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-   -   The Jesus Sutras. (http://www.spiritualforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=137982)

sky123 19-11-2020 01:34 PM

The Jesus Sutras.
 
https://thejesusquestion.org/2011/08...e-stone-sutra/


Some may find these writings ' Beautiful ' as I have. Written by the last Christian Taoist and rediscovered hidden in Caves....

Miss Hepburn 19-11-2020 02:37 PM

Hope this helps those that never heard the word Sutra. :smile:

Sutras: a genre of ancient and medieval Indian texts found in Hinduism, Buddhism and Jainism.

A rule or aphorism in Sanskrit literature, or a set of these on grammar or Hindu law or philosophy.

What's an aphorism? An aphorism is a concise, terse, laconic, or memorable expression of a general truth or principle.

Miss Hepburn 19-11-2020 02:46 PM

Fascinating - For those that don't click the link.
The 2 sentence copy limit, btw.:wink:


The Jesus Sutras teach that because people’s innate good nature had become confused and obscured
(Christians might say “marred by sin”), God had to come to Earth as Ye Su (Jesus).

“Therefore, my Lord Ye Su, the One emanating in three subtle bodies, hid his true power, became a human,
and came on behalf of the Lord of Heaven to preach the good teachings” (2:17).



sky123 19-11-2020 03:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Miss Hepburn
Hope this helps those that never heard the word Sutra. :smile:

Sutras: a genre of ancient and medieval Indian texts found in Hinduism, Buddhism and Jainism.

A rule or aphorism in Sanskrit literature, or a set of these on grammar or Hindu law or philosophy.

What's an aphorism? An aphorism is a concise, terse, laconic, or memorable expression of a general truth or principle.



' Sutras: a genre of ancient and medieval Indian texts found in Hinduism, Buddhism and Jainism. '

Yes, and it also means ' The Thread that binds us together '.
The Jesus Sutras are the binding together of Christianity and Taoism :smile:

sky123 19-11-2020 03:03 PM

[quote=Miss Hepburn]Fascinating - For those that don't click the link.
The 2 sentence copy limit, btw.:wink:


The Jesus Sutras teach that because people’s innate good nature had become confused and obscured
(Christians might say “marred by sin”), God had to come to Earth as Ye Su (Jesus).

“Therefore, my Lord Ye Su, the One emanating in three subtle bodies, hid his true power, became a human,
and came on behalf of the Lord of Heaven to preach the good teachings” (2:17).



' The 2 sentence copy limit, btw.:wink: '


Sorry I completely forgot .

Molearner 20-11-2020 06:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sky123
https://thejesusquestion.org/2011/08...e-stone-sutra/


Some may find these writings ' Beautiful ' as I have. Written by the last Christian Taoist and rediscovered hidden in Caves....



sky123,

These are beautiful...thanks for sharing this site. They offer a different perspective that can add to our understanding. Essentially they provide somewhat of an 180 degree view of things from a different viewpoint....like being able to see the 2 sides of a coin. I was struck by this passage from the site:

" in Matthew 13:45-46, Jesus says, “Again, the kingdom of heaven is like a merchant looking for fine pearls. When he found one of great value, he went away and sold everything he had and bought it.” In this scenario, you are the pearl of great value, and Jesus is the buyer; he purchased you at infinite cost to himself, because he values you that much."

The 'infinite cost' reminds us of the crucifixion of Jesus. "For God so loved the world...." etc. Also the parable of searching for the lost sheep and leaving the 99 to search for that one lost individual. It is love that we cannot quite conceive of....not something that most of us would be inclined to do.

Just to demonstrate how scripture can be interpreted differently I will offer a different interpretation of this same scripture. In doing so, I would suggest that we get out of our heads that there is only one correct interpretation of any specific scripture. The beauty of scripture is that it leads one into contemplation that can present new understandings and speak to us both directly and personally.

