I am having my doubts about like attracts like

[MikeS80]

Originally Posted by Ewwerrin

It's actually the other way around, they used to be the primary reason for murder, which is now changing, as humanity is awakening to their own individual unconditional alignment to their own source of being and source of all creation.

The original essence and source of all religions and cultures on this planet is coming to back to full realisation or awakening or restoration, however one wishes to call it. Humanity is unifying more than any other previous known historic timeline. Which means, history is expanding further. And reaching further than ever before.

Concepts, conditioning programming, and beliefs and all the other junk are simply narratives / stories/ myths that we pick up from other people. Truth on the other hand, is our own narrative that we are able to, and should pick up in the eternal right here and right now, as opposed to our memory of our past and thinking about the future.

Originally Posted by MikeS80

Quantum physics explains the LoA. And that is- consciousness causes a collapse of the wave function of the quantum continuum/electromagnetic field/singularity. The LoA is not a law per se. The LoA just is, what it is . But our beliefs, mental and emotional conditioning and programming, which gives us the thoughts we have alters "our" consciousness, "our" altered consciousness collapses the wave function of the quantum continuum/electromagnetic field/singularity.

Just popped back to say I think you’re skating on the thin ice of hiding behind the quantum label. Easy, here, because few will have done enough to understand the narrative. I won’t be “arguing” because my knowledge is too scant and my neurophysiology probably isn’t up to date. Here's my tuppenceworth.

I think you'd have trouble substantiating the quoted statement. What you've said doesn't explain how LoA is supposed to work, why it does with some, not with others. Also doesn't explain consciousness.

Don't let's bluff others. Quantum physics has merely offered another explanation. It has proved nothing. It is not definitive. At best it’s hypothesis. It still has many internal problems before proof could be considered possible - not the least of which is that the way the brain generates consciousness is still unknown. Many suggestions have been made about what happens within neurones (which at best, to me, suggests the allegedly established speed that the brain processes information may be an underestimate), the idea of tubules responding to quantum states affecting synaptic action - but nothing yet proven - although taken all together it all hints at the brain/mind being more computer than most people think. But.... there’s still no solution about how this could be measured without resorting to quantum ‘ideas’ and thus exposed to the same hypotheses (unless that's been resolved very recently like this year in which case I'd apologise for being out of date).

It’s an interesting subject. I’d be happier if you showed me the maths. Because, were quantum physics to hold the explanation, this section of the forum would become redundant. I do believe that most "spiritual" stuff will eventually be explained neurbiologically, perhaps not all but that doesn't devalue it in any way.
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I suppose as I'm locked down I could have a look around for some recent science.
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[MikeS80]

Originally Posted by Lorelyen

Just popped back to say I think you’re skating on the thin ice of hiding behind the quantum label. Easy, here, because few will have done enough to understand the narrative. I won’t be “arguing” because my knowledge is too scant and my neurophysiology probably isn’t up to date. Here's my tuppenceworth.

I think you'd have trouble substantiating the quoted statement. What you've said doesn't explain how LoA is supposed to work, why it does with some, not with others. Also doesn't explain consciousness.

Don't let's bluff others. Quantum physics has merely offered another explanation. It has proved nothing. It is not definitive. At best it’s hypothesis. It still has many internal problems before proof could be considered possible - not the least of which is that the way the brain generates consciousness is still unknown. Many suggestions have been made about what happens within neurones (which at best, to me, suggests the allegedly established speed that the brain processes information may be an underestimate), the idea of tubules responding to quantum states affecting synaptic action - but nothing yet proven - although taken all together it all hints at the brain/mind being more computer than most people think. But.... there’s still no solution about how this could be measured without resorting to quantum ‘ideas’ and thus exposed to the same hypotheses (unless that's been resolved very recently like this year in which case I'd apologise for being out of date).

It’s an interesting subject. I’d be happier if you showed me the maths. Because, were quantum physics to hold the explanation, this section of the forum would become redundant. I do believe that most "spiritual" stuff will eventually be explained neurbiologically, perhaps not all but that doesn't devalue it in any way.
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I suppose as I'm locked down I could have a look around for some recent science.
.

