Experimenting with Church

Originally Posted by Morpheus

Again Psycho, an indication of lack of understanding, and a certain mindset.
Your particular perspective, as exampled in your quote, may fall in with Christian Unitarian, or otehr. Church either way is about community also. If Ego interferes or mucks up things, and human nature... it is not the fault of, "Religion". It's the fault of human nature.
Religion has plenty to say about it.

Psycho is correct, once you leave the folds of organized religion, it is like returning to a dry well if you try to go back. I conducted a similar experiment years ago, and it felt like I was force feeding myself brittle hay... there was no life in it for me anymore. And yes, the hypocrisy seemed to stand out seven fold when it came down the pike.

I'm sorry to see some folks taking jabs at you and not respecting your decisions Raven. And if I might add this; the full gospel people are the ones who will turn your brain inside out with their labeling everything as being from the devil... I always found it contradictory the way they would have jumpin' jivin' praisin' sevices and yelling about the great power and love of God... and then turn around and tell you that a spirit of lust or fear could come upon you just for watching a worldly TV show.... Not my cup of tea for sure.

[blackraven]

Originally Posted by lightworkerAu

Blackraven if you have had searching of metaphysical stuff and are looking for signs a conservative church will suffocate you and probably put you to sleep with boredom.

You wont hear about how evil the world and non christians are is from the pulpit these days thats all stopped now mostly. The old hellfire and brimstone days are gone.


If you want a real experience spiritually attend a spirit filled pentecostal service.

They are a real eye opener and more like a good time and really alive with signs and wonders.

lightworkerAU - You have pointed out the elephant in the room that was there before I ever stepped foot back in the church. I suppose I had different expectations going back in 18 years later that sermons wouldn't focus on the Old Testament but be tweaked to incorporate happenings of today's age. I was hoping for a renewed fusing of both Christian beliefs as well as applying those beliefs to modern day events. I was disappointed. Hellfire and brimstone was still a part of the service and the old "guilt" came back to me that I worked nearly 20 years to rid myself of. I guess it is that more than anything, that I am sitting with "guilt" again that I worked so hard to transpire and release. I don't feel like spending the second half of my life feeling unworthy when I need to show vulnerable family members that they in fact are loved by our maker and are worthy. So you're right, the very conservative church that I returned to suffocated me. I can breathe easy again. Like I said though, I respect all religions and practices.

Blackraven

[blackraven]

Originally Posted by Mind's Eye

Psycho is correct, once you leave the folds of organized religion, it is like returning to a dry well if you try to go back. I conducted a similar experiment years ago, and it felt like I was force feeding myself brittle hay... there was no life in it for me anymore. And yes, the hypocrisy seemed to stand out seven fold when it came down the pike.

I'm sorry to see some folks taking jabs at you and not respecting your decisions Raven. And if I might add this; the full gospel people are the ones who will turn your brain inside out with their labeling everything as being from the devil... I always found it contradictory the way they would have jumpin' jivin' praisin' sevices and yelling about the great power and love of God... and then turn around and tell you that a spirit of lust or fear could come upon you just for watching a worldly TV show.... Not my cup of tea for sure.

Mind's Eye - What do they say about if you haven't walked in my shoes don't judge me, or something like that. Obviously, you know what I'm talking about. I appreciate everything you wrote here. It WAS like returning to a dry well. I couldn't have said it better. I went there to drink, but there wasn't a drop to quench my thirst. Thanks ME!

