Quantum vaccume fluctuations

[r6r6]

7luminaries---Yes, what Gem said plus string theory and superposition.

What did he say that is of any relevant signifance to the questions Ive asked you in this thread and another recently? None/nothing.

...r6---Not sure what "A given"? means exactly. IF it means a speculation based on some observations then that is no differrent then my geo-numerical torus presented/givens........

There exists no rational, logical common sense for multiverses or if you prefer to call them bubble universes etc.

Part 1: Multiverse Scenario Inter-related { Mom Set }

Multiverses stem from a single set of initial events ergo their all in contact ---tangentally or overlapping--- eternally i.e they were never not connected by gravity ( ).


(( ))(( ))(( ))(( ))(( )) = tangentally connected via gravity ( )

Speed-of-radiation is irrelevant to any occupied space that is connected/iterreleated. YOu dont seem to grasp this or anything else I present to you.

Lack of effort or ego, or both your part.

Gravity ( ) is effective at any distance, as is charge, but in multi-verse scenarios charge{ + - } is not interrelating between two local universes.

Read my lips above ...Gravity ( ) is effective at any distance, as is charge...

Part 2: Multiverse Scenario Not Inter-related

Here is multiverse scenario where you believe there exist a finite set or infinite set of local universe's that are moving away from each other at speed-of-radiation ergo you belief they are not inter-related.

O O O O O O O

O O O O O

O O O O O


1} infinite set of occupied space local universes is irrational, illogical and lacks common sense,


2} assuming it is a finite set of lets say 20 local universes, please take effort to give us a rational, logical common sense explanation of why are they speeding away from each other at speed-of-radiation?

#1 above obviously lacks rationality, and #2 above also will never have any rational, logical common sense explanation.

So were back too Part One Mom Set of verses

Finite, occupied space Mom/God Universe has spawned off lots of smaller local universes at differrent times from self or from other local universes and their all connected/interrelated tangentally connected via positive shaped gravity( ) or as OOO etc ooo.

..............oooooo
..........oooooooooooooo
......OOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
OOOOOO(Mom)OOOOOO
.....OOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
........oooooooooooooo
...........ooooooooooo

[Dustin]

Originally Posted by r6r6r

Dusstin, Ive stated nothing about "higher dimensions" so I think your confusing me with someone else.


I have no idea what your "higher dimensions" means, exactly.

I know you weren't. I was trying to ask you a specific question relevent to my ideas and not relevent to this thread. I was wondering if you could give me a quick answer to my question. I don't think the question would warrent starting a thread and after you answer the question that was going to be the end of if, I didn't plan on inquiring further.

I well try to rephrase the question so its not so confusing:
I was curious if in higher dimensions dealing with the same universe but in nonlinear space-time would gravity still cross the dimension that seporates the universe in its two forms: linear and nonlinear?

[7luminaries]

r6, I think there is currently quite a lot of debate about any "theory of everything" ...including what comprises the multiverse ...and including the effects of gravity, the proportion and effects of dark energy and matter, and all that plus more.

I am not saying that all that is irrelevant to the inherent subjectivity of the universe or multiverse. But in a sense, I am.

Meaning, apart from all that we can measure (now or in future), including dark energy/matter, anti energy/matter, and so forth, as well as plain tangible energy/matter ...consciousness is ultimately the greater set, or the prime driver.

Meaning, consciousness is what surrounds and suffuses all and it is what causes all to manifest into physical reality. Consciousness is what remains if all else were to cease (to exist).

Peace & blessings
7L

[7luminaries]

Originally Posted by r6r6r

7L when you want to have a rational, logical common sense disscussion with me you need to start with what you repeatedly not do what Ive asked you to do.

Your refuse to address my specific comments as stated and more specifically those in my Cosmic Outline. You consistently refuse to address many of the relevant and signifant specifics Ive presented in this thread.


And when I ask you why, you run away and hide. Very frustrating to attempt rational, logical common sense dissscussion with you.

Or you repeatedly go off on insignifcant and irrelevant tangents.

Hahaha...too funny
Well then...my work here is done!!!