Quantum mechanics is a science, which people have done experiments on since the 1950's/60's. A narrative/story/myth requires faith or blind faith. Quantum mechanics/science is not a narrative/story/myth. Read: Quantum Physics of God: How Consciousness Became the Universe and Created Itself @ http://cosmology.com/CosmicConsciousness.html

I am not hiding behind anything. The definition of Hiding is:
noun
act of concealing; concealment:
to remain in hiding.
a secret refuge or means of concealment. To conceal from knowledge or exposure; keep secret: to hide one's feelings.
https://www.dictionary.com/browse/hiding

What I have said does explain how the LoA and consciousness work, People blame the LoA and go into self victim mode, when the Loa does not give them what they want. The entire point of the LoA, which a lot of people do not get is this: the LoA gives them what they do not want with the negative beliefs, mindset, conditioning/programming they have 24/7. The LoA works both ways of giving what people want and giving people, what people do not want and is always 100% subject to peoples postitive/negative and true/untrue beliefs, mindset, conditioning/programming etc etc.

Edit: The law of attraction does (not) work for you (give what you want) because you think/know that it does (not) give you what you want thus the law of attraction is (not) working for you, is subjectively true for you/your experience. This is the LoA at work for you, whether you believe it is working or not. You reap what you want and do not want, by what you sow, meaning the LoA gives you what you give your attention/focus energy to.

Originally Posted by MikeS80

Quantum mechanics is a science, which people have done experiments on since the 1950's/60's. A narrative/story/myth requires faith or blind faith. Quantum mechanics/science is not a narrative/story/myth. Read: Quantum Physics of God: How Consciousness Became the Universe and Created Itself @ http://cosmology.com/CosmicConsciousness.html

I am not hiding behind anything. The definition of Hiding is:
noun
act of concealing; concealment:
to remain in hiding.
a secret refuge or means of concealment. To conceal from knowledge or exposure; keep secret: to hide one's feelings.
https://www.dictionary.com/browse/hiding

My word. You do LOVE condescending, don't you? Quantum mechanics a science? On the go since the 1950s? Now, who'd have thought of that? Is it because you resent someone arriving here asking questions about what you're preaching?
Ok, well after this post I promise I'll leave the topic. Like I said, this slant of the topic won't interest most people here so not worth either of us spending more time on.

What I have said does explain how the LoA and consciousness work,

No it doesn't except at the most elementary level. Throwing in a bit of quantum jargon might bluff most of the people most of the time but not all. Your description is like saying because you plug a TV and turn it on to light up, you've explained how a television programme is experienced by a viewer!

If you're so sure, where is your proof? Answer - there isn't any.

How can you claim you know how consciousness works? You're the only person in the world who does. So...pray tell - definitively - how does the brain create consciousness?

The entire point of the LoA, which a lot of people do not get is this: the LoA gives them what they do not want with the negative beliefs, mindset, conditioning/programming they have 24/7.

I kind of followed it from when the fraud invented it. His LoA was to get rich. Which he did - through selling countless books to the unwary.

The law of attraction does (not) work for you (give what you want) because you think/know that it does (not) give you what you want thus the law of attraction is (not) working for you, is subjectively true for you/your experience. This is the LoA at work for you, whether you believe it is working or not.

I don't need it to work, being more of a go-getter. I'd encourage anyone trying to make it work to decide what they want or want to be, then work to get it. Mostly people use it to attract material abundance or a worthwhile relationship. Not without exception but mostly. That can be done without this weakest of occult techniques that's so chancy. How many here can repeatedly make it work in any reasonable timescale?
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And here's a reading list for you:
Neurotheology: How Science Can Enlighten Us About Spirituality / Andrew Newberg. (A bit wishy-washy but an easy narrative as a start);

Consciousness and the Universe: Quantum Physics, Evolution, Brain & Mind / Penrose, Hameroff et al.

There's one called the Physics of God / Selbie. You probably already have that.

Quantum Physics of Consciousness / Rosenblum Ed. A collection of papers.

