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Go Back   Spiritual Forums > Spirituality & Beliefs > General Beliefs

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  #221  
Old 11-07-2020, 08:58 PM
davidsun davidsun is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AnotherBob
Greetings Dave, for someone who is "more really committed to and engaged with others", you have a funny way of showing it, not to mention the fact that you have no knowledge of how I conduct my relationships. Your understanding of emptiness could use a brush-up too, btw. Blessings to you this fine July Day!
Ahh, you had to spoil that response by condescendingly 'blessing' my 'funny' way, didn't you? Didn't you???

I re-invite you to take me as one who shares his honest (well thought out, IMO) opinion for whatever it may be worth to those (including 'spectators') he shares it with.

My engagement is really with 'the truth' and anyone else who is able and willing to be similarly (not smugly) relationally engaged. You ever been married? Not all relationships are of the mutual 'adoration', "You scratch my back and I'll scratch yours" variety.

From the Gita: I will speak to thee now of that great Truth which man ought to know, since by its means he will win immortal bliss – that which is without beginning, the Eternal Spirit which dwells in Me, neither with form, nor yet without it. Everywhere are Its hands and Its feet; everywhere It has eyes that see, heads that think and mouths that speak; everywhere It listens;! It dwells in all the worlds; It envelops them all."
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  #222  
Old 11-07-2020, 09:10 PM
davidsun davidsun is offline
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Originally Posted by HITESH SHAH
One just can appreciate & imagine the tremendous intellectual honesty and modesty of a great person in recognising the contribution of others in their life.
My thoughts and feeling about Emerson ditto yours, Hitesh.
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  #223  
Old 11-07-2020, 09:51 PM
utopiandreamchild utopiandreamchild is offline
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Love is life, life is love. Live in harmony with all things. Amen
  #224  
Old 11-07-2020, 11:42 PM
davidsun davidsun is offline
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Originally Posted by utopiandreamchild
Love is life, life is love. Live in harmony with all things. Amen
I love Life, which necessarily means that I love the truth about Life. There is no way I can 'harmonize' with anyone who for whatever reason rationalizes things like that Life is ultimately meaningless or beyond meaningful comprehension, that 'true' realization is beyond mind, that he or she gets 'ultmate' knowledge from thoughtless silence, and that whatever he or she therefore 'knows' about Life is 'ultimate' or 'indisputable' truth. This is what those who posture as being fully 'enlightened' pretend and sucker weak-minded people into. Talk about a completely one-way communication! No way in either hell or heaven! that anyone who is really devoted to Life and, therefore, Truth can 'harmonize' with that!

I agree with you otherwise, UDC.
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  #225  
Old 12-07-2020, 01:54 AM
utopiandreamchild utopiandreamchild is offline
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Originally Posted by davidsun
I love Life, which necessarily means that I love the truth about Life. There is no way I can 'harmonize' with anyone who for whatever reason rationalizes things like that Life is ultimately meaningless or beyond meaningful comprehension, that 'true' realization is beyond mind, that he or she gets 'ultmate' knowledge from thoughtless silence, and that whatever he or she therefore 'knows' about Life is 'ultimate' or 'indisputable' truth. This is what those who posture as being fully 'enlightened' pretend and sucker weak-minded people into. Talk about a completely one-way communication! No way in either hell or heaven! that anyone who is really devoted to Life and, therefore, Truth can 'harmonize' with that!

I agree with you otherwise, UDC.

Easy, be an example of the change you wish to see in the world my friend. Love is a powerful energy and can penetrate even the coldest of hearts. We all want love, thats natural for us all, you've just got to find your way in, that's all. Amen
  #226  
Old 12-07-2020, 03:26 AM
davidsun davidsun is offline
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Originally Posted by utopiandreamchild
Easy, be an example of the change you wish to see in the world my friend. Love is a powerful energy and can penetrate even the coldest of hearts. We all want love, thats natural for us all, you've just got to find your way in, that's all. Amen
That is part of the change I wish to 'see' in the world. Too much 'naive' acceptance and support results in people not holding those who should be held accountable accountable. 'Soft love' (as opposed to 'tough love' ) will not turn a 'parasite' into a 'contributor', for example.

This is changing the subject omewhat, but speaking of 'loving' 'humanity' your way, you do realize that 'Jesus-loves-you-just-the-way-you-are' 'humanity', as presently constituted, is for the most part so 'parasitic' their unrestrained-growth is essentially a 'cancer' that is 'killing' our planet, don't you?
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  #227  
Old 12-07-2020, 10:07 AM
Busby Busby is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HITESH SHAH
Emerson believed in law of Karma . Does that interest you ?

Are you sure that Emerson would have connected this essay with Karma?

I'm not sure at all. In fact I think he was pointing out simply that repercussions are unavoidable no matter what. Simply because an act causes an effect. Karma on the other hand is a driven activity, designed it seems to ensure retribution ensuring that (say) a baby is born blind because of past deeds.
I find this a horrible state of affairs.