Another interpretation of this parable about the pearl of great value some understand the pearl as representing eternal truth. The 'merchant' whose livilihood is dealing in pearls can be seen as us. We are the ones who have viewed many 'pearls'(which can be our personal insights and beliefs) but we find ouirselves willing to abandon all that we have previously had in our possession for that one great thing: eternal truth. Paul writing is Phillipians 3:8-10......"for his sake I have suffered loss of all things and count them as rubbish, in order that I may gain Christ...." This is recognition of the pearl of great value. To continue this interpretation one must consider the properties of a pearl: a pearl is spherical(whole) brilliant(divine) hidden in an oyster(veiled) and is found only in the depths of sea(consciousness)

In short there are many different ways to interpret scripture and each way can be a way of opening our minds. At some point we begin to rather than search for others interpretations to attempt to access our Spirit and our own intution to arrive at personal epiphanies.

Molearner 20-11-2020 06:32 PM

In this same spirit of what I posted above is a Japanese rendering of the 23rd Psalm.

"
The Lord is my Pace-Setter,
I shall not rush.

He makes me stop and rest for quiet intervals.

He provides for me with images of stillness

which restore my serenity.

He leads me in ways of efficiency

Through calmness of mind,

And His guidance is Peace.

Even though I have a great many things

to accomplish each day

I will not fret

For His presence is here.

His timelessness,

His all-importance,

Will keep me in balance.

He prepares refreshment and renewal

in the midst of my activity

by anointing my head

with His oils of tranquility.

My cup of joyous energy overflows.

Surely harmony and effectiveness

Shall be the fruits of my hours

For I shall walk

In the place of my Lord

And dwell in His house

For ever.

*Ascribed to Toki Miyashina (original source unknown)

As you can see it follows in spirt the translations we are familiar with but it takes into account the different culture from which it emanates. The imagery of shepherds does not necessarily resonate with the Japanese culture and we are presented here an understanding and interpretation that speaks to an Eastern culture.

sky123 20-11-2020 08:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Molearner
sky123,

These are beautiful...thanks for sharing this site. They offer a different perspective that can add to our understanding. Essentially they provide somewhat of an 180 degree view of things from a different viewpoint....like being able to see the 2 sides of a coin. I was struck by this passage from the site:

" in Matthew 13:45-46, Jesus says, “Again, the kingdom of heaven is like a merchant looking for fine pearls. When he found one of great value, he went away and sold everything he had and bought it.” In this scenario, you are the pearl of great value, and Jesus is the buyer; he purchased you at infinite cost to himself, because he values you that much."

The 'infinite cost' reminds us of the crucifixion of Jesus. "For God so loved the world...." etc. Also the parable of searching for the lost sheep and leaving the 99 to search for that one lost individual. It is love that we cannot quite conceive of....not something that most of us would be inclined to do.

Just to demonstrate how scripture can be interpreted differently I will offer a different interpretation of this same scripture. In doing so, I would suggest that we get out of our heads that there is only one correct interpretation of any specific scripture. The beauty of scripture is that it leads one into contemplation that can present new understandings and speak to us both directly and personally.

Another interpretation of this parable about the pearl of great value some understand the pearl as representing eternal truth. The 'merchant' whose livilihood is dealing in pearls can be seen as us. We are the ones who have viewed many 'pearls'(which can be our personal insights and beliefs) but we find ouirselves willing to abandon all that we have previously had in our possession for that one great thing: eternal truth. Paul writing is Phillipians 3:8-10......"for his sake I have suffered loss of all things and count them as rubbish, in order that I may gain Christ...." This is recognition of the pearl of great value. To continue this interpretation one must consider the properties of a pearl: a pearl is spherical(whole) brilliant(divine) hidden in an oyster(veiled) and is found only in the depths of sea(consciousness)

In short there are many different ways to interpret scripture and each way can be a way of opening our minds. At some point we begin to rather than search for others interpretations to attempt to access our Spirit and our own intution to arrive at personal epiphanies.