The Physics of Quantum Mechanics / Binney, Skinner - an OUP book but contains mathematical expressions and modelling inc integration. Useful to instruct people like me who need to be told when and where quantum physics started!

And depending on how you are with Neuroscience -
Foundational Conccepts in Neuroscience / Presti (2016 so reasonably up to date). Mentioning this in case anyone else here is interested in the subject.

Boy-o... this is all giving me a severe truth-ache. Time to say night-night.

[MikeS80]

Originally Posted by Lorelyen

My word. You do LOVE condescending, don't you? Quantum mechanics a science? On the go since the 1950s? Now, who'd have thought of that? Is it because you resent someone arriving here asking questions about what you're preaching?
Ok, well after this post I promise I'll leave the topic. Like I said, this slant of the topic won't interest most people here so not worth either of us spending more time on.


No it doesn't except at the most elementary level. Throwing in a bit of quantum jargon might bluff most of the people most of the time but not all. Your description is like saying because you plug a TV and turn it on to light up, you've explained how a television programme is experienced by a viewer!

If you're so sure, where is your proof? Answer - there isn't any.

How can you claim you know how consciousness works? You're the only person in the world who does. So...pray tell - definitively - how does the brain create consciousness?

I kind of followed it from when the fraud invented it. His LoA was to get rich. Which he did - through selling countless books to the unwary.

I don't need it to work, being more of a go-getter. I'd encourage anyone trying to make it work to decide what they want or want to be, then work to get it. Mostly people use it to attract material abundance or a worthwhile relationship. Not without exception but mostly. That can be done without this weakest of occult techniques that's so chancy. How many here can repeatedly make it work in any reasonable timescale?
.
And here's a reading list for you:
Neurotheology: How Science Can Enlighten Us About Spirituality / Andrew Newberg. (A bit wishy-washy but an easy narrative as a start);

Consciousness and the Universe: Quantum Physics, Evolution, Brain & Mind / Penrose, Hameroff et al.

There's one called the Physics of God / Selbie. You probably already have that.

Quantum Physics of Consciousness / Rosenblum Ed. A collection of papers.

The Physics of Quantum Mechanics / Binney, Skinner - an OUP book but contains mathematical expressions and modelling inc integration. Useful to instruct people like me who need to be told when and where quantum physics started!

And depending on how you are with Neuroscience -
Foundational Conccepts in Neuroscience / Presti (2016 so reasonably up to date). Mentioning this in case anyone else here is interested in the subject.

Boy-o... this is all giving me a severe truth-ache. Time to say night-night.

I am not condescending anyone and I am not even arguing. You are putting false projections and accusations onto me, because of the false and incomplete knowledge you have, while all I am doing is having a civil conversation/talking about it on a discussion forum.
Definition of condescending: showing or characterized by a patronizing or superior attitude toward others. https://www.merriam-webster.com/dict.../condescending

It is impossible to show physical proof for things that are not physical. I can't show you physical proof of the thoughts you have in your head, just like I can not show you physical proof of how consciousness is created. Thoughts are not created by the brain, so i highly doubt the brain creates consciousness. I would not be surprised if our nervous system or heart, which is connected to the nervous system creates consciousness https://whalemedical.com/the-assembl...nt-and-health/

The nervous system is the major controlling, regulatory, and communicating system in the body. It is the center of all mental activity including thought, learning, and memory
https://training.seer.cancer.gov/anatomy/nervous/

A little research, googling and fact checking, including definition of words goes a long way.

Edit: why did you use a negative word such as resentment to describe my interaction with you? No, I do not resent you one bit :). truth see's and is beyond all negativity. Truth is not condescending one bit, the truth is just the truth. But emotions, including sympathy alters the truth.

[iamthat]

And of course, quantum science is still dealing with the universe on a physical level, albeit a very subtle level. It doesn't actually explain consciousness. But people do seem to like quoting what they have read about quantum science as if it is an explanation.

Until science begins to consider other levels of existence, such as the etheric levels, the astral planes and so on, then consciousness will remain a mystery. These other levels of existence also provide the key to the LOA.

