Spiritual Forums

Home


Donate!


Articles


CHAT!


Shop


 
Welcome to Spiritual Forums!.

We created this community for people from all backgrounds to discuss Spiritual, Paranormal, Metaphysical, Philosophical, Supernatural, and Esoteric subjects. From Astral Projection to Zen, all topics are welcome. We hope you enjoy your visits.

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest, which gives you limited access to most discussions and articles. By joining our free community you will be able to post messages, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload your own photos, and gain access to our Chat Rooms, Registration is fast, simple, and free, so please, join our community today! !

If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, check our FAQs before contacting support. Please read our forum rules, since they are enforced by our volunteer staff. This will help you avoid any infractions and issues.

Go Back   Spiritual Forums > Religions & Faiths > Islam Faith

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #11  
Old 16-09-2019, 07:50 PM
Pewdiepie Pewdiepie is offline
Seeker
Join Date: Mar 2019
Posts: 32
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jainarayan
Yes, this. It's like the story of the blind men and the elephant:

A group of blind men heard that a strange animal, called an elephant, had been brought to the town, but none of them were aware of its shape and form. Out of curiosity, they said: "We must inspect and know it by touch, of which we are capable". So, they sought it out, and when they found it they groped about it. In the case of the first person, whose hand landed on the trunk, said "This being is like a thick snake". For another one whose hand reached its ear, it seemed like a kind of fan. As for another person, whose hand was upon its leg, said, the elephant is a pillar like a tree-trunk. The blind man who placed his hand upon its side said the elephant, "is a wall". Another who felt its tail, described it as a rope. The last felt its tusk, stating the elephant is that which is hard, smooth and like a spear.

The Rig Veda says ékaṃ sád víprā bahudhā́ vadanty, "That which is One, the sages give many names". And then when we all disagree on what kind of animal it is, and who is right and who is wrong, all hell breaks loose, and the fighting begins.


But what happens when one of the blind men who touches the elephant is a murderer, rapist, and a property confiscator? Is his word any less believable than perhaps another blind man who touches the elephant who has good morals?

My point is. Regardless of what a religion says, people will still look to its founder as a source of inspiration. Well, what exactly is inspiring about Muhammad's personality from the perspective of our modern constitutional republic/democratic ideals?
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 17-09-2019, 06:56 AM
BigJohn BigJohn is offline
Master
Join Date: Sep 2018
Location: अनुगृहितोऽस्म
Posts: 12,515
  BigJohn's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pewdiepie
But what happens when one of the blind men who touches the elephant is a murderer, rapist, and a property confiscator? Is his word any less believable than perhaps another blind man who touches the elephant who has good morals?

My point is. Regardless of what a religion says, people will still look to its founder as a source of inspiration. Well, what exactly is inspiring about Muhammad's personality from the perspective of our modern constitutional republic/democratic ideals?
Is your religion based upon a modern constitutional republic/democratic ideals?

What inspiration do you receive from that?

You seem to know a lot about Islam. I am curious how much of the Qur'an have you actually read?
__________________


 
       ⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜

      Happiness is the result of an enlightened mind
     whereas suffering is caused by a distorted mind.

     ⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜


Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 17-09-2019, 07:22 AM
Busby Busby is offline
Master
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 1,350
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pewdiepie
You are referring to Roman Catholicism, which is a *******ization of original Christianity. Also the United States does not have a state-sponsored religion. Most of the ones who did those things that you described were atheist. I addressed your point, now can you address mine about the origins and behavior of Muhammad? Also the pagan country (Japan) supposedly attacked the USA first so I dont get what your point is. Some argue the nukes saved lives because the more would have died in a longer, drawn-out conventional war


The blind leading the blind.
__________________


What dreams may come when we have shuffled off this mortal coil.
Hamlet



What does a frog in a pond know of the world's oceans??
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 19-09-2019, 06:33 AM
Pewdiepie Pewdiepie is offline
Seeker
Join Date: Mar 2019
Posts: 32
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigJohn
Is your religion based upon a modern constitutional republic/democratic ideals?

What inspiration do you receive from that?

You seem to know a lot about Islam. I am curious how much of the Qur'an have you actually read?


I've researched Islamic concepts such as Taqiya and I have witnessed with my own eyes parts of the Quran that describe Muhammad's lifestyle and it is a lifestyle of conquest
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 19-09-2019, 08:24 AM
BigJohn BigJohn is offline
Master
Join Date: Sep 2018
Location: अनुगृहितोऽस्म
Posts: 12,515
  BigJohn's Avatar
Shia Islam is usually involved with Taqiya. They only represent about 10% of Muslims.

As for Muhammad's lifestyle and his conquest, can you recite the parts of the Qur'an where your "own eyes" " have witnessed" this?
__________________


 
       ⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜

      Happiness is the result of an enlightened mind
     whereas suffering is caused by a distorted mind.

     ⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜⁜


Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 15-04-2020, 11:05 AM
SilentDrum SilentDrum is offline
Pathfinder
Join Date: Mar 2020
Posts: 68
  SilentDrum's Avatar
Quote:
Allah is not the same as the Christian and Jewish God, because Allah's Quaran gives totally different commandments to its followers than the other two religions.


Let's say two people want to see the Atlantic Ocean. One is in the Us. The other is in Europe. A tourist guide tells the American to travel towards East then tells the European to head West.

Is the tourist guide lying?
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 02-06-2020, 06:35 PM
ketzer ketzer is offline
Master
Join Date: Jul 2017
Posts: 3,170
  ketzer's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pewdiepie
Allah is not the same as the Christian and Jewish God, because Allah's Quaran gives totally different commandments to its followers than the other two religions. Yes Christianity and Judaism have different commandments, but they are intertwined in a historical narrative where it is clear that the same God is being worshipped, the only main difference is Christians include his Son in the mix


Muhammad was a warrior. Jesus (Yehoshua) was a healer. Moses was a bondage-breaker. See the pattern? Muhammad's legacy is conquest, war, and subjugation. Jesus's was love. Moses's was being a Shepard of his newly freed people. It is no surprise that Islam is still militant in many parts of the world. After all, their founder was the biggest militant in modern religious history. Christians try to emulate Jesus (and often times they fail miserably at it). Islamists try to emulate Muhammad. Jews don't really have a historical leader (Moses was reluctant to do what he did, and he was a terrible public speaker, he used his brother Aaron to talk to the people because he had a lisp) . Well, when modern Muslims try to mimic their prophet, what do you expect would happen? Militarism aka conquest, submission

Is that why whenever Muslim's mention Muhammad they often follow with "May peace be upon him"?
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 02-06-2020, 10:01 PM
inavalan inavalan is offline
Master
Join Date: Oct 2017
Posts: 3,858
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by SilentDrum
Let's say two people want to see the Atlantic Ocean. One is in the Us. The other is in Europe. A tourist guide tells the American to travel towards East then tells the European to head West.

Is the tourist guide lying?
That's an example of blindly following "dogma", and not understanding it's symbolical meaning (if, and where, there is one).
__________________
Everything expressed here is what I believe. Keep that in mind when you read my post, as I kept it in mind when I wrote it. I don't parrot others. Most of my spiritual beliefs come from direct channeling guidance. I have no interest in arguing whose belief is right, and whose is wrong. I'm here just to express my opinions, and read about others'.
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 02-06-2020, 10:11 PM
inavalan inavalan is offline
Master
Join Date: Oct 2017
Posts: 3,858
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ketzer
Is that why whenever Muslim's mention Muhammad they often follow with "May peace be upon him"?
That's another example of automatically following dogma. It moves the standard (the default) of the normal. Saying it every time becomes an automatism and loses significance, but missing it becomes a big mistake, and gives reasons to accuse the errant of lack of faith or worse.

Although this is an example of freedom of thought restriction, isn't as damaging as other impositions on the adherents' freedom of thoughts are.
__________________
Everything expressed here is what I believe. Keep that in mind when you read my post, as I kept it in mind when I wrote it. I don't parrot others. Most of my spiritual beliefs come from direct channeling guidance. I have no interest in arguing whose belief is right, and whose is wrong. I'm here just to express my opinions, and read about others'.
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 05-06-2020, 02:59 PM
ketzer ketzer is offline
Master
Join Date: Jul 2017
Posts: 3,170
  ketzer's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by inavalan
That's another example of automatically following dogma. It moves the standard (the default) of the normal. Saying it every time becomes an automatism and loses significance, but missing it becomes a big mistake, and gives reasons to accuse the errant of lack of faith or worse.

Although this is an example of freedom of thought restriction, isn't as damaging as other impositions on the adherents' freedom of thoughts are.
Two Amens and a Hallelujah to that.
Yes, what we do and don't say in passing can often be very significant. I remember reading about how W would slip slight variations of sayings popular with white conservative evangelical Christians into his speeches as a sign to his base that he was with them even if he didn't openly say so.

One does learn to recognize these secret handshake phrases that serve as clues to other in the fold but may go unnoticed by those not in the know. For example, when someone in the U.S. pops up and tells you "they prayed on it" when discussing a dilemma or decision. It is often a sign that they are a conservative/republican evangelical Christian and are looking for your reaction before they let on any further. It is sort of creepy in a way, but it does help avoid awkward or confrontational moments. A proper response might be something along the lines of 'Did the lord give you some guidance?', or 'I will keep you in my prayers?', which is a reply that says, yes I am one too and it's OK to shift to a religious tone. Kind of fascinating.

Anyway, to get back to the thread topic, I do see value in this Idea of not depicting God as the human mind has a way of thinking about elephants whenever you tell it not to think about elephants. Even after all this time, and even through my concept of God has changed from my upbringing in the Catholic faith to become something very different, something without gender, species, or even form of any kind, my mind still goes back to the flying old toga clad man with the flowing white beard for a brief moment when I hear that word.
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 04:18 AM.


Powered by vBulletin
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
(c) Spiritual Forums