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Go Back   Spiritual Forums > Spirituality & Beliefs > Spirituality

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  #1  
Old 15-05-2019, 10:20 PM
zorkchop zorkchop is offline
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What IS . . . Spirituality?

In this forum category . . . individuals strive to understand the true nature of spirituality. Sadly . . . by design or otherwise . . . the world “spirituality” has been watered down . . . tweaked . . . misinterpreted . . . misdirected . . . and the understanding of the words “spiritual” today is a far cry from what spirituality truly is. Many other words lie in the same “misinterpreted” list . . . love . . . God . . . truth . . . relative truth . . . karma . . . etc.

The attempts by SO many to explain what is spiritual and what is not . . . what is spiritual development . . . why are we hare . . . is spirituality a trap . . . and on and on and on . . . are all attempts to coerce mind to literally “go beyond itself” and understand what it ( mind ) cannot really understand . . . BUT . . . that mind will happily come up with some vague, obscure, deceptive, feel-good words to claim that it ( mind ) DOES indeed understand what is beyond the mental realms. Without a doubt . . . the human state of consciousness almost delights in being misdirected. As long as we each continue to dabble in what we already believe to be true . . . then we will continue to believe . . . many times even beyond physical death.

This is neither an attempt to dismiss or criticize those who are on this section of “The Path” nor is it an attempt to claim superiority of any who actually have taken those rare and hard-won steps. And yes . . . please remember . . . that mind will gladly tell the individual that s/he HAS indeed taken these rather advanced steps when said individual has not.

All the vague, feel-good words like Void and formlessness and unity and stillness and such . . . do nothing to portray what is beyond the mental realms. These words have been used for centuries . . . or versions thereof . . . and mind will happily use them . . . and invent new ones when the words seem to lose their appeal and needs re-definition.

With that in mind ( pun intended ) . . . I will attempt to give an incredibly vague, generic, and only perhaps slightly beneficial attempt at suggesting what is truly spiritual and what is not.

Again . . . mind is NOT Soul . . . and Soul is NOT mind. Yes . . . Soul “uses” the mind to define, categorize, label, sort, prefer, dislike, etc. . . . what is going open around It ( Soul ) within these lower psychic worlds but upon retreat or advancement into the higher and into the True Home of Soul . . . beyond all mental realms . . . the true approach to LIFE that Soul Itself lives within has nothing to do with stringing words together into sentences to make LIFE understandable or believable. Yes . . . Soul can drop into the mental worlds and use such techniques to communicate with others . . . as is necessary when “here” . . . but . . . when in It’s True Home . . . it is not necessary and is not the way of approach.

So often . . . the word “spiritual” suggests anything that is not . . . physical . . . or of the physical worlds . . . whether an individual includes the emotions and thought with the physical or not. In reality . . . these are the psychic realms . . . basically because of their positive / negative nature . . . so . . . what is often considered “spiritual” is actually “psychic.” When we often refer to the understanding of “spirituality” is actually understanding our psychic nature . . . which is both ominous and vital in and of itself. And yes . . . technically speaking . . . since everything is manifested through Spirit . . . then technically . . . everything is “spiritual.” I understand that. Nonetheless . . . there ARE designations . . . for lack of a better term.

True spirituality is beyond this . . . psychic level. True spirituality has nothing to do with the negative elements of life in any way, shape, or form . . . or formless. True spirituality . . . where Soul Itself resides in the realms beyond the mind . . . has nothing to do with mental approaches. After all . . . what would be at this level would be generically termed “pre-manifestation” . . . and that is far from a Void or Emptiness. This level could be termed “pre-energy” . . . since energy needs the positive and negative to give the motion of the atom in its revolutions.

This basic level . . . the True Home of Soul . . . I am sure there are lots of mental words for this level . . . and there would be mental stances taken by many to demand that they are truly beyond mind when they are not . . . this basic level is beyond what mind even understands to be the building blocks of Life. Mind cannot go beyond itself to understand this . . . and . . . since mind is not a “part” of these upper realms . . . mind would have to go beyond itself to come to terms with them. It cannot. This is like demanding that the physical body can lift into the astral levels. It cannot.