Blackraven

Originally Posted by blackraven

I conducted a recent experiment. After being on these boards for a couple of years and participating in and reading other’s debates on Christianity and other religions, I decided to walk back into a church after 18 years. I wanted to see if my original religious upbringing would be enough to ignite my flame again and spark renewed interest in the church scene. Mind you, in the past 18 years I have ventured far away from organized religion of any kind. I’ve focused studying new age spirituality/metaphysics, meditation and a variety of religions and philosophies all of which have expanded my mind far beyond what I was conditioned to turn off my mind and accept in church. But I really tried to return with a full open mind for 3 months until I could no longer live the hypocrisy. Too often I entered the door feeling positive, full energy charged only to leave feeling deflated and 12 again. I also left feeling angry at the false rhetoric that was being spread to the congregation as truth. None of it felt like truth to me. I felt like I was compromising myself for a cause that I couldn’t support whole-heartedly. I was reminded very quickly why I left 18 years ago. I have resigned myself to return to what has worked for me all along and that is to have a relationship with my maker in my daily life without the need to worship in an organized religious structure. I feel stronger now with my convictions than before I conducted this experiment as I can no longer wonder if the decision I made 18 years ago was the right one for me personally. It still is. Despite my own revolution, I respect all religious faiths and practices.

Have you had a religious or spiritual epiphany that caused you to make a change?

Blackraven

Some fifty years ago, when I was just a young buck of 20 years, I wrote this poem.

I longed to hear someone express the words I couldn’t speak
Reveal to me the mysteries of life, which all men seek
So I sought the men of science who claim Gods body has no mind
They say the universe is growing but will die one day in time
And then the men of piousness with them I sat me down
But they say God has no body those men in flowing gowns
Then finally in silent dream just me and WHO I AM
We floated on life’s living stream with a pen held in my hand
‘twas then the veil began to tear in this Temple that is me
And here within this sanctuary, we saw the one that we will be.....By S-word.


The Logos; the invisible information which is imprinted into the universal animating principle, which pervades every living organism in the Cosmos, was in the seed that had created the body of one of your most ancient ancestors who lived before the Jurassic age.

At that time the Logos; ‘translated as Word’ had not accumulated the necessary data to create the body of a human being, and yet, if you are of the belief that it would have been impossible for (Man) the Lord of Creatures, to have evolved in the few billions of years that have been allocated to us by our scientific friends, who seem to believe that in all of eternity, this period of universal activity is the first and only period to ever have occurred in the eternal Cosmos; If on the other hand, you are not so naïve as to accept that this Galactic cluster which is being drawn into the dark resting chamber of one of the many Great Gatherers within the eternal space-time cosmos, is the first to do so, you may just have an inkling of what and who God really is.

The six fetal stages of the evolving embryonic cell that became the human body in which "YOU" the mind/spiriit, or the evolving godhead to that body developed, represent the six periods of universal activity in which and through which, the Lord of creatures was created by the evolving Logos within.---

Mankind was the very first born of the creation, who was able to comprehend the evolving mind that was the spiritual HE. Although it took six generations of universal activity for man to evolve, we see that after billions upon billions of years of gathering the necessary information to create the first human being, once created, it would take the inner Logos, who pervades all of creation, but an extra nine months to reproduce another human body in which a mind or spirit capable of self comprehension could develop.

Likewise, when this Galactic cluster is crushed back into the singularity of its beginning, the Logos within that invisible seed will, from the dark worm hole or tunnel of time, somewhere beyond the visible Cosmic Horizon, in another position in time and space, burst forth and create another universal body in the image and likeness of the body from which that seed was formed.

This may sound like a Synopsis but is in fact a Synostosis, the fusion of the two skeletal bones of evolution and religion, clothing them with one living body of belief. When separated from each other the two are dead, only when they are fused together and united as one concept, and clothed with the living flesh of truth, can the Godhead which has developed, grown or evolved in this universal body, be revealed to the world.

It is the Logos, ‘The Word’; the universal genetic code, that is the creative force who is the creator God, in who, “The Light of Man” has developed as the supreme personality of Godhead.

Romans 1: 18, ‘God’s anger is revealed from heaven against all the sin and evil of those people whose evil ways prevent the truth from being known. Because what can be known about God is plain to them, (he reveals himself in the universal body that he has stretched out as a curtain; as a tent; a physical body in which he dwells.) both his eternal power and divine nature are clearly seen, because he has manifested himself in his physical body through which he is revealed. So those People have no excuse at all. They know God. But they do not give him the honor that belongs to him, nor do they thank him. Their empty minds are filled with darkness and their thoughts have become complete nonsense. They say they are wise but they are fools. Instead of worshipping the immortal God, they bow down and worship before the mental image of a mortal man.

