Do you actually believe 2k year persevation?

[Ewwerrin]

Do you actually believe that what someone lived and said 2+ thousand years ago, is accurately perserved, at all?

How?

[FallingLeaves]

Originally Posted by Ewwerrin

Do you actually believe that what someone lived and said 2+ thousand years ago, is accurately perserved, at all?

How?

i think god can do anything he wants, including impart meanings that many men will have an attitude towards...

[Ewwerrin]

Originally Posted by FallingLeaves

i think god can do anything he wants, including impart meanings that many men will have an attitude towards...

I can read one book, that is very popular, and recent, and I will be able to read it one thousand times, and I will have 1 thousand different interpretations of that one book alone.

I can watch a painting and experience a new painting every single time I look at it.

I can watch a movie, a thousand times, and experience thousand different movies.

If I were responsible for translating them. I could translate it 1 million times, and I still woulden't be able to say which one is the most accurate one, FOR MY SELF. Let alone for 8 billion people who all have 5 billion unique perspectives per second, every single and each one of them.

And then consider a translation of a translation of a translation of a translation of a translation, to infinity and beyond.

It's not just many men with unique attitudes toward meanings. It's even one single person who can have endless many attitudes towards one meaning.

Not to mention everything changes. Including language.

And what about the intention of every single translator, or the intention of those they are translating it for.


Even in very new books and well known, there are always many flaws in the book. But even without those flaws. What about the meaning of words and what they mean as translated over different languages and 2 thousand years of translations upon translations. How could even the original book be accurately understood. Let alone endless translations of translations of it?

When listening to nonduality speakers, I experience all of them, in english, to use english words, with IMMENSE unique meanings, on one word alone. I could listen to 20 years of content from one person, and not only do their usage of words chsnge, same words mean different things over 20 years. But one single word, can have meaning to the speaker that will requires 40 lifetimes of immense explanation to really get close and near to the accurate understanding of one single word used by one single speaker in one single moment in time.

[FallingLeaves]

your choice: believe in the limitations men place on themselves and each other, all the meanness that happens and the freedoms that are abrogated, or believe in a God who can and will overcome all those limitations in the best possible way. Even if that means I have to wait a while for it to happen.

Personally I think it foolish to believe in men, over believing in God, but that is just me.

[Ewwerrin]

Originally Posted by FallingLeaves

Personally I think it foolish to believe in men, over believing in God, but that is just me.

I agree with that.

Do you believe the bible/torah/quran are from God, and if so, how did it get from God on to paper?

Is there some kind of angel that does updates on the book? Or is it all human made?

And what about the idea that these books are the final message?

I personally do love Abraham's story, so I am interested in all three books. ofcourse.

[FallingLeaves]

Originally Posted by Ewwerrin

I agree with that.

Do you believe the bible/torah/quran are from God, and if so, how did it get from God on to paper?

And what about the idea that these books are the final message?

so as maisy corrected me in a later post, the bible says in several places that god basically lets us do and think what we want... there is a safety net IO think so it isn't disastrous other than we always start not liking our lot again at some point....

but sometimes in the past he 'gave us' messages in a language we think we understand... but the response to those messages, including what to record in a book and what we think about what was said, is our response. Still, in times past we were so very predictable that god was able to get us to respond in ways he felt beneficial to continuation of his 'cause' whatever that is... im not sure how much that has changed by the way. There is still an awful lot of stuff going on that seems like clockwork after I've watched it a while... and certainly I'm pretty predicatable too lol... but anyway... I suppose we could always have another 'final message' if that is what we want to do... but... from what I've seen the story of jesus was all god needed to guarantee that what he wants to happen will indeed come to pass. So I don't see HIM as needing another final message, although he'll give us something if we clamour enough about what we need in that regards I suppose....

the predictable thing is also why any message god doesn't want erased won't get erased... all he has to do is harden someone's heart the way he did pharoah (for example) and make them not see what is actually being said, then they won't contend with it and be inspired to erase it or alter it in some way that doesn't serve his cause.

[Maisy]

Originally Posted by FallingLeaves

i think god can do anything he wants,

God seems to let humans do and say whatever they want. If I was God I would stop all violence in the world. I'd change so much! I'd make every weapon disappear. Make all pollution disappear. Get rid of hunger in the world and so on. I would not let one person ever harm another. I would end illness and suffering.

I think we have a lot of writings from 2000 years ago that are accurate and some that are not.

[Ewwerrin]

Originally Posted by Maisy

God seems to let...
... accurate and some that are not.

I remember reading somewhere that angels asked God if God would place those horrible things on the planet or allow it, and God replied with "I know what you do not."

That is the most vague and cryptic answer I've ever heard.

But in terms of christianity I read about Jobb and his suffering. Worst suffering a human ever experienced it seems. 3 wise friends tried to make sense of it. And only a joyful young person knew the answer. And it was basically revealed through joy. That it was basically something very good in the process of happening. And then as joy opened the knowledge, it also revealed Gods perspective as an extension of joyful perspective capable of receiving direct communion with God and its perspective. It seems like they definitely studied law of attraction in those days or this was a law of attraction study case. But most of that wasn't perserved

But I agree with you, as obviously "I dont know what God knows."
Some secret reason for all those bad things.

[Maisy]

Originally Posted by Ewwerrin

I remember reading somewhere that angels asked God if God would place those horrible things on the planet or allow it, and God replied with "I know what you do not."

I think trying to find a reason a "good" God would allow such horrible behaviors to exist on earth (animals willfully and intentionally causing suffering in other animals) as well as this "good" God creating animals who do such things in the first place is one of the reasons we have religions. Humans looking for reasons to explain this stuff.

I think it's obvious humans (on earth) did not create the earth or the living things on it which begs the question who did? Thus an idea of a God or Gods. Then of course why were we created? Religions attempt explain this as well.

Originally Posted by Maisy

Then of course why were we created? Religions attempt explain this as well.

Maisy,

For me the simplest explanation is 3 words: “God is love”. For love to exist there must be one that loves and one that is loved. We must conclude that with the creation of man that ‘God saw that it was good’. God just could not help himself…..:). One man was not enough…..in fact it was inconceivable to be content with that. In that sense he enabled us to also be creators….able to reproduce……..