A little while ago on another thread I posed the question 'The Concorde Crash and Karma', in other words did the hundred or so people who died in that crash deserve it.
It seems that those of us who are karma fans were/are quite prepared to believe that various people and parties from various walks of life planned the flight, bought the tickets, boarded the plane together quite unaware of the fact that an invisible karma 'manager' had decided an American or Canadian (I can't remember) aircraft mechanic should assembled a small piece of a plane wrongly so that it fell off in Paris onto the runway causing one of the Concorde's tyres to burst its way into the wing. Thus ensuring that retribution should take place.

The amount of retribution to be put on hold in the mechanic's soul must be heavy but of course it is only fair.

Is it not?
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The constantly promoted belief (induced by religions) that we are born to be good and obey (in order to enter heaven) is a tragic error in the concept of the universe's plan and an insult to mankind's intellect.

'A clear conscience is the sure sign of a bad memory'
- Mark Twain.
  #228  
Old 12-07-2020, 12:49 PM
HITESH SHAH HITESH SHAH is offline
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law of karma

Quote:
Originally Posted by Busby
Are you sure that Emerson would have connected this essay with Karma?

I'm not sure at all. In fact I think he was pointing out simply that repercussions are unavoidable no matter what. Simply because an act causes an effect. Karma on the other hand is a driven activity, designed it seems to ensure retribution ensuring that (say) a baby is born blind because of past deeds.
I find this a horrible state of affairs.

A little while ago on another thread I posed the question 'The Concorde Crash and Karma', in other words did the hundred or so people who died in that crash deserve it.
It seems that those of us who are karma fans were/are quite prepared to believe that various people and parties from various walks of life planned the flight, bought the tickets, boarded the plane together quite unaware of the fact that an invisible karma 'manager' had decided an American or Canadian (I can't remember) aircraft mechanic should assembled a small piece of a plane wrongly so that it fell off in Paris onto the runway causing one of the Concorde's tyres to burst its way into the wing. Thus ensuring that retribution should take place.

The amount of retribution to be put on hold in the mechanic's soul must be heavy but of course it is only fair.

Is it not?

People dying in accident such as this is very painful . Definitely we must sympathise with the near and dear ones of dead and should not invoke karma rules to them to cause them more pains . If a baby is born blind , we should not become insensitive to that due to underlying karma rules .That is utter non-sense.Also it does not mean to stop checking how such incident happened and how it can be prevented and not to punish anyone who may have been found guilty of negligence or dereliction of duty .

As we know life consists of known and the unknown (rule finite can not know infinite fully ) . In the known field like jurisprudence /business /politics , law of karma is evident , logical and very much acceptable . In the vast domain of unknown arena (where luck also plays role besides many other tangible factors), divine (Karma manager as u rightly coined ) balances factors like past life actions of self /others , sub-conscious - subterranean under-currents , collective mistakes /good deeds etc and law of karma which could not be handled by the worldly arrangements is fulfilled (which many of us also love to call luck).Human mind may have difficulty understanding co-incidences leading to such tragic events but for the karma manager it is business as usual. In all probability retribution for mechanic may not be much greater because

1. He/she may have done it as per company instruction
2. He simply may not have knowledge of its repercussions.
3. He has not really gained materially in this .

If there is negligence of duty on mechanic part he/she can be punished as per law (worldly arrangement of karma manager)
Definitely the company employing the mechanic may be legally liable as per US/Canada law (worldly arrangement of Karma manager) .


In “The Conduct of Life” and “Self-Reliance,” Emerson exploits the concept of karma, and urges his readers to be responsible for their own deeds in this reference science article

Last edited by HITESH SHAH : 12-07-2020 at 02:18 PM.
  #229  
Old 12-07-2020, 02:31 PM
davidsun davidsun is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HITESH SHAH
IIn “The Conduct of Life” and “Self-Reliance,” Emerson exploits the concept of karma, and urges his readers to be responsible for their own deeds in this reference science article
Great article - thanks for the link, Hitesh. Good commentary in your post also. Its like Paul saying, "Whatosever a man sows, that shall be also reap." We sow and reap a great 'array' of things, individually and collectively! Its not just a simple this-tit-for-that-tat process!

To speak to the issue of 'death' which Busby brought up (which I assume you still haven't 'come to terms' with, Busby), 'death' is not the same for everyone. One person may experience 'heaven' on 'dying', another 'hell' - to point to just one instance of the kinds of variables which are in play.

Neither is experience of 'injustice' - in one person's case it might lead to bitterness and outrage, or maybe s/he may choose 'withdrawal', self-'insulation' and.or depersonalization as a 'strategy'. In other case, it might lead to greater (i.e. more active) compassion, caring and 'divine' relational involvement, in others. Check out what 'happened' to Neale Donald Walsh as a consequence of his experience of the 'madness' that is rampant in the world: https://www.facebook.com/40638047343...7344165127344/
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Last edited by davidsun : 12-07-2020 at 03:28 PM.
  #230  
Old 12-07-2020, 03:28 PM
lemex lemex is offline
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