Just kidding, LOL....
I feel I have discussed the relevant or pertinent aspects, from my own point of view. However I will have to mull over your latest a bit further and see if anything else jumps out at me before response.

Peace & blessings
7L

[r6r6]

My work is not done because there is so much more to consider with rational, logical common sense and placing ego to the side.


1} There exists no rational, logical common sense for multiverses or if others prefer to call them bubble universes etc.


2} There exists no evidence or observations for existence of multiverses.


3} we have not evidence of any alledeged 'higher dimension" yet 7L, Dustin and Gem want disscuss them with me.


I'm looking forward to them disscussing them amongest themselves. Maybe we will learn something of signifcant relevance to this thread topic, or,


maybe will learn nothing of significant relevance to anything regarding Universe from their disscussion of "higher dimensions".


They seem to think the answer to everything is infinite this or that and "higher dimensions" Go figure and cause it makes no sense to me.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Part 1: Multiverse Scenario Inter-related { Mom Set }

Multiverses stem from a single set of initial events ergo their all in contact ---tangentally or overlapping--- eternally i.e they were never not connected by gravity ( ).


(( ))(( ))(( ))(( ))(( )) = tangentally connected via gravity ( )

Speed-of-radiation is irrelevant to any occupied space that is connected/iterreleated. YOu dont seem to grasp this or anything else I present to you.

Lack of effort or ego, or both your part.

Gravity ( ) is effective at any distance, as is charge, but in multi-verse scenarios charge{ + - } is not interrelating between two local universes.

Read my lips above ...Gravity ( ) is effective at any distance, as is charge...

Part 2: Multiverse Scenario Not Inter-related

Here is multiverse scenario where you believe there exist a finite set or infinite set of local universe's that are moving away from each other at speed-of-radiation ergo you belief they are not inter-related.

O O O O O O O

O O O O O

O O O O O
1} infinite set of occupied space local universes is irrational, illogical and lacks common sense,

2} assuming it is a finite set of lets say 20 local universes, please take effort to give us a rational, logical common sense explanation of why are they speeding away from each other at speed-of-radiation?

#1 above obviously lacks rationality, and #2 above also will never have any rational, logical common sense explanation.

So were back too Part One Mom Set of verses

Finite, occupied space Mom/God Universe has spawned off lots of smaller local universes at differrent times from self or from other local universes and their all connected/interrelated tangentally connected via positive shaped gravity( ) or as OOO etc ooo.

..............oooooo
..........oooooooooooooo
......OOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
OOOOOO(Mom)OOOOOO
.....OOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
........oooooooooooooo
...........ooooooooooo


---------------------------------------------------------------------1} { - }negative -numbers and positive{ + } --postive sign is not usally shown for ordinary positive numbers
-6, -5, -4, -3, -3, -1, 0, 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, See also this link.
negative gravity >>>O<<< positive matter

Again this scenario does not take into consideration any bosonic forces of Universe/Uni-V-erse nor does it take into account a relatively new classification of particles{ occupied space } that are niether fermions or bosons.

2} negative )( shapes and positive ( )

See link to tori to grasp these two concepts

3} -negative charge and positive + charge
See link to charge

[Dustin]

ok thanks for the response r6r6

[r6r6]

Originally Posted by Dustin

ok thanks for the response r6r6

Sure, your welcome Dustin, Ive always tried to be available for those with sincere desire to have a rational, logical common sense disscussion.

Please engage Gem and 7L with your "higher dimension" ideas, They have on more than one occasion tried to engage me about these so called "higher dimensions".

The three of you working together might really blow our minds, or not.

[Gem]

Regardless of the interpretation, including the Copenhagen interpretation which posits wave function collapse, the multiverse is implied. In the Copenhagen interpretation this is retrospective in terms of multiple possible histories culminating in the outcome which is observed. In the many worlds interpretation that is merely extended to say that other possible histories culminate in other possible outcomes (observations).