[Lightspirit]

Originally Posted by blackraven

lightworkerAU - You have pointed out the elephant in the room that was there before I ever stepped foot back in the church. I suppose I had different expectations going back in 18 years later that sermons wouldn't focus on the Old Testament but be tweaked to incorporate happenings of today's age. I was hoping for a renewed fusing of both Christian beliefs as well as applying those beliefs to modern day events. I was disappointed. Hellfire and brimstone was still a part of the service and the old "guilt" came back to me that I worked nearly 20 years to rid myself of. I guess it is that more than anything, that I am sitting with "guilt" again that I worked so hard to transpire and release. I don't feel like spending the second half of my life feeling unworthy when I need to show vulnerable family members that they in fact are loved by our maker and are worthy. So you're right, the very conservative church that I returned to suffocated me. I can breathe easy again. Like I said though, I respect all religions and practices.

Blackraven

some churches are so uninteresting watching the paint peel off the walls is more entertaining.

Dont write it off yet just try something else that sits well with you. Every church will suit a different personality. You just need to find some friendly spiritually alive down to earth people to fellowship with. It might take a few visits to find one but not always worthwhile things come easily.

Originally Posted by S-word

Some fifty years ago, when I was just a young buck of 20 years, I wrote this poem.

I longed to hear someone express the words I couldn’t speak
Reveal to me the mysteries of life, which all men seek
So I sought the men of science who claim Gods body has no mind
They say the universe is growing but will die one day in time
And then the men of piousness with them I sat me down
But they say God has no body those men in flowing gowns
Then finally in silent dream just me and WHO I AM
We floated on life’s living stream with a pen held in my hand
‘twas then the veil began to tear in this Temple that is me
And here within this sanctuary, we saw the one that we will be.....By S-word.


The Logos; the invisible information which is imprinted into the universal animating principle, which pervades every living organism in the Cosmos, was in the seed that had created the body of one of your most ancient ancestors who lived before the Jurassic age.

At that time the Logos; ‘translated as Word’ had not accumulated the necessary data to create the body of a human being, and yet, if you are of the belief that it would have been impossible for (Man) the Lord of Creatures, to have evolved in the few billions of years that have been allocated to us by our scientific friends, who seem to believe that in all of eternity, this period of universal activity is the first and only period to ever have occurred in the eternal Cosmos; If on the other hand, you are not so naïve as to accept that this Galactic cluster which is being drawn into the dark resting chamber of one of the many Great Gatherers within the eternal space-time cosmos, is the first to do so, you may just have an inkling of what and who God really is.

The six fetal stages of the evolving embryonic cell that became the human body in which "YOU" the mind/spiriit, or the evolving godhead to that body developed, represent the six periods of universal activity in which and through which, the Lord of creatures was created by the evolving Logos within.---

Mankind was the very first born of the creation, who was able to comprehend the evolving mind that was the spiritual HE. Although it took six generations of universal activity for man to evolve, we see that after billions upon billions of years of gathering the necessary information to create the first human being, once created, it would take the inner Logos, who pervades all of creation, but an extra nine months to reproduce another human body in which a mind or spirit capable of self comprehension could develop.

Likewise, when this Galactic cluster is crushed back into the singularity of its beginning, the Logos within that invisible seed will, from the dark worm hole or tunnel of time, somewhere beyond the visible Cosmic Horizon, in another position in time and space, burst forth and create another universal body in the image and likeness of the body from which that seed was formed.

This may sound like a Synopsis but is in fact a Synostosis, the fusion of the two skeletal bones of evolution and religion, clothing them with one living body of belief. When separated from each other the two are dead, only when they are fused together and united as one concept, and clothed with the living flesh of truth, can the Godhead which has developed, grown or evolved in this universal body, be revealed to the world.

It is the Logos, ‘The Word’; the universal genetic code, that is the creative force who is the creator God, in who, “The Light of Man” has developed as the supreme personality of Godhead.

