't believe that we get any wavers for good intentions (love), nor for working hard (suffering).

and yet loving actions and even suffering may be lessons you have to pass through in one grade level or another...

[inavalan]

Originally Posted by FallingLeaves

and yet loving actions and even suffering may be lessons you have to pass through in one grade level or another...

Maybe. How do you know that?

Originally Posted by inavalan

I think in terms of attending school. No matter my loving intention, nor my suffering, if my answers / actions aren't "right" (whatever that means) I still fail that class, and I'll have to take it again. I don't believe that we get any wavers for good intentions (love), nor for working hard (suffering).

It depends on what it is one is really trying to learn. We learn many different things in school, only some of which are listed on the curriculum. Many of the skills that will take one the farthest, are not official subject matter, nor are they given letter grades, but nevertheless may make the biggest difference overall.

[inavalan]

Originally Posted by ketzer

It depends on what it is one is really trying to learn. We learn many different things in school, only some of which are listed on the curriculum. Many of the skills that will take one the farthest, are not official subject matter, nor are they given letter grades, but nevertheless may make the biggest difference overall.

I wasn't talking theoretically.

As when we die we aren't who we are now, our being loving or not here doesn't matter. It is exactly as it doesn't matter for you if you were a loving person in your dream. Most of us aren't aware that our dreams are neither random, nor purposeless.

Don't get me wrong: I'd love for people to behave nicer, to be more loving. But, it isn't realistic, it is in no way the nature seems to work, and it isn't necessary. Without politicizing this discussion, it is as Utopian as having a non-totalitarian communism on Earth: can't be done. Even more, wishful thinking makes people complacent, and they don't look for better answers anymore.

Originally Posted by inavalan

I wasn't talking theoretically.

As when we die we aren't who we are now, our being loving or not here doesn't matter. It is exactly as it doesn't matter for you if you were a loving person in your dream. Most of us aren't aware that our dreams are neither random, nor purposeless.

Don't get me wrong: I'd love for people to behave nicer, to be more loving. But, it isn't realistic, it is in no way the nature seems to work, and it isn't necessary. Without politicizing this discussion, it is as Utopian as having a non-totalitarian communism on Earth: can't be done. Even more, wishful thinking makes people complacent, and they don't look for better answers anymore.

What, no utopia? Well not with that attitude mister!

It seems to me that I learn much from what I experience, and what I experience has much to do with the way in which I see things. Anger and hate makes me rush to judgement and condemnation without first seeking to understand. I see an evil person whom the scale of justice demands must be punished. Love and compassion give me patience and cause me to seek to understand why an otherwise good person may do things that I see as bad or evil. In the first instance I see an evil to fight and destroy, in the second I see error to teach and correct. My attitude makes a big difference.

The student who comes to school eager to learn will do well, the one forced to come to school who complains it is boring will not learn much, attitude makes a big difference. If I take the rod to the second child, will I improve the child's attitude and help it to learn? Will I correct the child's attitude?

Yes, socialism as a system struggles. It relies too much on the better angels of our nature and gets hampered by the demons within us. Of course capitalism and free markets, and every other form of human endeavor suffers from the same problem. We live in the societies that we as societies create, not with just the rules we set, but more so with the we that we bring into them. Our attitudes matter.

Nature shows us many different examples. We can cooperate with it, taking only what we need, and giving back what we have when we are done with it. We can see ourselves as part of that circle. Or we can take from it what we want regardless of the consequences to everything else, constantly fighting to dominate it and keep it from killing us for a little bit longer. Denying to ourselves that we need be part of any circle.
Attitude matters.

[lemex]

Originally Posted by FallingLeaves

and yet loving actions and even suffering may be lessons you have to pass through in one grade level or another...

Nice add. Love may also be a lesson.

[inavalan]

Originally Posted by ketzer

What, no utopia? Well not with that attitude mister!

It seems to me that I learn much from what I experience, and what I experience has much to do with the way in which I see things. Anger and hate makes me rush to judgement and condemnation without first seeking to understand. I see an evil person whom the scale of justice demands must be punished. Love and compassion give me patience and cause me to seek to understand why an otherwise good person may do things that I see as bad or evil. In the first instance I see an evil to fight and destroy, in the second I see error to teach and correct. My attitude makes a big difference.

The student who comes to school eager to learn will do well, the one forced to come to school who complains it is boring will not learn much, attitude makes a big difference. If I take the rod to the second child, will I improve the child's attitude and help it to learn? Will I correct the child's attitude?

Yes, socialism as a system struggles. It relies too much on the better angels of our nature and gets hampered by the demons within us. Of course capitalism and free markets, and every other form of human endeavor suffers from the same problem. We live in the societies that we as societies create, not with just the rules we set, but more so with the we that we bring into them. Our attitudes matter.

Nature shows us many different examples. We can cooperate with it, taking only what we need, and giving back what we have when we are done with it. We can see ourselves as part of that circle. Or we can take from it what we want regardless of the consequences to everything else, constantly fighting to dominate it and keep it from killing us for a little bit longer. Denying to ourselves that we need be part of any circle.
Attitude matters.

"The Butterfly Dream", "Total Recall", Rick and Morty's "The game of Roy" ...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MH_Q...ature=emb_logo

[bobjob]

Has anyone noticed that the member who started this thread hasn't responded to any of these postings?

I wonder if that tells us anything?