The bubble universe is slightly different in that it isn't an interpretation of the quantum probability per se. The bubble universe is an interpretation of the macro scale multiple universes all originating from the same big bang. Ie - multiple universes within the same expansion of space, but separate from eachother by virtue of disconnected relativistic 'bubbles' due to exceeding c with respect to other bubbles. They might be connected by entanglement, I guess, but entaglement is not an effect (it is acausal in the sense that correlation doesn't establish cause)



Of course these are speculative interpretations, because all interpretations are definitively speculative, and when it comes to the quantum scale, there is no 'common sense' any more. It is so abstract that we know what we say about it has very little to do with with how it actually is.


I think Neils Bohr put it best by saying that there is no quantum world as such; there are only abstract descriptions of a quantum world.


A world which is fundamentally uncertain (see Heisenberg) and only describable in terms of probability - or IOW - the sum of all possibilities.


The other subject, higher dimensions, is also established as a part of theoretical physics. The simplest explanation I can give comes from the question: "if the universe is expanding, what is it expanding into?" To visualise this, imagine the galaxies are drawn on an underinflated balloon. When we inflate the balloon the drawn galaxies more away from each other as the 2D surface expands. IE the galaxies become more dispersed as the space itself expands. So, 'what is it expanding into'? Indeed it doesn't expand into any extra 2D space. The 2D space itself expands. The 2d surface expands into the higher 3D space. By extension we could say our 3D expanding space is not expanding into anything per-se, but expanding into a higher 4D space.

[r6r6]

Richard Feynman, the father of electro quantum dynamics{ QED } kept it real simple with his Feynman diagrams i.e. he stated that we know this particle comes in here and another here{ > } they interact{ /\/\/ } and then they exit there{ < }.

>/\/\/< ergo simple Feynman diagrams were used to visualize Q.E.D.

--><-- i.e. Fullers simple version of mass-attraction{ gravity } INward towards each other.

/\/\/ i.e. Observed TIME{ fermions and bosons } aka as invaginations/inversions{ ^v^v } from peaks of geodesic arcs of geo-numerical tori{ occupied space }

( ) i.e. geodesic arcs of SPACE as positive{ attractive } Gravity{ spirit-3 occupied space }

)( i.e. geodesic arcs of SPACE as negative{repulsive} Dark Energy{ spirit-4 occupied space }

* * i.e.bilateral consciousness

i i.e. spirit-1, metaphysical-1, mind/intellect/concepts ex concepts of concepts, space, time, Universe, God etc

SPACE i.e. macro-infinite non-occupied space

SPACE (>*<) i (>*<) SPACE i.e. the fundamentals/essence of occupied SPACE - TIME - SPACE

Integrity i.e. the state of being whole{ finite } and undivided{ interrelated }

Originally Posted by r6r6r

They seem to think the answer to everything is infinite this or that and "higher dimensions" Go figure and cause it makes no sense to me.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Part 1: Multiverse Scenario Inter-related { Mom Set }

Multiverses stem from a single set of initial events ergo their all in contact ---tangentally or overlapping--- eternally i.e they were never not connected by gravity ( ).


(( ))(( ))(( ))(( ))(( )) = tangentally connected via gravity ( )

Speed-of-radiation is irrelevant to any occupied space that is connected/iterreleated. YOu dont seem to grasp this or anything else I present to you.

Lack of effort or ego, or both your part.

Gravity ( ) is effective at any distance, as is charge, but in multi-verse scenarios charge{ + - } is not interrelating between two local universes.

Read my lips above ...Gravity ( ) is effective at any distance, as is charge { + - }...

Part 2: Multiverse Scenario Not Inter-related

Here is multiverse scenario where you believe there exist a finite set or infinite set of local universe's that are moving away from each other at speed-of-radiation ergo is somes rational for no interrelationship { connected-ness }

O O O O O O O

O O O O O

O O O O O


1} infinite set of occupied space local universes interspersed by non-occupied space is irrational, illogical and lacks common sense and integrity { wholeness }

2} assuming it is a finite set of lets say 20 local universes, please take effort to give us a rational, logical common sense explanation of why are they speeding away from each other at speed-of-radiation?

#1 above obviously lacks rationality, and #2 above also will never have any rational, logical common sense explanation.

So were back too Part One Mom Set of verses

Finite, occupied space Mom/God Universe has spawned off lots of smaller local universes at differrent times from self or from other local universes and their all connected/interrelated tangentally connected via positive shaped gravity( ) or as OOO etc ooo.

