Robert Adams

[Tara5]

Originally Posted by ajay00

Great observations , Tara. Found it insightful.

Thanks also for this highly informative thread of yours. Robert Adams is indeed a great master in his own right.

Thanks, Ajay. I am glad you found it informative.

[Tara5]

Originally Posted by Miss Hepburn

What exactly is the point you want to get to, daz?
I don't understand the need, almost like a grilling, that you're doing to sweet Tara.

Maybe, Daz is exercising his spiritual muscles.

I love Joel S. Goldsmith!

Thank you for all the support and love!

[God-Like]

Originally Posted by Miss Hepburn

What exactly is the point you want to get to, daz?
I don't understand the need, almost like a grilling, that you're doing to sweet Tara.
And why do you put a space before each of your periods?
Of course, you could then ask me.. 'Why do you feel a need to correct them all, Miss H"..I stopped, btw. LOL

I love Joel S. Goldsmith!

I am pointing out the differences between realization and man made concepts and conclusions .

I am pointing out the dangers of reaching out to the public as teachers proclaiming not to have anything to do with the world and the body just as an example .

Teaching of no self, non attachment, non duality, no ego is rife but much of the time under scrutiny nothing much add's up .

There is a lot about my energy that I haven't shared in regards to seeing through what's being said and what's being actually lived on a deeper level .

I will leave it that .

So what you may see as grilling Tara, I am simply asking questions that will cause her to contemplate what is being taught in reflection to her own answers to my questions .

Some don't want to see what they have surmised from contemplation because they have been influenced by other's to such an extent that they would rather follow what other's say instead .

Now what I am getting at, is the knowledge attained, the concepts attained that have been written down and followed .

It doesn't matter if it is the vedas or the bible .

Lets get to the heart of the matter . What is realized and what isn't .

All these teachers that state this and that about reality being this or that way isn't realized .

Peeps are walking around following teachers believing what is said is the Truth about reality .

Let me repeat what niz said, There is no right or wrong, there is just a favoured perspective .

So if you understand this one aspect, what does it mean for someone to say I have nothing to do with the world or the body?

What does it mean when a peep has a realization that isn't understood to then search for answers and to then after being educated by what is written by other's to then say how reality is in reflection of what they are ..

One minute one has no idea then after being educated by what many other's say then all of a sudden they can teach what they know lol ,

Well it isn't what they know directly is it . It's just conforming to what is concluded by other's.

Lets get to the heart of what I am suggesting here .



x daz x

[God-Like]

Originally Posted by Tara5

At the age of 14, Robert had a deep experience of One-Ness. And...
At the age of 16, Robert met Joel. Goldsmith.
So,
Robert had a direct experience of ONENESS much before meeting Goldsmith...
J Goldsmith helped Robert to understand Robert's experience better....Awakening is not always Bliss...it's a painful and complex process...And, he was too young to understand that, merely 14 years old.... In fact, J.Goldsmith advised him to see Yogananda Paramhamsa...And, later Yogananda realized that Robert had his own path and sent him to India to meet Ramana...

he is absolutely right....Advaita philosophy is taught by the Vedas, the most ancient scriptures of India.
Teaching/philosophy is not new...
But, the self-realisation comes through our own personal experiences, thus, always NEW....Awakening is not something one can learn from others...


I think you know my answer


Anytime

You don't need a mentor unless you need mentoring .

I am not disputing Adams realizations .

The fact is that he didn't understand what transpired so then he sought understandings from other's .

These so called other's have their own understandings, many that were also educated via their teachers and via the knowledge of the scriptures .

So we now have a Self realized individual that has a headful of concepts that have been passed down the line .

We now have an individual that is devoted to the teachings of another, so much so that he wants to spread the word of them .

Now this is showing you that there is a belief in what another say's and that is okay, I believed what my mum said to me even though she didn't speak too much about it because there were no fancy concepts to speak of . There was living life by example .

Sure there was the understanding / concept that what we are is everything and certain experiences are temporary, but hardcore twisted understanding can reflect upon everything being illusory or no-one is here and I have nothing to do with this world blah, blah, blah .. is all on a secondary level of mindful conclusions .

I am not sure if you know this or not or if you care or not either way .

In regards to scriptures, my point is that what peeps recite is what is written down in the scriptures .

It's like church folk reciting the bible isn't it . You have millions of peeps singing from the same hymn sheet because of what is written in front of them .

It's a conforming of beliefs that become engrained within the minds of followers .

If Adams is speaking wisdom and not mental knowledge then how did he attain the knowings when prior to meeting these other teachers he had no idea .

Perhaps there is wisdom in such words written, perhaps what is wise is in the eyes of the beholder, but nevertheless his understandings of reality came about through learning what other's have said about the matter .

And these peeps have the understandings because of what their mentors and gurus have said and so forth .

This is why I have asked about the origin of the teachings .



x daz x

[muffin]

Good afternoon daz

I know what your aiming at and at the same time I see where the others are coming from.

Unsure if your going to meet in the middle on this, we'll see.

I've bitten my tongue more than once in this thread, but thats nothing unusually

Just out of curiosity what do you class a guru to be ?

[God-Like]

Originally Posted by muffin

Good afternoon daz

I know what your aiming at and at the same time I see where the others are coming from.

Unsure if your going to meet in the middle on this, we'll see.

I've bitten my tongue more than once in this thread, but thats nothing unusually

Just out of curiosity what do you class a guru to be ?

Hey, Muffin Man ..

I am glad you see what I am aiming at, it really is straightforward as I see it .

It's all about the nature of realization compared with written word conclusions, passed down in such a way where what is written in scriptures and doctrines are to be taken as being gospel without questioning there origins .