MikeS80 says: "I would not be surprised if our nervous system or heart, which is connected to the nervous system creates consciousness. The nervous system is the major controlling, regulatory, and communicating system in the body. It is the center of all mental activity including thought, learning, and memory." I always thought that the nervous system related to the brain, but I am no biologist. But I question the idea that the nervous system is "the center of all mental activity including thought, learning, and memory." Consciousness and mental activity expresses through the nervous system, but they do not originate in the nervous system.

Peace

[MikeS80]

Originally Posted by iamthat

And of course, quantum science is still dealing with the universe on a physical level, albeit a very subtle level. It doesn't actually explain consciousness. But people do seem to like quoting what they have read about quantum science as if it is an explanation.

Until science begins to consider other levels of existence, such as the etheric levels, the astral planes and so on, then consciousness will remain a mystery. These other levels of existence also provide the key to the LOA.

Peace

What you say is true up to a point. The electromagnetic field/quantum continuum/singularity in quantum mechanics is beyond the physical universe, while at the same time, is part of the physical universe, and vice versa. The electromagnetic field/quantum continuum/singularity is the unknown to most people and religous people call the electromagnetic field/quantum continuum/singularity "god'. I know that is a bold statement, but it is easy to understand. Things are more complicated because people makes things more complicated than they really are.

Did you read the article I linked to earlier? http://cosmology.com/CosmicConsciousness.html

Edit: I think the astral plane is a mental concept/narrative that the LoA turns into reality for people that have that mental concept/narrative in their heads. And after they experience the astral plane, they turn the concept/narrative of the astral plane into a percept/perception that strengthens their belief in the concept/narrative of the astral plane. The same applies to all beliefs, concepts/narratives a person has in his/her memory and head.

[iamthat]

Originally Posted by MikeS80

What you say is true up to a point. The electromagnetic field/quantum continuum/singularity in quantum mechanics is beyond the physical universe, while at the same time, is part of the physical universe, and vice versa. The electromagnetic field/quantum continuum/singularity is the unknown to most people and religous people call the electromagnetic field/quantum continuum/singularity "god'. I know that is a bold statement, but it is easy to understand. Things are more complicated because people makes things more complicated than they really are.

Edit: I think the astral plane is a mental concept/narrative that the LoA turns into reality for people that have that mental concept/narrative in their heads.

It depends what we mean by the term "the physical universe". You may say that the electromagnetic field/quantum continuum/singularity in quantum mechanics is beyond the physical universe , but for me it is still very much part of the physical universe.

If people call this "electromagnetic field/quantum continuum/singularity" God then they are a long way from understanding.

If you try to reduce the astral plane to a mental concept of people on the physical plane then you will struggle to grasp the bigger picture.

Peace

[MikeS80]

Originally Posted by iamthat

It depends what we mean by the term "the physical universe". You may say that the electromagnetic field/quantum continuum/singularity in quantum mechanics is beyond the physical universe , but for me it is still very much part of the physical universe.

If people call this "electromagnetic field/quantum continuum/singularity" God then they are a long way from understanding.

If you try to reduce the astral plane to a mental concept of people on the physical plane then you will struggle to grasp the bigger picture.

Peace

Of course the electromagnetic field/quantum continuum/singularity is part of the physical universe.

What is that bigger picture of the astral plane? Is the bigger picture heaven, and hell?

Originally Posted by iamthat

I always thought that the nervous system related to the brain, but I am no biologist. But I question the idea that the nervous system is "the center of all mental activity including thought, learning, and memory." Consciousness and mental activity expresses through the nervous system, but they do not originate in the nervous system.

Peace

It does and no matter what people tell you it is the seat of thinking and feeling, planning, strategy, and holds our cognitive skills. This happens in the frontal lobe and calls upon data from almost every other part of the brain. Emotions are dealt with in the limbic system an older part of the brain. Some claim that feelings originate in the heart but this is because the heart is the main organ affected (by the brain) in response to emotional stimuli whether external or internal (thoughts, imagination). The Vagus nerve is part of the sympathetic peripheral system that fires up the heart for a number of reasons.
The rest of the nervous system - the peripheral (mostly) is about receiving input from our sense receptors and controlling bodily functions, not thinking.