The New Age habit of saying "It's all up to you, so deal with it!"

[Dargor]

Originally Posted by Really!

Thanks!
There are some people who believe their age entitles them to behave superior w/everyone even if they are not their child or supervisor ...
Geez, I'm old & do have alot of experience including alot I wished had never happened ...
Experience is to be passed on, not shoved down a person's throat or used to be an authority over people ...
At the same time, my 21&22 yrs olds keep me young by keeping me informed & up to date on what is happening in their world from what is currently being taught in schools, subtle changes in the workforce to how society is evolving from their youthful perspectives ...
My 42yrs old son is in the military, his former job was as a drill sargeant ...
Communication is his weakness w/anyone younger than himself even though his wife is the boss at home ...
He is condescending w/young people including his siblings; he believes it will make his brother a man & will prepare his sister & daughter for the world ..
I think its B S & don't tolerate it b/c he's not putting any effort into getting along &/or listening to them or conveying any type of information in a respectful manner much less in a way that holds their attention ...
Mom here has on many countless occasions reminded him he was once just like them - in learning mode ...
He believes I'm too liberal which is exactly how I raised him ...
Unfortunately, he's a d**k most of the time, I remind him it's best for his health & well being to find some type of relaxation techniques to help prevent high blood pressure or a heart attack, etc ...
I hope whatever helps stop being smug & aggressive will not disable him ...
Some of my juniors, close to my age & older still require learning lessons to humble themself, learn to use their knowledge & experience to help people instead of causing harm ...
Blessings ...

I agree. There are a lot of things I can't stand and one of them are arrogant old geezers who think they're everything because they're senior. And then feel the need to belittle and shun younger people. Funny thing is, most of my friends are elders who are either 40, 50, or over 60 years old and I am in fact literally the youngest in my entire friend circle. The youngest after me are 30 and 29, that's it though. And they all respect me a lot an deem me to be very smart and wise despite my young age. Only fools believe that wisdom is gained by living a succesfull life and growing old. One can be as young as me (24) and still be as wise as someone who has lived a whole life.

[Jyotir]

Originally Posted by Honza

This really annoys me. The New Age points the finger at me and says "I AM real". I don't feel it! I don't feel real enough to be God.

The New Age says I am 100% responsible for my life. Well, my life is in a mess and so is the world. What on earth am I supposed to do about it?

It annoys me that some people who have achieved success point the finger at everyone else and say "you are God; deal with it!"

I have a tenuous grip on reality. Sure it helps me to know I Am. But really; how on earth am I supposed to be 100% responsible? I am a human being! Not a robot or God.

Wake up people!

Hi Honza,

What really annoys you is probably the cavalier manner in which a necessarily arduous process is insinuated to be an instant achievement, especially when merely conceptualized - but not fully realized by the 'finger pointer'.

For instance, what is bolded above.

~ J

[Baile]

Originally Posted by Jyotir

the cavalier manner in which a necessarily arduous process is insinuated to be an instant achievement, especially when merely conceptualized

But... how can any communication here be anything other than a conceptualized explanation? The only way to possibly experience a non-conceptualized understanding would be face to face. And even that mostly requires belief that the other is in fact authentically living their process. With exceptions of course, I met with Thich Nhat Hanh, listened to him speak, shook his hand, and can say he lives his process authentically. He fills the room with it, in fact.

My point: It's not the other's cavalier anything as I see it. It's on me. It's about my own acceptance of the reality that people share the only way they know how, at the level of understanding they are currently at. Should I be upset that a mosquito isn't a butterfly? Or is it my responsibility to understand and accept the difference?

[Really!]

Originally Posted by Honza

This really annoys me. The New Age points the finger at me and says "I AM real". I don't feel it! I don't feel real enough to be God.

The New Age says I am 100% responsible for my life. Well, my life is in a mess and so is the world. What on earth am I supposed to do about it?

It annoys me that some people who have achieved success point the finger at everyone else and say "you are God; deal with it!"

I have a tenuous grip on reality. Sure it helps me to know I Am. But really; how on earth am I supposed to be 100% responsible? I am a human being! Not a robot or God.

Wake up people!

I find your reasoning & concern for it valid ...
They sound like "arrogant fighting words" that could easily get a misguided messenger at odds w/others due to their carelessness & being out of touch w/reality ...
Even though it may not have been intended to give that impression, presumptions can have consequences ...
It's best to be sensitive w/others & find a better vocabulary or explanation to convey one's beliefs that are not those of others ...

My reply in the thread "Alternative Facts" also applies here ...

"The problem with personally under developed spiritualism, philosophy or religion is one's own highly careless & dangerous susceptibility to take its information literally - out of context - as a fact" ...
This contributes to confusion & misuse when putting the information into application ...
As well as rampant overly broad defining overrides innate reasoning rather than being worked with to understand its higher meaning ...

Blessings ...

[Jyotir]

Originally Posted by Baile

But... how can any communication here be anything other than a conceptualized explanation? The only way to possibly experience a non-conceptualized understanding would be face to face. And even that mostly requires belief that the other is in fact authentically living their process. With exceptions of course, I met with Thich Nhat Hanh, listened to him speak, shook his hand, and can say he lives his process authentically. He fills the room with it, in fact.

My point: It's not the other's cavalier anything as I see it. It's on me. It's about my own acceptance of the reality that people share the only way they know how, at the level of understanding they are currently at. Should I be upset that a mosquito isn't a butterfly? Or is it my responsibility to understand and accept the difference?

Hi Baile,

I get what you are saying and basically agree, but to be clear, I wasn’t commenting on either the facility or inadequacy of conceptual communication, but rather, on Honza’s professed consternation and consequent annoyance (which seems to be the actual subject of many of his threads).