Romans 1: 18, ‘God’s anger is revealed from heaven against all the sin and evil of those people whose evil ways prevent the truth from being known. Because what can be known about God is plain to them, (he reveals himself in the universal body that he has stretched out as a curtain; as a tent; a physical body in which he dwells.) both his eternal power and divine nature are clearly seen, because he has manifested himself in his physical body through which he is revealed. So those People have no excuse at all. They know God. But they do not give him the honor that belongs to him, nor do they thank him. Their empty minds are filled with darkness and their thoughts have become complete nonsense. They say they are wise but they are fools. Instead of worshipping the immortal God, they bow down and worship before the mental image of a mortal man.

Throughout the many years of this age of man, our ancient ancestors have tried to express in words, the genetic memories of past ages of man, which are locked within the body of mankind.

Because our forefathers did not have the accumulated knowledge of the universe as do we of today, they expressed those hidden memories as mythical stories in which is revealed the truth, if we would but care to open those stories to the light of today’s knowledge.

You have undoubtedly noticed in the majority of the God myths, that the heir to the spiritual throne of God-head, within an invisible dimension that co-exists within this visible three dimensional world, is born of an incestuous brother/sister relationship. Ie: Isis was the Queen goddess, who inherited the matrilineal throne of earth (EVE=The Androgynous body of man) and she was the sister wife of her brother Osiris, the spiritual Godhead and Lord of the spirits within the inner dimension, who was born from the same androgynous body of mankind, as was his sister, who is the invisible godhead to the next earthly physical androgynous body of mankind.

It was Osiris, who stood on the top of the stair case; (The top of the ladder of evolution within the inner dimension,) who was the most high of the underworld, the “Lord of Spirit” a spiritual androgynous enclosure of ALL the spirits of the people of that age of man, with who Isis was united as one spiritual being after the physical death of that body of mankind, in which "The Lord of Spirits" develops, and before she (The Goats) who are cast back into the refining fires of physical life, were divided from He (The sheep) who was the spiritual father of the God-child Horus, who was formed in the womb of his sister, the great androgynous body of mankind.

Isis and Osiris were not indigenous deities to Egypt but were introduced from the north. The cult of Isis has gone through many changes since the days of Abraham. Herodotus rightfully equates her with Demeter the sister wife of Zeus and mother of Dionysus whose body was torn to pieces by the Titans, then boiled in water (The baptism of water, which was the flood) before being roasted in fire; (The coming baptism of fire)

Zeus was the sixth child (The Spiritual Godhead born from the body of the most high that had developed in the sixth universal body) who was born to Time (Kronos) and Space (Rhea) and of the six children born to Time (Masculine) and space, (Femine) Zeus was the only child that wasn’t swallowed by Time immediately after they were born, and like Zeus, Osiris was born of the union of Space (Mut) and Time (Seb) and created from Nut (The primeval elements in space or in Mut) by Amen (the soul; the activating and creative force of the universe, or the Logos).

When Zeus was born, his mother ’Space’ hid him in a cave, a tunnel (A worm hole) and gave to her partner ‘Time,’ a stone wrapped in swaddling cloth, which he swallowed.

The stone swallowed by Time was none other than the philosopher’s stone, the concealed stone of many colours, the single stone with seven facets, the mystic seed of transcendental life, which should invade, tinge, and wholly transmute, the imperfect self into spiritual gold. E. Underhill. Mysticism, p 170.

The physical (Material) body of mankind, who was created on the sixth day, or the sixth period of universal activity, had evolved into a spiritual or energized body, that was able to pass in and out of the door that leads from this dimension of matter, into the dimension of anti-matter. And it is this new species that is able to descend through time, and bring the evolving life within the earlier five days or rather the five earlier generations of the universe, to their full completion.

And it was by a cunning devise of Metis ‘which is divine wisdom,’ that Cronos (Time) was forced to bring up the five children or the five universal bodies that he had swallowed before they had developed an intellectual species within them.