So . . . if you were going to enter and live within “pre-energy” and “pre-manifestation” . . . and I mean ALL energy . . . where would that put you . . . poetically speaking? How would you “live” within that?

For most . . . mind will happily tell you. And it does . . . for eons. Mind is the way Soul interacts with the world(s) around It ( Soul ) while here in these psychic worlds.

There ARE . . . signposts. When you get into the “higher area’s” . . . you DO know it. There is no more speculation. And . . . the tools and the basics of many of the techniques used to “get into” these rather lofty areas . . . for lack of better phrasing . . . are hidden in the absolutely best possible place to hide ANY-thing . . . and that is . . . right in front of you. They are just not recognized as such.

There is also purpose . . . for Soul Itself . . . beyond just coming down here and having a good time and finding pleasure. There would be no purpose for a “Core Creator God” to realize . . . “Hey . . . I’ve got MYSELF . . . and now I’ll create Spirit . . . and then . . . Hey . . . I know what . . . let’s make Soul so It can go down there and just play around and enjoy bliss and giggles once It ( Soul ) finds out about this giant amusement part I ( CC-God ) designed for It.”

I mean . . . really? That is why Soul was created in the first place . . . or similar version thereof?

I wish it were that easy.

I’ll leave it at this . . . and see where it goes. I know there are those that do not like lengthy or “complicated” posts. To those . . . I apologize.
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  #2  
Old 16-05-2019, 12:06 AM
FallingLeaves FallingLeaves is offline
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I don't want to get into a discussion of 'what it is' because such things are tenuous at best.

It crosses my mind that if one wants to look one can also find evidence that would suggest that the desire to go 'higher' itself is one of those things that leads to all sorts of rationalizations. And not all rationalizations are in 'words'. I'm not going to say more about that unhappy topic though...

Anyway I'm really only writing here to point out that there IS an established way to use mind to get beyond mind. Basically, you set the mind loose on pondering itself and its own ways?

The taoists called this 'making the disease diseased'. It was apparently a component in the creation of 'sages'.
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  #3  
Old 16-05-2019, 12:42 AM
zorkchop zorkchop is offline
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Falling Leaves . . .

I totally agree . . . tenuous at best. That’s why I often used words such as generic and basic and such. If I made it any more clear . . . it could lead to issues for some. I’m not here to do that.

Lastly . . . I will have to kindly disagree . . . the Taoists way of BELIEVING that they can use mind to get beyond mind . . . that . . . I will agree with. It simply shows that the mind is completely capable of conjuring up anything to convince the mind to get caught up in . . . but . . . at worst . . . it’s a great place to spend a dozen lifetimes or so to begin to sort it out.

Mind . . . cannot . . . go beyond itself. Soul can go beyond mind . . . and nothing else. Now . . . if Soul actually did get beyond the mind . . . get a glimpse of those realms beyond . . . and then so quickly retreat back to the mental worlds where it would consider itself to be safe and newly enlightened . . . then that Soul could certainly believe . . . and to a degree rightfully so . . . that It or mind can go beyond mind.

There are other factors that begin to enter into ones path at that point . . . and it makes that Path quite adventurous indeed.

But technically and strictly speaking . . . mind cannot go beyond itself . . . but it can come up with all kinds of precepts to believe that it can.

All part of the Path.
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  #4  
Old 16-05-2019, 12:58 AM
inavalan inavalan is offline
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Instead of following others' spiritual beliefs, or recommendations, I choose to follow my inner source of knowledge and guidance. I believe it brings me closer to what I need.
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Everything expressed here is what I believe. Keep that in mind when you read my post, as I kept it in mind when I wrote it. I don't parrot others. Most of my spiritual beliefs come from direct channeling guidance. I have no interest in arguing whose belief is right, and whose is wrong. I'm here just to express my opinions, and read about others'.
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  #5  
Old 16-05-2019, 12:41 PM
Greenslade Greenslade is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zorkchop
There ARE . . . signposts. When you get into the “higher area’s” . . . you DO know it. There is no more speculation. And . . . the tools and the basics of many of the techniques used to “get into” these rather lofty areas . . . for lack of better phrasing . . . are hidden in the absolutely best possible place to hide ANY-thing . . . and that is . . . right in front of you. They are just not recognized as such.
"The Tao that can be told is not the Eternal Tao
The Tao is the Mother of all things."
Lao Tzu
The Tao Te Ching (depending on which translation you read)

If you (anyone you) are talking about it then it's not the Eternal Tao because it's beyond words, descriptions and definitions - which I think is what you're alluding to here. When your resonate with it you know that you know and it goes far deeper than the mind/ego framework. You also know that others know what you and they are talking about. it's called Gnosis, which means 'knowing without knowing how you know'. It just Is, all it has is Isness and words only throw layers of dust over it.

