Did You Receive the Holy Spirit When You Believed?

[sky]

Originally Posted by ThatMan

So going further.. an act of unconditional love brings us closer to that "primordial state" of complete oneness and an act of evil, mantains the illusion of separation creating more and more suffering, it's like denying the very nature of things.

You know, I've seen that when we do acts of unconditional love, even the smallest thing like opening the door to someone, there's a inner state of joy that transcends everything, it's like our beings are lifted to a higher reality, one of complete unity.I felt this joy many times and it was incredible, this is why one of my life goals is to help as many people as I can... sadly I am not able to achieve this as this moment.

So going even further.. the law of cause and effect decides everything, it's not that the Maker is hiding from us, it's us who are hiding from the Maker.It's all a matter of choice, do you chose love or do you chose separation?

The problem is that we may chose love but this does not stop others from hurting us... The evil of man knows no limits, our history is full of blood shed...

For the very reason I look at Christ, He showed a love that rarely you see in the real world, He prayed, while being on the cross, for the very same people who put Him there... There was a time when I felt that I should return evil with evil, but now I am changing myself, it's incredible but is very difficult because you look at the world and you see people doing things that are very bad.. even your own family acts just like the world... and you ask yourself, how, how can I see beyond the evil of man?

If you do things for others to get that ' incredible feeling ' then it's not unconditional love. I'm not saying that is what you personally do but just a thought.
I don't know what you mean by a ' Maker '. I personally don't see a maker, but that just me, others may.
Others hurt us because we allow them to by our expectations, we expect others to behave as we want them to and when they don't it hurts.
You can see beyond the evil of Man by understanding that it is the act that's evil not Man.

Of course this is just my opinion and how I try to understand the World and it's ups and downs, others will differ

[Dargor]

Originally Posted by ThatMan

It's hard to see the big picture when you are part of it, if the universe would be an "unconscious chaotic force", then there would be nothing, just chaos, and we see that things are very different, the whole universe is governed by laws and order.Imagine how incredible is this force that made all things, the complexity of this universe knows no boundaries, a chaotic force would never be able to create such things.

Don't take it the wrong way, but perhaps you should be reading more science books instead of your bible. To correct you, there is so much chaos going on in the universe. Our neighborhood just happens to be quiet. But believe me, sooner or later sh#t is gonna hit the fan because our solar system is on a collision course with another one, Andromeda to be precise. And even if that wouldn't happen, our douchebag sun (which is the source of all life on Earth, ironically) will take us with it when it dies. And trust me, that won't be a pretty way to go for all living beings on Earth so be glad you won't be alive anymore at that point. There is no law and order in the universe neither, everything happens randomly. Solar systems are born and destroyed, and no god intervenes with anything. Don't be astonished if you learned that all of a sudden a giant asteroid is going to whipe out all life on Earth tomorrow.

[ThatMan]

Originally Posted by SlayerOfLight

Don't take it the wrong way, but perhaps you should be reading more science books instead of your bible. To correct you, there is so much chaos going on in the universe. Our neighborhood just happens to be quiet. But believe me, sooner or later sh#t is gonna hit the fan because our solar system is on a collision course with another one, Andromeda to be precise. And even if that wouldn't happen, our douchebag sun (which is the source of all life on Earth, ironically) will take us with it when it dies. And trust me, that won't be a pretty way to go for all living beings on Earth so be glad you won't be alive anymore at that point. There is no law and order in the universe neither, everything happens randomly. Solar systems are born and destroyed, and no god intervenes with anything. Don't be astonished if you learned that all of a sudden a giant asteroid is going to whipe out all life on Earth tomorrow.

If the universe is chaotic now, then, please tell me how the universe was just few moments after the Big Bang, of course, if you believe in this theory? I would say that it's pretty peaceful and it will more and more peaceful because, according to science, the universe is expanding more and more, this leading to huge distances between galaxies... Laws and order exists, otherwise, there would be no universe, looking at the universe we see how all things seem to behave in a certain way, there would be no Sun if those processes that happen there would simply by chaotic.. The building blocks of the universe behave in a certain way for you and I to be here, without this "programmed" behavior, we would not be here..

[Dargor]

Originally Posted by ThatMan

If the universe is chaotic now, then, please tell me how the universe was just few moments after the Big Bang, of course, if you believe in this theory? I would say that it's pretty peaceful and it will more and more peaceful because, according to science, the universe is expanding more and more, this leading to huge distances between galaxies... Laws and order exists, otherwise, there would be no universe, looking at the universe we see how all things seem to behave in a certain way, there would be no Sun if those processes that happen there would simply by chaotic.. The building blocks of the universe behave in a certain way for you and I to be here, without this "programmed" behavior, we would not be here..

After the big bang, everything was simply put into place and formed as the newborn universe expanded. However, as ''peaceful'' as it looks when the universe expands, it may cause the dark energy (which makes up most of the universe) to become unstable since it doesn't appear to drop in density unlike matter and radiation. This, in turn, may lead towards the destruction of the entire universe known as the Big Rip. And on top of that, just because there is a law of physics doesn't necessarily mean a god is behind all of this.