I'm glad you enjoyed them Mo, they are ' Pearls of Wisdom ' :smile:
I love your interpretation and agree there is never just ONE interpretation of any Scriptures they are personal to each individual.
I love to read insights from other Cultures, they certainly do open our minds to ' Interbeing '.

sky123 20-11-2020 08:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Molearner
In this same spirit of what I posted above is a Japanese rendering of the 23rd Psalm.

"
The Lord is my Pace-Setter,
I shall not rush.

He makes me stop and rest for quiet intervals.

He provides for me with images of stillness

which restore my serenity.

He leads me in ways of efficiency

Through calmness of mind,

And His guidance is Peace.

Even though I have a great many things

to accomplish each day

I will not fret

For His presence is here.

His timelessness,

His all-importance,

Will keep me in balance.

He prepares refreshment and renewal

in the midst of my activity

by anointing my head

with His oils of tranquility.

My cup of joyous energy overflows.

Surely harmony and effectiveness

Shall be the fruits of my hours

For I shall walk

In the place of my Lord

And dwell in His house

For ever.

*Ascribed to Toki Miyashina (original source unknown)

As you can see it follows in spirt the translations we are familiar with but it takes into account the different culture from which it emanates. The imagery of shepherds does not necessarily resonate with the Japanese culture and we are presented here an understanding and interpretation that speaks to an Eastern culture.



Thanks Mo, that is beautiful. I haven't read it before and really love the first 4 lines. What a Gem, have you got any more :smile:

Molearner 20-11-2020 10:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sky123
I'm glad you enjoyed them Mo, they are ' Pearls of Wisdom ' :smile:
I love your interpretation and agree there is never just ONE interpretation of any Scriptures they are personal to each individual.
I love to read insights from other Cultures, they certainly do open our minds to ' Interbeing '.


Sky123,

These 2 opposite interpretations (one with Jesus as the merchant...the other as us as the merchant) suggest how the duality of 2 can morph into the non duality of 1. When opposites attract they merge into 1(marriage). In this instance we can be inspired by either. The net result is that we were inspired....the result being more important than the reason......if that makes any sense.....:)

Molearner 20-11-2020 10:26 PM

A couple of more dots to connect.....in post #8 I mentioned ‘eternal truth’ as the pearl of great value. Paul had spoke of gaining Christ as the most valuable thing. We are reminded of Jesus saying....” I am the way, the life and the TRUTH”. In Paul’s opinion Christ was the eternal truth.....

sky123 21-11-2020 08:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Molearner
Sky123,

These 2 opposite interpretations (one with Jesus as the merchant...the other as us as the merchant) suggest how the duality of 2 can morph into the non duality of 1. When opposites attract they merge into 1(marriage). In this instance we can be inspired by either. The net result is that we were inspired....the result being more important than the reason......if that makes any sense.....:)



Makes perfect sense :smile:


' When opposites attract they merge into 1(marriage).'

Obviously Yin/Yang in Taoism..

sky123 21-11-2020 08:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Molearner
A couple of more dots to connect.....in post #8 I mentioned ‘eternal truth’ as the pearl of great value. Paul had spoke of gaining Christ as the most valuable thing. We are reminded of Jesus saying....” I am the way, the life and the TRUTH”. In Paul’s opinion Christ was the eternal truth.....



If you see the ' Pearl ' as Wisdom then you could say Paul had the Wisdom to see Christ as the ' Eternal Truth '....
Different interpretations :smile:

Soul Seeker 21-11-2020 06:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Miss Hepburn
Fascinating - For those that don't click the link.
The 2 sentence copy limit, btw.:wink:


The Jesus Sutras teach that because people’s innate good nature had become confused and obscured
(Christians might say “marred by sin”), God had to come to Earth as Ye Su (Jesus).

“Therefore, my Lord Ye Su, the One emanating in three subtle bodies, hid his true power, became a human,
and came on behalf of the Lord of Heaven to preach the good teachings” (2:17).



Do you see our normal condition and human natures as being corrupted?

I have no problem of evil and thus do not.