Those children who were swallowed by time, were the product of the first five creative days or periods of universal activity. Osiris like Adam was the first man to be mummified and Osiris is the god of the first of the five new made days. Budge—Book of the Dead, p. 627, “O Osiris, son of Nut (Primeval matter), I have given unto thee the Sovereignty of thy father Seb (Time), and the goddess Mut (Space), thy mother, (Lord of Space and Time) who gave birth to the gods, brought you forth as the first born of five gods, and created thy beauties and fashioned thy members.”

Isis was the most popular goddess from the time of Psamtik 1 (663-610 B.C) till the coming of Christianity, her cult appealed to the Greeks and Romans alike and when Egypt came under Roman rule, her cult spread through much of Europe. By the time of Christ, the chief center of her worship was in Rome. Isis is commonly depicted with Horus the child (Harpocrates) on her lap, and today, it is impossible to distinguish between the late pagan and early Christian icons of the mother and child, it’s almost as though the old Pagan Queen was stripped of her old garments and clothed with the new covering of Christianity, "The Bride of Christ."

[blackraven]

Originally Posted by S-word

Some fifty years ago, when I was just a young buck of 20 years, I wrote this poem.

I longed to hear someone express the words I couldn’t speak
Reveal to me the mysteries of life, which all men seek
So I sought the men of science who claim Gods body has no mind
They say the universe is growing but will die one day in time
And then the men of piousness with them I sat me down
But they say God has no body those men in flowing gowns
Then finally in silent dream just me and WHO I AM
We floated on life’s living stream with a pen held in my hand
‘twas then the veil began to tear in this Temple that is me
And here within this sanctuary, we saw the one that we will be.....By S-word.


The Logos; the invisible information which is imprinted into the universal animating principle, which pervades every living organism in the Cosmos, was in the seed that had created the body of one of your most ancient ancestors who lived before the Jurassic age.

At that time the Logos; ‘translated as Word’ had not accumulated the necessary data to create the body of a human being, and yet, if you are of the belief that it would have been impossible for (Man) the Lord of Creatures, to have evolved in the few billions of years that have been allocated to us by our scientific friends, who seem to believe that in all of eternity, this period of universal activity is the first and only period to ever have occurred in the eternal Cosmos; If on the other hand, you are not so naïve as to accept that this Galactic cluster which is being drawn into the dark resting chamber of one of the many Great Gatherers within the eternal space-time cosmos, is the first to do so, you may just have an inkling of what and who God really is.

The six fetal stages of the evolving embryonic cell that became the human body in which "YOU" the mind/spiriit, or the evolving godhead to that body developed, represent the six periods of universal activity in which and through which, the Lord of creatures was created by the evolving Logos within.---

Mankind was the very first born of the creation, who was able to comprehend the evolving mind that was the spiritual HE. Although it took six generations of universal activity for man to evolve, we see that after billions upon billions of years of gathering the necessary information to create the first human being, once created, it would take the inner Logos, who pervades all of creation, but an extra nine months to reproduce another human body in which a mind or spirit capable of self comprehension could develop.

Likewise, when this Galactic cluster is crushed back into the singularity of its beginning, the Logos within that invisible seed will, from the dark worm hole or tunnel of time, somewhere beyond the visible Cosmic Horizon, in another position in time and space, burst forth and create another universal body in the image and likeness of the body from which that seed was formed.

This may sound like a Synopsis but is in fact a Synostosis, the fusion of the two skeletal bones of evolution and religion, clothing them with one living body of belief. When separated from each other the two are dead, only when they are fused together and united as one concept, and clothed with the living flesh of truth, can the Godhead which has developed, grown or evolved in this universal body, be revealed to the world.

It is the Logos, ‘The Word’; the universal genetic code, that is the creative force who is the creator God, in who, “The Light of Man” has developed as the supreme personality of Godhead.

