[Debrah]

Originally Posted by Altair

Debrah, hello and happy new year!

There are many arguments to favour egg consumption, if done small scale. Eggs are nutritious and contain nutrients that you for instance lack on your vegan diet. Humans need some animal food in their diets and without it you are gambling with your health. I won't stop you in your ethics but you seem to think veganism is the answer to both health and environment but it isn't that simple.




Chickens can be taken care of, given plenty of food, a roof over their heads, protection from predators can be done very well. All humans ask in return is eggs, and taking eggs does not reduce age span of hens or give them horrible lives, that's vegan propaganda.

Chickens do not have the same ''feelings'' as I do and only a few same basic needs. All animals (that includes us) are different and have different needs and degrees of feelings and empathy. A human is not the same as a chicken, and a chicken is not the same as a dog. I grew up with chickens and dogs and while I like chickens they're not comparable to the degree a dog bonds with a human or how a dog feels.

People have domesticated animals in the Holocene and have co-evolved with them. Keeping chickens small scale is one of the most environmentally friendly ways to get protein.



The way we treat animals and use them to our benefit is a case by case matter and not black and white. We all have to settle with a greyish world where we improve animal welfare and don't abandon keeping animals around. Not just for ourselves, but also for our cats and dogs, mind you. Or should we only have rabbit pets and feed them with constant fresh lettuce? (which also has an environmental cost..).

In veganism every animal becomes the same, there is only equality. Why then do you eat food at all may I ask? Buying or eating any type of food will contribute to animals being killed. If it's ''all or nothing'' than you can't eat anything by your own standards I'm afraid.

There are no nutrients lacking in my vegan diet that requires anything from eggs. You don’t need it, you don’t need animal products, that is purely a myth. 

The only thing I have to take a supplement for is B12, but that’s not because B12 is inherently in meat. It’s produced by bacteria found in the soil and B12 is likewise added to animal feed because they don’t make it in their bodies.

Texas Midland Memorial Hospital began encouraging their recovering patients to chose the vegan options from the hospital menu, a couple years ago. They also began offering plant based cooking classes in their hospital community health program and they encourage staff, patients and the public to get involved and learn a different way to nourish their bodies. Would they do that, if there was any problem with a vegan diet? There are currently about 5 well known American hospitals who are doing the same. https://www.midlandhealth.org/main/p...ased-nutrition

A great documentary that you can watch on Netflix, is The Gamechangers. With the program focussing on the world’s top athletes and the impact that switching to a vegan diet has had on their health, performance and ability to recover, it’s a must see for anyone who’s interested in optimum health. In case you’re open minded enough to watch, here’s a link to their official trailer…..https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iSpglxHTJVM

What is black and white to me Altair, that you can’t seem to grasp, is that DELIBERATELY choosing a lifestyle that includes using (and thus abusing) any animals for my own purpose, is what I am against. Yes, I have to eat too and some critters pay a terrible price and I grieve for that. BUT, those aren’t deliberate deaths in the same way as your diet includes or worse, a meat inclusive diet. Even in a court of law, we see examples of ‘murder’ vs. ‘Manslaughter’. One is deliberate, the other is an unlawful killing that wasn’t intended.

This thread started with the question, ‘are eggs ethical to eat’. I find it interesting that the discussion has included an apparent change in what qualifies as ethics. It seems a stretch to consider that ground up, live chicks and spent hens being hauled off for slaughter when they’re young (worn out) birds, could ever be considered ethical.

While it might seem like the answer that we should all be eating organic, free range whatever, the fact is that those types of products are at best only 5% of the entire market. A blip so small as to be inconsequential in the big picture of the environment. That ‘answer’ also ignores the issue of disposing of the young ‘byproducts’ of those species in question, as well as the older animals whose production is falling. Farmers don’t keep and retire old animals, they ship them off to be slaughtered in the same nightmarish places that the CAFO animals wind up in. Black and White, LEAST HARM instead of going out looking for something to die on purpose.