Regards
DL

Soul Seeker 21-11-2020 06:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Molearner
Sky123,

These 2 opposite interpretations (one with Jesus as the merchant...the other as us as the merchant) suggest how the duality of 2 can morph into the non duality of 1. When opposites attract they merge into 1(marriage). In this instance we can be inspired by either. The net result is that we were inspired....the result being more important than the reason......if that makes any sense.....:)


"When opposites attract they merge into 1(marriage)."

I disagree, and so does my wife. She compliments me. She does not oppose me.

Yin and Yang are not opposites. They compliment each other, like front and back.

I hope your wife is not the opposite of you. Why would you marry such a person if she was?

Regards
DL

Soul Seeker 21-11-2020 06:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sky123
Makes perfect sense :smile:


' When opposites attract they merge into 1(marriage).'

Obviously Yin/Yang in Taoism..


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S3LJ5HNfNEY

Think complimentary and not opposite. This author ended in promoting Taoism.

I like this as well. from the same author.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XXi_ldNRNtM#t=134

Regards
DL

sky123 21-11-2020 06:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Soul Seeker
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S3LJ5HNfNEY

Think complimentary and not opposite. This author ended in promoting Taoism.

I like this as well. from the same author.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XXi_ldNRNtM#t=134

Regards
DL




Yin/Yang represent two different sides of one coin, opposites but their properties are complementary and dependent on one another as one can't exist without the other. Each contains the seed of the other....

Miss Hepburn 21-11-2020 06:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Soul Seeker
Do you see our normal condition and human natures as being corrupted?

You're asking me?
No. I have said many times here our true self, our true nature,
our core, our essence is pure, full of wonder and innocent.

sky123 21-11-2020 06:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Soul Seeker
"When opposites attract they merge into 1(marriage)."

I disagree, and so does my wife. She compliments me. She does not oppose me.

Yin and Yang are not opposites. They compliment each other, like front and back.

I hope your wife is not the opposite of you. Why would you marry such a person if she was?

Regards
DL






' When opposites attract they merge into 1(marriage)." '


Yin/Yang is not about opposing but being complimentary. They work together to bring balance and harmony....

Soul Seeker 21-11-2020 08:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sky123
Yin/Yang represent two different sides of one coin, opposites but their properties are complementary and dependent on one another as one can't exist without the other. Each contains the seed of the other....


Indeed, but again, they are not of opposing value. The rear is not a minus value.

If I gave you a coin with the front rubbed away, the opposite side would still be seen and of thus the coin would not lose it's value.

Regards
DL

Soul Seeker 21-11-2020 08:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Miss Hepburn
You're asking me?
No. I have said many times here our true self, our true nature,
our core, our essence is pure, full of wonder and innocent.


I also venerate us, but knowing DNA as I think I do, I cannot give us innocence.

We are born thinking, truthfully so, that we are the fittest of our line, and that means we have the ability to sin when born.

By sin here, I mean that we can and will compete in life and that creates evil, in the sense that the losers to those competitions will feel that evil has befallen them.

Our (forced evolution), is what creates all human to human evil.

Regards
DL

Soul Seeker 21-11-2020 08:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sky123
' When opposites attract they merge into 1(marriage)." '


Yin/Yang is not about opposing but being complimentary. They work together to bring balance and harmony....


Then perhaps you should consider using --- compliments to each other --- instead of opposites.

Regards
DL

Miss Hepburn 21-11-2020 08:16 PM

Evil's not much in my vocab, sorry.

Soul Seeker 21-11-2020 08:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Miss Hepburn
Evil's not much in my vocab, sorry.


For evil to grow, all good people need do is, not have evil much in ones vocab.

Christian homophobia and misogyny grew because the good let those evils grow.

Regards
DL

sky123 21-11-2020 08:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Soul Seeker
Then perhaps you should consider using --- compliments to each other --- instead of opposites.

Regards
DL



No thanks, I see them as opposites which compliment each other :smile:

Miss Hepburn 21-11-2020 08:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Soul Seeker
For evil to grow, all good people need do is, not have evil much in ones vocab.

Christian homophobia and misogyny grew because the good let those evils grow.