Romans 1: 18, ‘God’s anger is revealed from heaven against all the sin and evil of those people whose evil ways prevent the truth from being known. Because what can be known about God is plain to them, (he reveals himself in the universal body that he has stretched out as a curtain; as a tent; a physical body in which he dwells.) both his eternal power and divine nature are clearly seen, because he has manifested himself in his physical body through which he is revealed. So those People have no excuse at all. They know God. But they do not give him the honor that belongs to him, nor do they thank him. Their empty minds are filled with darkness and their thoughts have become complete nonsense. They say they are wise but they are fools. Instead of worshipping the immortal God, they bow down and worship before the mental image of a mortal man.

S-word - I will have to decipher and comment on the second half of your post later because I have to sign off for now, but I did want to say that your poem is quiet beautiful and seems to capture how I'm feeling at the moment. I especially like the last few lines! I hope you write a lot.

Blackraven

[blackraven]

Originally Posted by lightworkerAu

some churches are so uninteresting watching the paint peel off the walls is more entertaining.

Dont write it off yet just try something else that sits well with you. Every church will suit a different personality. You just need to find some friendly spiritually alive down to earth people to fellowship with. It might take a few visits to find one but not always worthwhile things come easily.

lightworkerAU - Ya, I just starred at the stained glass windows. LOL But I understand what you're saying.

Blackraven

[Blackraven wrote].................S-word - I will have to decipher and comment on the second half of your post later because I have to sign off for now, but I did want to say that your poem is quiet beautiful and seems to capture how I'm feeling at the moment. I especially like the last few lines! I hope you write a lot.

If you go to the poetry section, and open the Thread "Where the wattle trees are blooming," you can read some of the work that was written by me.

[Morpheus]

Minds Eye:

Psycho is correct, once you leave the folds of organized religion, it is like returning to a dry well if you try to go back. I conducted a similar experiment years ago, and it felt like I was force feeding myself brittle hay... there was no life in it for me anymore. And yes, the hypocrisy seemed to stand out seven fold when it came down the pike.

I'm sorry to see some folks taking jabs at you and not respecting your decisions Raven. And if I might add this; the full gospel people are the ones who will turn your brain inside out with their labeling everything as being from the devil... I always found it contradictory the way they would have jumpin' jivin' praisin' sevices and yelling about the great power and love of God... and then turn around and tell you that a spirit of lust or fear could come upon you just for watching a worldly TV show.... Not my cup of tea for sure.

Psycho is not correct.

Neither are you.

The alcoholic and the drug addict as example, refer to the salvation accomplished through AA as coming to sanity, and finding joy therein, in their lives.
A common saying among them is, "It works, if you work it."

Likewise, concerning the exterior sensual world, and this physical, "Matrix", in which all of us find ourselves, all are afflicted, and Faith through religion is the answer.
If you believe otherwise, then, you will find out the hard way that you are in error.

Neither you, nor anyone else is exempt. We are all in the same boat here, whether you think otherwise, or not.

When there is certain disaffection in place, when Ego is primary, nothing can be done of a true spiritual nature.
If there is a festering wound regarding an individual's spirit and psyche, "there is a balm in Gilead", for it.
Again as well, I have witnessed physical miracles in full Gospel settings, and services.

This is the Christian forum, so, sorry, who began the, "jabbing", as you put it, Minds Eye?
Again, joy is the indication of spiritual victory in an individual's life, which the Gospel, (Good News), is the fountainhead of, with respect to, "Living Waters".
This is why the Christians churches thrive in the nation, and the world.
I'll repost.

Sorry you feel that way.
When I leave my (Lutheran) church after singing a number of uplifiting hymns about victory and overcoming the world, listen to an exhortation by the minister, shaking hands with people and wishing them peace, and to be well...
I feel renewed.
Are perspectives everything in life, do you think Raven? Related to faith, and positive thinking?

We're blessed with rather a grand organ, and, a competent organist as well.
The music is excellent.
Joyous.

The foundation of the Church is the Gospel, and Jesus Christ. His victory for us, as had been prophesied through the many ages prior, as we read in the Old Testament books of the Bible. The Spirit beckons us to drink freely of the Living Waters, made freely available to all. God Bless you.