[ThatMan]

Originally Posted by SlayerOfLight

After the big bang, everything was simply put into place and formed as the newborn universe expanded. However, as ''peaceful'' as it looks when the universe expands, it may cause the dark energy (which makes up most of the universe) to become unstable since it doesn't appear to drop in density unlike matter and radiation. This, in turn, may lead towards the destruction of the entire universe known as the Big Rip. And on top of that, just because there is a law of physics doesn't necessarily mean a god is behind all of this.

So you also love to know things, me too!

The thing is that the building blocks of the universe are programmed to behave in a certain way and when they interact, they produce a certain result, have you not asked yourself from where this "programmed behavior" comes from? There must be something beyond this universe, something that made all things to be the way they are.

[Dargor]

Originally Posted by ThatMan

So you also love to know things, me too!

The thing is that the building blocks of the universe are programmed to behave in a certain way and when they interact, they produce a certain result, have you not asked yourself from where this "programmed behavior" comes from? There must be something beyond this universe, something that made all things to be the way they are.

Maybe, but I very much doubt it. One can have a jar of salt, but I'm still waiting for a single jar of God. Until that moment, I'm not inclined to believe.

[davidmartin]

Originally Posted by ThatMan

So you also love to know things, me too!

The thing is that the building blocks of the universe are programmed to behave in a certain way and when they interact, they produce a certain result, have you not asked yourself from where this "programmed behavior" comes from? There must be something beyond this universe, something that made all things to be the way they are.

It's becoming obvious the universe is more mysterious the more scientists discover
Even maths reveals this, simple numbers are not even simple. What is the square root of -4? 2*2=4, -2 * -2 = 4. In maths a new type of number exists on another plane entirely called imaginary. So i2 * i2 = -4, but what is an imaginary number? it exists because its the basis for all fractal patterns. I wrote a program in Excel VBA that creates a fractal using imaginary numbers to see it for myself.
That's just numbers
What about quantum particles - these display extreme unexpected behaviour
General relativity - space/time is flexible (although hard as diamond) and nothing moves faster than light, or does it? Experiments show instant effects in entanglement but they can't be harnessed for communication, or can they?

The mystery of the universe being revealed by maths and science isn't undermining belief in a deity at all

[ThatMan]

Originally Posted by davidmartin

It's becoming obvious the universe is more mysterious the more scientists discover
Even maths reveals this, simple numbers are not even simple. What is the square root of -4? 2*2=4, -2 * -2 = 4. In maths a new type of number exists on another plane entirely called imaginary. So i2 * i2 = -4, but what is an imaginary number? it exists because its the basis for all fractal patterns. I wrote a program in Excel VBA that creates a fractal using imaginary numbers to see it for myself.
That's just numbers
What about quantum particles - these display extreme unexpected behaviour
General relativity - space/time is flexible (although hard as diamond) and nothing moves faster than light, or does it? Experiments show instant effects in entanglement but they can't be harnessed for communication, or can they?

The mystery of the universe being revealed by maths and science isn't undermining belief in a deity at all

The funny thing with math is that the human mind is performing every moment a very complex math ( and physics too ), yet we need to learn it to be able to use it, when in fact, that power was already inside, but it's my belief that it's simply not part of our awareness, if you understand what I mean.

[neil]

Originally Posted by davidmartin

It's becoming obvious the universe is more mysterious the more scientists discover
Even maths reveals this, simple numbers are not even simple. What is the square root of -4? 2*2=4, -2 * -2 = 4. In maths a new type of number exists on another plane entirely called imaginary. So i2 * i2 = -4, but what is an imaginary number? it exists because its the basis for all fractal patterns. I wrote a program in Excel VBA that creates a fractal using imaginary numbers to see it for myself.
That's just numbers
What about quantum particles - these display extreme unexpected behaviour
General relativity - space/time is flexible (although hard as diamond) and nothing moves faster than light, or does it? Experiments show instant effects in entanglement but they can't be harnessed for communication, or can they?

The mystery of the universe being revealed by maths and science isn't undermining belief in a deity at all

Speed of thought, traveling across the universe, from one spiritual being to another is almost instant.

[davidmartin]

Originally Posted by neil

Speed of thought, traveling across the universe, from one spiritual being to another is almost instant.

I strongly suspect you're right!
I'm no scientist but physics has proven instant communication is true from quantum entanglement, there's no hidden variables predetermining things, or wormholes (or even that they are the same thing). But so far do not permit useful information to be transferred this way, and that would break causality if it did. But scientists haven't got to the bottom of it all yet.
If instant communication were found to be true then... it would be an even greater event than alien's visiting earth because it would mean we could communicate across the entire universe with every other advanced civilisation out there
At the moment, we don't know what we can't do so things like this and faster than light travel we don't know if they are possible or not. It would be nice to know.