Please Answer This Question

[Triner]

Originally Posted by Mind's Eye

I agree Seawolf, to me Satan is right up there with the Easter Bunny and the Tooth Fairy. It's all too easy to blame some invisible force for the problems of the world rather than to stand up and take responsibility for ourselves.

Yes, I agree too.

Though I can understand why an entity like Satan is so important to many Christians. Like you said, it gives Christians something else, separate from themselves, to blame for their "sins". Also, this separateness allows Christians to maintain a Christ spirit that is separate from them instead of dwelling inside each of us, Christian or not.

[Adrienne]

Originally Posted by Mind's Eye

I agree Seawolf, to me Satan is right up there with the Easter Bunny and the Tooth Fairy. It's all too easy to blame some invisible force for the problems of the world rather than to stand up and take responsibility for ourselves.

Do you mind.......not putting the Easter Bunny and Tooth Fairy in the same category as Satan ? I do believe they are in a different category altogether .

Originally Posted by Dream Angel

Do you mind.......not putting the Easter Bunny and Tooth Fairy in the same category as Satan ? I do believe they are in a different category altogether .

I don't know... I once saw that Tooth Fairy tempt a man to rob a liquor store. She said he could get more money from the cash register than she could leave under his pillow.

[Adrienne]

Just goes to show you, you can't believe everything you read or hear about I am looking for a quote to back up my comment, but I can't seem to locate one at the moment .... someone must have said something similar, somewhere in time.

Originally Posted by Dream Angel

Just goes to show you, you can't believe everything you read or hear about

The Tooth Fairy is a shrewd temptress... I have scripture to back it.

[Adrienne]

Originally Posted by Mind's Eye

The Tooth Fairy is a shrewd temptress... I have scripture to back it.

See, I knew it, there was a scripture to it somewhere, and I know you are just the one to find it !

Originally Posted by Dream Angel

See, I knew it, there was a scripture to it somewhere, and I know you are just the one to find it !

Luke 3:17, "and the Tooth Fairy taketh Jesus up to a high mountain and showed him all the nations of the world. And she said, all the money in my pocket I will give to thee if thou go down there and do bad things."

Originally Posted by S-word
I thought that I might as well begin with the Satanic lie of the virgin birth.

http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2007/05/070524-shark-virgin.html

hammerhead sharks gives virgin birth. also heard of a komodo dragon doing this too. maybe god wants to experience being a physical being other than human..... :)

[Reverend Keith]

Originally Posted by S-word

Mind Eye made this comment: "the evil, wicked world brainwashed me against the Bible with its satanic lies and trickery."

I simply took the pains to reveal to him that the Manna that has come down to us from heaven is not to blame for his conundrum, but that it is the vile yeast that has been added to God's word, "the santanic lies and trickery," of the authorities of the church to which he was want to attend, which has twisted his poor mind, and brain washed him into believing that the false doctrines that he was bomb barded with, were actually recorded in God's word.

And seeing as his opening words in post #1 were, "How is it that there are other cultures predating Christianity who have had; The Son of God being born of a virgin on the earth?" I thought that I might as well begin with the Satanic lie of the virgin birth.

I agree with you that 1) Jesus was not born of a virgin and that 3) Neither the Hebrew nor the Greek words (alma, parthenos) unambiguously mean "virgin". (And that, incidentally, Isaiah's prophecy, in context, doesn't seem to refer to Jesus at all)

But it seems clear that both Matthew and Luke intend to convey the idea of a virgin birth.

Now the birth of Jesus Christ happened this way. While his mother Mary was engaged to Joseph, but before they came together, she was found to be pregnant through the Holy Spirit. Because Joseph, her husband to be, was a righteous man, and because he did not want to disgrace her, he intended to divorce her privately. When he had contemplated this, an angel of the Lord appeared to him in a dream and said, “Joseph, son of David, do not be afraid to take Mary as your wife, because the child conceived in her is from the Holy Spirit. She will give birth to a son and you will name him Jesus, because he will save his people from their sins.” This all happened so that what was spoken by the Lord through the prophet would be fulfilled: “Look! The virgin will conceive and bear a son, and they will call him Emmanuel,” which means “God with us.” (Matt 1:18-23, NET)

Referencing the Holy Spirit as responsible seems to convey the clear idea that the conception is supernatural. It also seems clear that the author of Matthew THINKS that "alma" means virgin in Isaiah and is using "parthenos" in it's "virgin" translation or meaning.

So the angel said to her, “Do not be afraid, Mary, for you have found favor with God! Listen: You will become pregnant and give birth to a son, and you will name him Jesus. He will be great, and will be called the Son of the Most High, and the Lord God will give him the throne of his father David. He will reign over the house of Jacob forever, and his kingdom will never end.” Mary said to the angel, “How will this be, since I have not had sexual relations with a man?” The angel replied, “The Holy Spirit will come upon you, and the power of the Most High will overshadow you. Therefore the child to be born will be holy; he will be called the Son of God. “And look, your relative Elizabeth has also become pregnant with a son in her old age – although she was called barren, she is now in her sixth month! For nothing will be impossible with God.” (Luke 1:30-37, NET)

Again, by stressing God's ability to do the impossible, the author of Luke clearly implies that something ordinarily impossible (supernatural) is involved in the conception.

I'm not quite sure what alternative you are implying (it SOUNDS like you're suggesting that someone human snuck in and impregnated Mary under divine guidance, but it's not real clear from your message. But that is hardly something that requires God's ability to accomplish the impossible. Unmarried girls turn up pregnant all the time without miracles being required.

Your argument that if something so miraculous occurred, it would have been trumpeted from the house tops isn't convincing for two reasons.

1) It wouldn't have been believed. People would have assumed, as Joseph is originally pictured as doing, that entirely natural causes were at work.

2) I don't think Mind's Eye was implying that the virgin birth actually occurred, and was a copy of ancient myths about virginally conceived saviors. He is implying that it was thought up later and inserted into the gospels, to give Jesus a more godlike history. This would explain why it DIDN'T cause such a commotion at the time. Because it didn't happen.

[Morpheus]

I agree with you that 1) Jesus was not born of a virgin and that 3) Neither the Hebrew nor the Greek words (alma, parthenos) unambiguously mean "virgin". (And that, incidentally, Isaiah's prophecy, in context, doesn't seem to refer to Jesus at all)
But it seems clear that both Matthew and Luke intend to convey the idea of a virgin birth.

Keith, we do understand concenring Isaiah, that in Jewish law and practice it would have been blasphemy to call a mere mortal "Mighty God", and, "Everlating Father", true? Was he talking about king Hezakiah then, or other?
For the same, they wanted to stone Jesus...
For the same, judgement came upon Herod, in the new testament.

But, either way there is allowance for the judgement of stoning for blasphemy in the Law. True?