..............oooooo
..........oooooooooooooo
......OOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
OOOOOO(Mom)OOOOOO
.....OOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
........oooooooooooooo
...........ooooooooooo


---------------------------------------------------------------------1} { - }negative -numbers and positive{ + } --postive sign is not usally shown for ordinary positive numbers
-6, -5, -4, -3, -3, -1, 0, 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, See also this link.
negative gravity >>>O<<< positive matter

Again this scenario does not take into consideration any bosonic forces of Universe/Uni-V-erse nor does it take into account a relatively new classification of particles{ occupied space } that are niether fermions or bosons.

2} negative )( shapes and positive ( )

See link to tori to grasp these two concepts

3} -negative charge and positive + charge
See link to charge

[Dustin]

“we have not evidence of any alledeged 'higher dimension" yet 7L, Dustin and Gem want discuss them with me.” r6r6

That quote was taken from something r6 was saying; when he stated it I had not been really following the thread, just had skimmed through all of it to ketch back up so I was unaware that others had expressed any interest in discussing higher dimensions. Anyways if Gem, 7L, or anyone else is interested in this here it is.

I find this stuff interesting so I look into it though I haven't greatly studied it.
So r6 made the statement about there being no evidence. I don't doubt that r6 has good reason to think that but personally I haven’t reach such an understanding yet; so here is the evidence that I'm dealing with, I'm not saying that my thoughts properly frame the evidence in relation to physics (or in understanding it as evidence) but I would be interested in trying to learn how such evidence might better be framed in relation to models of physics.

[Some what, my evidence is from human experience because I think a good model should be able to describe such experience. Also #3,4,&5 are written by people with scientific backgrounds who took the time to make such observations properly regardless of how briefly they are referenced bellow.]
1. in eastern religion God has many faces and not all are in this manifested universe.
2. many people believe in other planes: physical, astral, causal. Personally I think all three of these planes exist in this manifested universe; I think all they are, are subtler forms of everything that exist ie think of the difference between macro and quantum forms.
3. Dr. David R. Hawkins describes an experience and understanding of the process of enlightenment, most notably the difference between the self and the Self.
4. Barbara Ann Brennan describes the auric layers of the body and the universe in her first book then in the second she discusses holographic perception, the hara, and the core star. The core star seems to be, I think, our individualized consciousness in its original form meaning that its in the same form as God awake unified would be in (the concept of the self and the Self, and cycles of God). In her book she discusses a mediation technique to give up temporarily the individualization of the core star which she describes as going though another dimension.
5. Amid Groswami a theoretical nuclear physicist wrote this: “In a scientific paper published in 1989, and again in 1993 in The Self-Aware Universe, I arrived at the paradox-resolving proposition that the domain of potentiality is our consciousness–not in the form of ordinary ego-consciousness, but as a higher consciousness in which we are all one.”

So what interest me about higher dimensions is whether or not they help to frame all of the above into a model which makes sense. It is my thought that #5,4,3,&1 are all talking about the same thing; #5 is talking about quantum which is obviously inside our manifested universe but in the understanding of the author he also talks about it as if its a different realm, prior to manifest/wave collapse, “a realm of potentiality” which exists outside of space-time. “Higher dimensions” is very ambiguous; what I more specifically mean is dimensions of nonlinear space-time. It is my belief that God is all that can and well ever exist; also that God, in one of his faces, is unified currently and during all time; also that what exists in this universe is division not unity; and also it is my belief that matter is no different than mind, I do not believe that things exist as objects created by the mind, I think that matter and mind are interchangeable meaning that mind creates matter and matter creates mind. So if God is everything and is always unified and the universe is division then how do we to reconcile the difference? I attempt to do so with nonlinear dimensions. What do you think or do, or do you have a different set of statements which would then frame the issue differently?

Here's a random quote I came across which I thought was cool: “Soham: I am that I am. The Universe exists within me, as much as I exist in the in the universe.” Pinterest, website online.

Thanks for any response, currently as usual I don't have internet but unlike usual I'm staying a little way outside of town so in responding it may take me a little while.