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Go Back   Spiritual Forums > Spirituality & Beliefs > Death & The Afterlife

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  #11  
Old 23-08-2022, 02:02 PM
Still_Waters Still_Waters is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wagner
Sorry, but I see these two sentiments as leading to contradiction (unless he breaks off into negation of desire through unrequited completion--and even then...). But never mind that. I'm glad you get it! :)

There may indeed APPEAR to be contradictions when the Reality is perceived from different perspectives.

Consider how different a dream may APPEAR from the perspective of one who is entangled in the dream and from the perspective of a lucid dreamer who sees the dream completely differently (and apparently in a contradictory way).
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  #12  
Old 23-08-2022, 03:51 PM
Still_Waters Still_Waters is offline
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Physical desires are often very compelling/tempting until ....

"Physical desires are rooted in egotism and sense pleasures. The compulsion or temptation of sensory experience is more powerful than the desire-force connected with astral attachments or causal perceptions."


****

This understanding is very consistent with the various wisdom traditions, including but not limited to Buddhism (the Four Noble Truths on craving), Christianity ("My Kingdom is NOT of this world"), and so on.

Tibetan Buddhist dream observations (as in conscious sleep) facilitate identification of the various compelling desires ... both conscious and unconscious. Of course, this is NOT the only way --- just my own personal inclination in identifying and addressing them in some way.

QUESTION: How does one identify and address the various desire-forces that bind us to this particular world ?

NOTE: Physical desires are often very compelling/tempting until .... one discovers something better.
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  #13  
Old 23-08-2022, 04:06 PM
Starman Starman is offline
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Contradictions arise when we try to put into words that which is beyond words. In my out of body experiences I have come to understand that beyond this world we see what we have nurtured while in this world, unless we have a naked clarity of openness.

On the other side this world and the physical life we have lived here appears as a faint dream. The afterlife feels much more real than this physical life, and beings in the afterlife view beings in this physical world as ghosts and apparitions. Just as we here in this physical life view people who have died as ghosts and apparitions.

The most poignant thing about death and the afterlife is how it feels, understanding that there are many levels or realms of existence and everyone will not have the same experience when they leave this physical world. The body you have will correspond to the realm in which you dwell. If you are in a realm of radiant light you will also be made of radiant light.

How we interpret our experience of the afterlife is up it to us. Keeping in mind that you have always been in the so-called “afterlife,” are there now, and the only thing that happens at the time of physical death, is that you drop, or shed, your physical body and return to where you have always been. For most, those who have not forgotten, it is a very familiar experience.
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  #14  
Old 23-08-2022, 06:53 PM
Still_Waters Still_Waters is offline
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QUOTE 13 EXCERPT:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Starman

Contradictions arise when we try to put into words that which is beyond words.

You raised a lot of good points in your post and I am addressing the ones that caught my attention most in separate response posts.

I agree with you completely that "Contradictions arise when we try to put into words that which is beyond words".

Yukteswar addresses that point in a very similar manner:


*******

"Communication among the astral inhabitants is held entirely by astral telepathy and television; there is none of the confusion and misunderstanding of the written and spoken word which earth-dwellers must endure."


********

Such communication, however, is not limited to the astral planes and beyond. They happen here-and-now on the earth plane even though most people cannot even comprehend having lengthy meaningful communications telepathically without words. Such communications are really amazing and awesomely effective.

I have had such communications on several occasions and one such communication was with a Taoist Master in Chengdu, China, for over 3 hours. When the monks and the abbot could not answer my questions to my satisfaction, they indicated that I should meet with the Taoist Master but added that I could not bring my interpreter with me. That understandably concerned me since I don't speak any Chinese. However, they assured me that language would not be an issue. After what I thought was a brief audience with the Taoist Master, I bowed and left the room. My interpreter asked me what had transpired during the THREE (3) HOURS that I had been with the Master. I was dumbfounded to discover that I had actually been there for 3 hours but added that all my questions had been answered ... without words.

As both you and Yukteswar indicated, in telepathic communications of this nature, "there is none of the confusion and misunderstanding of the written and spoken word which earth-dwellers must endure." Hence, apparent contradictions will arise because verbal communication is completely inadequate to express what is beyond words. Also, so much can be communicated in such a short time that it would be virtually impossible to communicate in words.
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  #15  
Old 23-08-2022, 07:30 PM
Starman Starman is offline
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Still Waters, what you have shared resonates with me. You do realize that the depth of water was once determined by whether it was still or rushing, and still waters were considered very deep while rushing waters not so deep.

The communication that you speak of is like ripples made in water; throw a pebble into still waters and you get rippling concentric circles going out. That is the nature of telepathic communication. It is also the nature of intuitive communication. Rippling out like a stone thrown in very deep still waters.

Intuition or inner-tuition is learning from our deeper being. I have been around many highly evolved human beings; mostly back in the 1970’s and 1980’s when many teachers, Swami’s, Guru’s, etc., came to the U.S. and Europe from India and other parts of Asia to freely offer darshan and their teachings to the public, It was a very magical time for me that set me on a deepening inner path.