I am not poo pooing wise words, or teachers to be clear I am just trying to emphasise that even texts and quotes and cute poetical spiritual proses that warms one's heart doesn't necessarily reflect anything more than resonation . Resonating with other's or what is written in scriptures doesn't make it true .

There are so many teachings that reflect self and our reality, many agree and many disagree, so many perspectives had based upon realization itself and what it actually means and refers too .

You would generally have only agreement in regards to the realization itself in that it is beyond words so to speak and there is what you are present even though self is absent, mind is absent .

Disagreements manifest and arise when what is beyond words is put into words and realities are explained and created, self no longer is even when there is self awareness lol, ego is supposedly dissolved while brushing teeth and cashing cheques .. cause and effect, individuality, illusions, dimensions are all up for speculation and up for debate .

If the one shoe size fits all then why are there folks with sore feet and blisters .

In regards to what I class a guru to be is someone that lives by example, one that practices what they preach, one that guides you to find out for yourself about what you are .

If you don't understand something about yourself there is no real harm in looking for help and guidance for there is a good reason for why teachers exist .



x daz x

[muffin]

Originally Posted by God-Like

Hey, Muffin Man ..

I am glad you see what I am aiming at, it really is straightforward as I see it .

It's all about the nature of realization compared with written word conclusions, passed down in such a way where what is written in scriptures and doctrines are to be taken as being gospel without questioning there origins .

Yes things do resonate to us thru scriptures, doctrines, poetry, music and life, for me daz theres heaps of different ways, all sign posts in there own way and they are just that.

Taking something from what Tara5 said, "is like peeling the Onion...peel off one layer, and there is another underneath, and then another and another.."

Each layer has it's own meaning, I think this comes down to where you are in yourself or how far you are along the path.

I don't think you will really know what they saying till you get there yourself.

Quote,"In regards to what I class a guru to be is someone that lives by example, one that practices what they preach, one that guides you to find out for yourself about what you are .

The only part I agree with you is this,"one that guides you to find out for yourself about what you are", but I don't see this as a person/human to many hangups.

[God-Like]

Originally Posted by muffin

Yes things do resonate to us thru scriptures, doctrines, poetry, music and life, for me daz theres heaps of different ways, all sign posts in there own way and they are just that.

Taking something from what Tara5 said, "is like peeling the Onion...peel off one layer, and there is another underneath, and then another and another.."

Yes, the onion's layers is a good analogy and I have used it myself. This is what I was suggesting to Tara earlier in regards to a one sided coin type of realization .

One can swear blindly that I AM not the body, then another layer is peeled back or another layer of understanding and integration is attained where one now say's I AM not the body and I AM also the body.

Each layer or level of integration and understanding had reflects upon oneself, how one perceives oneself and all things.

I am sure that there are Self realized folk out there that have realizations and carry on as they once did, that is why there is the saying of chop wood carry water .

One doesn't have to attain the knowledge of the vedas under their bonnet, one doesn't have to attain a concept that life is illusory or there is no-one here per se .

They carry on with life, living life with love in their hearts, treating other's as they would like to be treated and so forth .

No need to study anything, no need to read scriptures, bibles, no need to spread the word of other teachers and such likes ..

Just emphasising this point for simplicities sake if nothing else .

This is the guru living life by example ...



x daz x

[muffin]

Originally Posted by God-Like

Yes, the onion's layers is a good analogy and I have used it myself. This is what I was suggesting to Tara earlier in regards to a one sided coin type of realization .

Agree with what saying

The only time you can say, I am not the body is when it's time to move on.

Finding whats beyond that, just like the surprise of opening ones Christmas present one last time

Good night daz, sleep well and sweet dreams when you get there.

[Tara5]

Originally Posted by God-Like

I am not disputing Adams realizations .

Oh, really?

The fact is that he didn't understand what transpired so then he sought understandings from other's .

These so called other's have their own understandings, many that were also educated via their teachers and via the knowledge of the scriptures .

So we now have a Self realized individual that has a headful of concepts that have been passed down the line .

Let's say, you are just in the middle of a nice, romantic dream...when suddenly your alarm goes off....Now, you're awake....you wake up in a confused state...disoriented...not knowing, where you are, who you are....

The same happens, when we wake up out of the Illusion (dream)....take a while to sink in.

We now have an individual that is devoted to the teachings of another, so much so that he wants to spread the word of them .

It is called LOVE.

Now this is showing you that there is a belief in what another say's and that is okay, I believed what my mum said to me even though she didn't speak too much about it because there were no fancy concepts to speak of . There was living life by example .

Would love to know more about her teachings/spiritual path/journey....if you don't mind.

Sure there was the understanding / concept that what we are is everything and certain experiences are temporary, but hardcore twisted understanding can reflect upon everything being illusory or no-one is here and I have nothing to do with this world blah, blah, blah .. is all on a secondary level of mindful conclusions .

I've nothing is do with this world, is not a concept or mindful conclusions...it's a KNOWING...

When i say, i've nothing to do with this body means...i have dropped my attachments...I no longer get identified with this body...

It's like church folk reciting the bible isn't it . You have millions of peeps singing from the same hymn sheet because of what is written in front of them

Direct experiencing is different from reciting the bible etc...

It's a conforming of beliefs that become engrained within the minds of followers .

If Adams is speaking wisdom and not mental knowledge then how did he attain the knowings when prior to meeting these other teachers he had no idea .

Perhaps there is wisdom in such words written, perhaps what is wise is in the eyes of the beholder, but nevertheless his understandings of reality came about through learning what other's have said about the matter .

And these peeps have the understandings because of what their mentors and gurus have said and so forth .

This is why I have asked about the origin of the teachings .
x daz x

I've already answered these questions......