Evidently he’s annoyed that he’s being pressured by the increased responsibility imposed by the ‘finger pointed’ New-Age statement that “I AM real”; but somehow excuses (or indulges) the equivalent, by his own charge to “Wake up people!”...as if that command would expedite the process in others!

I was just observing the irony.

~ J

[Baile]

Originally Posted by Jyotir

Hi Baile,

I get what you are saying and basically agree, but to be clear, I wasn’t commenting on either the facility or inadequacy of conceptual communication, but rather, on Honza’s professed consternation and consequent annoyance (which seems to be the actual subject of many of his threads).

Evidently he’s annoyed that he’s being pressured by the ‘finger pointed’ New-Age statement that “I AM real”; but somehow excuses (or indulges) the equivalent, by his own charge to “Wake up people!”...as if that command would expedite the process in others!

I was just observing the irony.

~ J

I saw what you were getting at. You make a great point. You further clarified something there. I was trying to take the observation in a different direction. Because Honza admitted he got upset, and said he shouldn't do that. To me, that's breakthrough stuff. So now, to me, the useful exploration is what can we look at, in ourselves, to make sure we don't do this or that again? And you were examining that same question in your own way, I understand that.

[Really!]

Originally Posted by SlayerOfLight

Only fools believe that wisdom is gained by living a succesfull life and growing old. One can be as young as me (24) and still be as wise as someone who has lived a whole life.

Absolutely!
I believe old souls have wisdom like yourself ...
Some old people are not old souls, they're simply old ...
From those I've been in contact with, they have no desire to learn new information/develop it properly as well as have a lack of tolerance even when slightly challenged ...
They immediately try to silence or ridicule those who question or have difficulty understanding them; it's also happening w/many New Age practitioners ...

At my age, I have old geezer/gummer friends ...
A few are actually - finally learning spiritualism in AA or Al-Anon or Nar-Anon, however, since they're newbies or have had disruptions like falling off their program they have not developed their understanding of the spiritual & fundamental guides established by AA other than precariously staying sober &/or misinterpreting enabling behavior ...
They're awkward & continue to make bad mistakes including spewing off AA affirmations devoid of proper application & understanding making their use sound like "fighting words" ...
For example: "Look in the mirror to find your problem" or "Whatever we give energy to, we empower"
The sole purpose of their affirmations are to remind the alcoholic/addict/enabler of their issues only, and are not to be applied to all of society ...
Just like spiritualism, religion, philosophies & New Age practices all take years to learn & develop & are not to be applied to all of society as a whole - non-believers/practitioners ... (bold lettering is used for other readers)
For my job as a probationer officer starting at age 21, I also had to go through years of learning everything about AA, Al-anon & Nar-anon to recognize their stages in additional to providing interpretations & use of affirmations as well as gather knowledge about rehabilitation facilities, detoxing, medical services, etc ...
Their senior age or any age for that matter did not deter me from taking them before a judge to have him/her slammed in jail for combativeness, disrespect & defiance in following the terms of probation ...
Unfortunately, this type of brain disease responds to hard consequences & continues to be an effective method in getting them to rehabilitate themselves w/help ...
My work required strong spiritual beliefs & fortitude as well as relaxation modalities ...
Tolerance w/sick people can be extremely stressful! Arrrgh! Even though in their heart they can be good only at certain times ...

Some of my old childhood friends & classmates are stubborn & absolutely think they're entitled to be condescending w/younger people including their children due to history, except of course, their all around perfect grandchildren ...
In general, I keep our visits short, too much time w/them is enough to make anyone go bonkers or just b*t**h slap to knock some sense into them ...
I just pray they will get touch in w/reality again to make life meaningful ...
Love takes tolerance! Arrrgh! They're good people, otherwise ...

[Honza]

Getting annoyed isn't such a great crime. But I must learn to curb my tongue. The New Age does offer many benefits as well as offering numerous self defeating principles (so they seem to me). One thing I do notice is that everybody including myself sort of explains themselves but contradicts themselves in the same breath. I know I contradict myself in my posts. I notice that others do it too. It seems to be part and parcel of the spoken or written word. We deal with tough subjects here at SF. We try to say things which are highly elusive. In the end it is a process of assimilation and discernment.

[Baile]

Originally Posted by Honza

Getting annoyed isn't such a great crime.

If that's what you're taking away from this, then I'd suggest you missed my point and Jyotir's point. Curbing your annoyance is your responsibility. When we get annoyed, the problem is with us, and not the thing we're annoyed with.

Originally Posted by Honza

The New Age does offer many benefits as well as offering numerous self defeating principles (so they seem to me).

As does Religion. So why are you getting annoyed with New Age, and not Religion? I've met just as many finger-pointing Christians. This goes back to my previous post. This isn't about something or other that's wrong and annoying. It's about recognizing our personal biases. You are biased against New Age more so than Religion. And that's why you can single out one and not the other, when the fact is people involved in both do exactly the same thing.

If you had written, "This really annoys me. People on their various belief paths point the finger at me and say..." then it would have been a whole other dialogue. We would be discussing this very real human foible. Instead, by singling out New Age, it provided the opportunity for anyone biased toward New Age to jump on the bandwagon. A would-be examination into human behaviour, instead devolved into a "New Age is disgusting" complaint thread. See the difference? And the reason this conversation turned out this way is because you were annoyed. Your annoyance created and fueled these anti-New Age replies. Is it a crime? No. But you can see what annoyance does, it brings out those same annoyances and biases in others. Meanwhile the really important conversation falls by the wayside.

[Honza]

The difference between religion and the New Age is that religion does not say its all up to me and I should just get on with it. It was that particular aspect which annoyed me. By starting this thread I said lets examine this particular aspect of the New Age, which I personally find annoying. Others chimed in and said they find aspects of the New Age annoying too.