Lots of people think that they are walking a spiritual path when in truth we ourselves are the path which we walk. Good teachers are like mirrors but in my opinion the further we travel within our own being the more we let go of the external. When we see the light within ourselves we can come to see the light in others and everything else.

Love is Lord of all; the greatest joy in life is to be loved, especially to experience overwhelming intoxicating unconditional love that engulfs our whole being. It short circuits our mind and all our senses. Regardless of what we have done here in our earthly life, that pure love is within all of us untouched by this world. It came with us when we arrived here on Earth and will leave with us when we go. What we call love is the fabric of our deeper being.

Peace and Good Journey
Namaste
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  #16  
Old 23-08-2022, 09:04 PM
Still_Waters Still_Waters is offline
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QUOTE 13 EXCERPT:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Starman
In my out of body experiences I have come to understand that beyond this world we see what we have nurtured while in this world, unless we have a naked clarity of openness.

On the other side this world and the physical life we have lived here appears as a faint dream.

My first out-of-body experience happened many many years ago during an NDE (near death experience) and my experience was similar to yours.

On the "other side", as you duly noted, the world "appears as a faint dream".

Sri Yukteswar specifically notes the dream-like nature of the manifestation in passages that I have previously quoted.

The Tibetan Yogi Milarepa says the same thing as do others.
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  #17  
Old 23-08-2022, 09:10 PM
Still_Waters Still_Waters is offline
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QUOTE 13 EXCERPT:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Starman
[b]

Intuition or inner-tuition is learning from our deeper being.

I have been around many highly evolved human beings; mostly back in the 1970’s and 1980’s when many teachers, Swami’s, Guru’s, etc., came to the U.S. and Europe from India and other parts of Asia to freely offer darshan and their teachings to the public, It was a very magical time for me that set me on a deepening inner path.


Sri Yukteswar also stresses the importance of intuition, as I do.

****

“Unlike the spacial, three-dimensional physical world cognized only by the five senses, the astral spheres are visible to the all-inclusive sixth sense—intuition,” Sri Yukteswar went on. “By sheer intuitional feeling, all astral beings see, hear, smell, taste, and touch.

****

This intuition can be developed even while on the three-dimensional physical world as I'm sure you understand.

As for the gurus of the 1970s and 1980s, many of them had an enormous influence on me as well " that set me on a deepening inner path" as well. It was indeed a very "magical time". In addition, I accompanied my spiritual teacher to the Khumba Mela in Haridwar where I met the extraordinary yogis of the Himalayan caves and that was literally "magical". After that, I realized that virtually anything is possible in this dream-like manifestation.
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  #18  
Old 23-08-2022, 09:16 PM
Still_Waters Still_Waters is offline
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QUOTE 13 EXCERPT:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Starman
The most poignant thing about death and the afterlife is how it feels, understanding that there are many levels or realms of existence and everyone will not have the same experience when they leave this physical world.
This is very true. As discussed in another part of this thread, one's beliefs and desires can have a profound influence on the experiences each one has when they leave this physical word.

This applies equally to many "visions" and "near death experiences" as many of those experiences are consistent with the belief systems of the believers.

There are very important implications regarding this as one should purify one's self from concepts and thus better facilitate the clear vision.

Nisargadatta-on-concepts.jpg
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  #19  
Old 23-08-2022, 09:22 PM
Still_Waters Still_Waters is offline
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Astral Beings can observe human activities on earth

“The intuition of astral beings pierces through the veil and observes human activities on earth, but man cannot view the astral world unless his sixth sense is somewhat developed. Thousands of earth-dwellers have momentarily glimpsed an astral being or an astral world."

*******
Having had a mysterious 9-year connection with such a being during my formative years, it seems obvious that astral beings can not only observe human activities on earth but can also manifest and interact.
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  #20  
Old 24-08-2022, 03:12 PM
Still_Waters Still_Waters is offline
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"The nearly-free beings who are encased only in the causal body see the whole universe as realizations of the dream-ideas of God; they can materialize anything and everything in sheer thought. Causal beings therefore consider the enjoyment of physical sensations or astral delights as gross and suffocating to the soul’s fine sensibilities. Causal beings work out their desires by materializing them instantly."

*******

Such beings manifest on the earth plane as well. Very few connect with them as they generally appear quite ordinary with few or no "disciples". They often communicate telepathically without words or with as few words as possible. Most people seem to be drawn to the more popular ultra-talkative YouTube gurus and other self-proclaimed "gurus" for the masses.

Meeting just one of these beings can change one's life forever.

NOTE: One of my skeptical but intense younger meditation buddies recently texted me: "I was just reflecting how pretty much everything I have set out to do / prayed for ... has pretty much come true. I must be careful for what I wish for".

It just happens once one gets even a fleeting connection with one's "causal body".
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