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  #41  
Old 10-02-2016, 08:57 PM
Gem Gem is offline
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[quote=naturesflow]
Quote:

Yes it shows in everyway of division if you look more closely at your own mind and how it does this. I would agree with what you saying about being a product that in fact reveals the nature of ourselves that is not us. It is in fact the world around us created and perceived by us into being. So in what you sharing here, it makes sense we at some point will get what we really are..in the whole process of life and death itself as the continuation. I say continuation only based on my own previous awareness of people passed over and what I sensed through them and their connection at those times. But I don't really know for sure.

.


Ah yes the story and others story, that was my dream space last night. Becoming aware of not entertaining others stories when you end your own to stay more present with what is. So what your sharing here fits this whole idea about process. I see that in how we get it, tolle probably was one of the first main roles to share this finding of himself which in turn opened a *new awareness* for people. We tend to believe that everything has to be a certain way, but potentially their is anyway to open awareness without entertaining what we know. If you think about it, if that other self is a product of everything else in the world we lived and created through, we end it all and how we end it all is our call. My feeling is through my own evolvement and awareness of myself, is that we can meet ourselves deeply and direct or we can take our time. In seeing both we then actually might have more choices and people tend to lead this awareness to support others to see this as he shows. Finding a space to actually become the witness of yourself in everyway you are created. Direct to ones knowing. Direct to ones awareness, which I guess resides in the void of all that is in you.

What is interesting though is that he in his direct to the void, opened up a series of books to share about his process and story, so he still entertained us with what the whole ripple of life in its continuation of itself does all the way through with stories and a process just moved in a new direction of itself. He found a point to enter into to create a story, that didn't entertain his suffering, but more entertained his awareness. And these stories probably made him rich in everyway. He found his abundance direct.

You know stories upon stories in everyway of themselves doesn't end while alive, unless you don't share anything and just sit in a room silent somewhere all day long... :)




Silent mind opens everything we need to live more consciously aware of ourselves in everyway we are.

When I look at the 'I' and 'myself' it's both the same thing, and not two things. It's a very subtle area because the personality is formed by all the past... if I could talk through this it would be a mighty feat... it's just that there no 'myself' as a story about me, just descriptions of my experiences and mannerisms from my upbringing, culture, age and gender. This comes out in any spontaneous activity and is not other than the expression of consciousness as Gem. I.e. consciousness is as I am. This leads me to suggest, all that about 'you as you are' is 'it'. The last thing I want to do is create an impression that anyone has to be different, on the contrary, How could anyone be different to how they are right now?
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  #42  
Old 10-02-2016, 09:03 PM
A human Being A human Being is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by naturesflow
Silent mind opens everything we need to live more consciously aware of ourselves in everyway we are.
Couldn't agree more, self-awareness is a radical and powerful tool, imo, as it helps to prevent us from being completely overtaken by the dream state (to be aware of ourselves as the one experiencing the thoughts and feelings, which is essentially what caused Tolle's realisation, I think, is what is known as being 'awake inside the dream,' though I could be wrong on that).
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  #43  
Old 10-02-2016, 09:22 PM
A human Being A human Being is offline
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Originally Posted by Lucyan28
Separation-Union just a dualistic perspective of a whole

but we still might need such words just to understand it with our logic/language.
Not sure I entirely understand, maybe you could elaborate? As I understand it, separation is an illusion and union is the true nature of life, which we fail to see when we identify with form (or to put it another way, when we think in terms of 'me' and 'not me').
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  #44  
Old 10-02-2016, 09:49 PM
Gem Gem is offline
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Originally Posted by Lucyan28
Hi Gem,

I believe that we all have many "MEs" inside of us, but the important ones are: the "Higher Self" the "Ego" and the "Observer". I used the " " because at the end all of those "MEs" are the same big consciousness. It is helpful to <<separate>> the "MEs" just as a point of reference.

If I may be frank, from my perspective, the accounts of different me's and selves is a tall story. I have no notions at all of a 'higher self'. In this thread I refer to Tolles definition of ego: A false sense of self created by identification with mind. I am the observer (and the observed in self reflection).

Quote:
Maybe the suicidal thoughts are some kind of message from your higher self referring to "kill" (transform) the ego (the lower self). What I mean is that you could be experiencing a transformation phase, which is exciting

These kind of transformations are really difficult but they're a 100% worth it.

I don't experience suicidal thoughts myself, but I refer to Tolle's account of his experience with it.

P.s. Please no hugs icons for me.
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  #45  
Old 10-02-2016, 10:44 PM
naturesflow naturesflow is offline
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Originally Posted by A human Being
Couldn't agree more, self-awareness is a radical and powerful tool, imo, as it helps to prevent us from being completely overtaken by the dream state (to be aware of ourselves as the one experiencing the thoughts and feelings, which is essentially what caused Tolle's realisation, I think, is what is known as being 'awake inside the dream,' though I could be wrong on that).

Yes I have heard it called being immersed in the dream within the dream, so in some ways this is kind of like seeing the nature of individuation within the greater whole state. I remember when I was awakening at a deeper level of myself, I had a lot of spontaneous moments of creativity. I do recall this day sitting down drawing how the awakening space felt in me. I drew all this little shapes all joining up together. In some ways it was ending separation in myself, stepping outside of myself to find me in the whole mess created in me in both feeling and seeing, which is what I was doing in myself as one source.

Now of course when you speak the way your showing, the reflection to that is that I would draw a circle within a larger circle for that realization.

But when I actually sit and connect intuitively to the depiction of now in myself and if I were to draw it. It would be infinite (impression of )dark space and light fragments like stars everywhere,so I guess I could draw that in part :)
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  #46  
Old 11-02-2016, 09:35 AM
God-Like God-Like is offline
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All me's are me ... like each colour makes up the rainbow .