Regards
DL

And I would say the opposite: Focus and focus and focus on it and it stays watered like a plant.
I don't need it in my vocab ---cuz it is in plenty of other's vocab.

It reminds me of what Mother Theresa said when asked if she would march in an Anti War March.
She said, No, but she would march in a Peace March.

Neither of us is saying evil or war don't exist - just focus on the other side, peace and goodness more.

Soul Seeker 21-11-2020 09:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sky123
No thanks, I see them as opposites which compliment each other :smile:


**** wad.

Kidding.

:hug2:

Regards
DL

Soul Seeker 21-11-2020 09:21 PM

Miss Hepburn.

Check your P.M.

Regards
DL

BigJohn 22-11-2020 12:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sky123
Yin/Yang represent two different sides of one coin, opposites but their properties are complementary and dependent on one another as one can't exist without the other. Each contains the seed of the other....


............ actually, a coin has 3 sides, something most people overlook.

BigJohn 22-11-2020 01:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Soul Seeker
For evil to grow, all good people need do is, not have evil much in ones vocab.

Christian homophobia and misogyny grew because the good let those evils grow.

Regards
DL


CHRISTIAN MISOGYNY?


Surely you jest!

How many women are head of a Church today?
A fair number.

WHY?

As a Jewish Sect broke away from Judaism and became Christianity, they immediately began changing certain beliefs and practices because they were no longer under Jewish LAW. The most progressive of the Apostles was Saint Paul (who died around 65 A.D.). Paul showered the congregations that, 'what was', is no longer 'so'. Animal sacrifice was done away with. Tithing was done away with. Women were allowed to do more things such as use their homes for places of worship.

There are several women mentioned in the Bible that Paul held in high regard. Jesus, who instituted the transformation of teachings very favorable to women set the example for others to emulate. Jesus had women play major roles in his ministries, their presence at his death and resurrection.

Much has been said and written about how this new religion was perpetuated. If Paul had lived longer, I am confident more changes for women would have come forth. Now, today, we see women leading congregations.

AS FOR CHRISTIAN HOMOPHOBIA

Today, virtually all Christians do not believe that.

sky123 22-11-2020 07:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigJohn
............ actually, a coin has 3 sides, something most people overlook.



Actually we are referring to Yin/Yang not monetary coins :smile: Yin/Yang Elements come in Two pairs not Three....

sky123 22-11-2020 09:54 AM

Jesus Sutra-Overcome and Renew....
 
Shower us with Your Healing Rain.
Help us to overcome, give life to what has withered, and water the roots of kindness in us.



Maybe referring to ' A shower of blessings '.

Soul Seeker 22-11-2020 03:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigJohn

CHRISTIAN MISOGYNY?


Surely you jest!

How many women are head of a Church today?
A fair number.

WHY?

As a Jewish Sect broke away from Judaism and became Christianity, they immediately began changing certain beliefs and practices because they were no longer under Jewish LAW. The most progressive of the Apostles was Saint Paul (who died around 65 A.D.). Paul showered the congregations that, 'what was', is no longer 'so'. Animal sacrifice was done away with. Tithing was done away with. Women were allowed to do more things such as use their homes for places of worship.

There are several women mentioned in the Bible that Paul held in high regard. Jesus, who instituted the transformation of teachings very favorable to women set the example for others to emulate. Jesus had women play major roles in his ministries, their presence at his death and resurrection.

Much has been said and written about how this new religion was perpetuated. If Paul had lived longer, I am confident more changes for women would have come forth. Now, today, we see women leading congregations.

AS FOR CHRISTIAN HOMOPHOBIA

Today, virtually all Christians do not believe that.


I disagree, and if you check the % of women clergy, your number will be tiny.

There are two wings to religions and my target is the right, while you speak of the left.

How many right wingers are there who still discriminate against women and gays without a just cause?

Your last election showed way to many.

I would be ashamed of Canada if we showed ourselves to be as backwards thinking as Americans.

If you are correct, then women have been declared as equal in the church and they will remove the misogynous teachings in the bible. Right?

Regards
DL


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