"It is like a finger, pointing at the moon. If you look at the finger you miss all of that heavenly glory."
Bruce Lee

The words are the finger, no matter how elaborate they might be.

Buddha didn't go to college, Jesus didn't have a Spiritual forum so where did it come from?
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  #6  
Old 16-05-2019, 02:27 PM
Sojourner2013 Sojourner2013 is offline
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Hi zorkchop,
If and when a person chooses to explore what Spirituality is to himself/his own experiences is the beauty of free will. The rest is all just fn extra credit.
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Speak a word for thy ideal. Not as to force an issue but ever constructive. --Edgar Cayce

Hope is praying for rain; Faith is bringing an umbrella
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  #7  
Old 17-05-2019, 08:01 PM
FallingLeaves FallingLeaves is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zorkchop
Falling Leaves . . .

I totally agree . . . tenuous at best. That’s why I often used words such as generic and basic and such. If I made it any more clear . . . it could lead to issues for some. I’m not here to do that.

Lastly . . . I will have to kindly disagree . . . the Taoists way of BELIEVING that they can use mind to get beyond mind . . . that . . . I will agree with. It simply shows that the mind is completely capable of conjuring up anything to convince the mind to get caught up in . . . but . . . at worst . . . it’s a great place to spend a dozen lifetimes or so to begin to sort it out.

Mind . . . cannot . . . go beyond itself. Soul can go beyond mind . . . and nothing else. Now . . . if Soul actually did get beyond the mind . . . get a glimpse of those realms beyond . . . and then so quickly retreat back to the mental worlds where it would consider itself to be safe and newly enlightened . . . then that Soul could certainly believe . . . and to a degree rightfully so . . . that It or mind can go beyond mind.

There are other factors that begin to enter into ones path at that point . . . and it makes that Path quite adventurous indeed.

But technically and strictly speaking . . . mind cannot go beyond itself . . . but it can come up with all kinds of precepts to believe that it can.

All part of the Path.

The mind can also come up with all sorts of defenses for such propositions I suppose.

as far as the taoists I've long supposed some of them got beyond 'mind' as we know it but just found themselves lost in a more insidious snare and possibly didn't even realize they'd only traded one prison for another.

this place is horrible!
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  #8  
Old 27-05-2019, 01:37 PM
Azurr0 Azurr0 is offline
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Spirituality simply means the capacity to contact and get help from cosmic spiritual energies. It is pretty self explanatory, the spiritual realm is the realm of energies - spirituality becomes the ability to cooperate with them.
Researching different states of consciousness, going on what people call the spiritual journey, if it does not involve contact with energies, this is called mysticism. Therefore, most people here are aspirants or aspiring mystics, they are not spiritual.
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  #9  
Old 27-05-2019, 01:59 PM
JosephineB JosephineB is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Azurr0
Spirituality simply means the capacity to contact and get help from cosmic spiritual energies. It is pretty self explanatory, the spiritual realm is the realm of energies - spirituality becomes the ability to cooperate with them.
Researching different states of consciousness, going on what people call the spiritual journey, if it does not involve contact with energies, this is called mysticism. Therefore, most people here are aspirants or aspiring mystics, they are not spiritual.

Concisely put. Without needing an essay or lecture.
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  #10  
Old 13-06-2019, 01:24 PM
Terence3153 Terence3153 is offline
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Join Date: May 2019
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Zork,

I like your explanation of the role, functions and interactions of the soul and mind. It isnt wishy washy, nor vague. Very logical.

In the body, mind, spirit context, throw in the body and its senses into this mix, I would like to understand how you would describe its function and interactions with the soul and mind.

Terence
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