Which colour is more real than the other is a non starter I would say .


x daz x
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  #47  
Old 11-02-2016, 10:44 AM
Gem Gem is offline
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Originally Posted by God-Like
All me's are me ... like each colour makes up the rainbow .

Which colour is more real than the other is a non starter I would say .


x daz x

I can't see how that means anything. Is it just said as something to sound cute?
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  #48  
Old 11-02-2016, 11:24 AM
God-Like God-Like is offline
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Originally Posted by Gem
I can't see how that means anything. Is it just said as something to sound cute?



If we associate the rainbow colours to an individual that feels happy or suicidal then each feeling had that 'me' feels is equally real / unreal .

Feeling happy or joyful is not more real than feeling happy / depressed .

This is my point in that all colours / states of mind are me ...

There is only me ... so any state of mind attained will be 'me' that is of that state of mind .

Tolle contemplates the suicidal me and the non suicidal me as two me's ...

I say there isn't two me's, there is only 'me' feeling suicidal and not .


x daz x
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  #49  
Old 11-02-2016, 08:20 PM
Mr Interesting Mr Interesting is offline
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I came across a friend this morning on facebook who stated, with an air of perplexed consternation, where are all the queer artistic post structuralists?

Now I don't know what post structuralists are so I googled same and found one one those elaborately constructed intellectualism's that is called philosophy so I went in and read stuff which meant quite a bit of stopping and starting to get my head around what it actually was, and excuse what might be my ignorance, but it seemed rather simple actually and merely stated that a reader can only bring what they understand to any writing. At the same time I was kinda thinking of my friend and wondering why she might require so much structure... for a post structuralist in the sense that the post structuralists were also into de-constructing whatever might have been the construction in some sense to determine the actuality of whatever knowledge was either present or in need of dissemination...

I don't know then if it's all quite paradoxical or merely irony that to advance post structuralism requires it sits on a defined structure.

In this regard doesn't post me-ism require to an extent the structure of me even if the me has been de-constructed to the extent that hardly any 'me' exists? Because without trying to be pedantic the body and the mind which seems the focus of the 'me' still goes on existing with all the other 'me's', as in other body and mind 'me's' and whilst some of the me's are less, and even completely far less constructed as all the other 'me's' even that almost non-me is still a me to all the other 'me's'.

So this me that is me has sat within silence and felt, and been entirely enamoured of that feeling as a whole existence, that unending formlessness as everything as nothing, and enjoyed it all rather immensely though within that too there felt to be an intentiveness to the body, a sense of it connected within the materiality of the world which required further investigation. That, yes one could go off and be within nirvana, as it were, but that the body still felt and was inquisitive as to the possibilities of less restrictive acclimatisation to materiality.

It's the almost like the structured post structuralism in the sense that identity requires re-embracing of itself in a kind of de-constructive process but not that it is de-constructed into nothingness so much as it can be re-constructed that the construction isn't the centre so much as outer layers... a part of many parts but not the whole as we know it.
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  #50  
Old 11-02-2016, 08:33 PM
naturesflow naturesflow is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Interesting
I came across a friend this morning on facebook who stated, with an air of perplexed consternation, where are all the queer artistic post structuralists?

Now I don't know what post structuralists are so I googled same and found one one those elaborately constructed intellectualism's that is called philosophy so I went in and read stuff which meant quite a bit of stopping and starting to get my head around what it actually was, and excuse what might be my ignorance, but it seemed rather simple actually and merely stated that a reader can only bring what they understand to any writing. At the same time I was kinda thinking of my friend and wondering why she might require so much structure... for a post structuralist in the sense that the post structuralists were also into de-constructing whatever might have been the construction in some sense to determine the actuality of whatever knowledge was either present or in need of dissemination...

I don't know then if it's all quite paradoxical or merely irony that to advance post structuralism requires it sits on a defined structure.

In this regard doesn't post me-ism require to an extent the structure of me even if the me has been de-constructed to the extent that hardly any 'me' exists? Because without trying to be pedantic the body and the mind which seems the focus of the 'me' still goes on existing with all the other 'me's', as in other body and mind 'me's' and whilst some of the me's are less, and even completely far less constructed as all the other 'me's' even that almost non-me is still a me to all the other 'me's'.

So this me that is me has sat within silence and felt, and been entirely enamoured of that feeling as a whole existence, that unending formlessness as everything as nothing, and enjoyed it all rather immensely though within that too there felt to be an intentiveness to the body, a sense of it connected within the materiality of the world which required further investigation. That, yes one could go off and be within nirvana, as it were, but that the body still felt and was inquisitive as to the possibilities of less restrictive acclimatisation to materiality.

It's the almost like the structured post structuralism in the sense that identity requires re-embracing of itself in a kind of de-constructive process but not that it is de-constructed into nothingness so much as it can be re-constructed that the construction isn't the centre so much as outer layers... a part of many parts but not the whole as we know it.

I juggled with this and tossed it around and it made me reconnect with Mr tolle and his experience. When I think *intuitively* about this moment after reading this share of yours, I see that even though Mr Tolle became aware of two me's he actually then opened to more. A view never seen before in himself because he was so heavily loaded by his depression. And in this realization of course his view and world opened in such a way that suddenly he was now immersed in everything he was and knew himself to be.

So in some ways their is no real deconstruction (as you show)going on for him in this way and Gem is noticing, just by being aware of something more in his own mindset and conditioned belief about himself, he then opens to more in feelings and consequently his view. Hence the morning after glow he experienced.

I mean their are so many morning after glows we can experience in engaging in more or experiencing something new overnight.. So it fits really.
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