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-   -   The self/I is not ego-mind. The ego-mind is not the sense of I/self. (http://www.spiritualforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=137713)

MikeS80 01-11-2020 08:09 PM

The self/I is not ego-mind. The ego-mind is not the sense of I/self.
 
The ego-mind uses language, concepts, metaphors, analogies and other worldly things as tools or instruments to describe, experience, express and to get to know the self/itself/god (or whatever you want to call god), the physical universe and everything in the universe, which includes other ego-minds describing, experiencing, expressing and getting to know the self/itself/god (or whatever you want to call god), the physical universe and everything in the universe.

The self is the physical manifestation/form of god or whatever you want to call god, thus god and the self are one!

running 01-11-2020 10:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MikeS80
The ego-mind uses language, concepts, metaphors, analogies and other worldly things as tools or instruments to describe, experience, express and to get to know the self/itself/god (or whatever you want to call god), the physical universe and everything in the universe, which includes other ego-minds describing, experiencing, expressing and getting to know the self/itself/god (or whatever you want to call god), the physical universe and everything in the universe.

The self is the physical manifestation/form of god or whatever you want to call god, thus god and the self are one!


sort of. one still has to open up to the self in order for it to be experienced.

MikeS80 02-11-2020 02:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by running
sort of. one still has to open up to the self in order for it to be experienced.

Yes, one has to open up to the self, and one has to be honest with one's self.

Miss Hepburn 02-11-2020 10:18 PM

How do you, would you differentiate the 2
-egoic mind and self?

Reminds me of Wayne Dyer talking about the Lower ego self - and the Higher ego self.
I love certain people - I know who they are...and their stupid ego is not them, nor
what I love about them. Their 'essence', their true self is what I love and know.

MikeS80 03-11-2020 01:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Miss Hepburn
How do you, would you differentiate the 2
-egoic mind and self?

Reminds me of Wayne Dyer talking about the Lower ego self - and the Higher ego self.
I love certain people - I know who they are...and their stupid ego is not them, nor
what I love about them. Their 'essence', their true self is what I love and know.

The self is the heart feeling of I/I am in the present moment and the self uses ego-mind as a tool/instrument to use language, concepts, metaphors, analogies and other worldly things to describe, experience, express and to get to know itself/god (or whatever you call god) in physical form. God/oneness/wholeness/non-duality/ultimate and absolute reality, literally speaking, not figuratively speaking is the NOW/present moment. Everything that takes place both in the physical universe and in the spirit(ual) world, takes place in the same exact NOW/present moment, thus the physical universe and the spirit(ual) world are one and the same.

loopylucid 03-11-2020 08:31 PM

Whats wrong with being human, why do we have to seperate ourselves off into all these labels, and then disown them to call ourselfs spiritual lol, esp when if we agree all is energy, then we have plenty o time to experience the rest in the here after lol

MikeS80 03-11-2020 11:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by loopylucid
Whats wrong with being human, why do we have to seperate ourselves off into all these labels, and then disown them to call ourselfs spiritual lol, esp when if we agree all is energy, then we have plenty o time to experience the rest in the here after lol

Nothing is wrong with being human and nothing is wrong with describing, expressing and getting to know self/oneness/wholeness/the NOW-the present moment aka god or whatever you want to call god. In fact, that is why we are right here, right NOW! :D

Edit: The point is to be an individual, yet not be separate at the same time!

Greenslade 04-11-2020 10:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MikeS80
The ego-mind uses language, concepts, metaphors, analogies and other worldly things as tools or instruments to describe, experience, express and to get to know the self/itself/god (or whatever you want to call god), the physical universe and everything in the universe, which includes other ego-minds describing, experiencing, expressing and getting to know the self/itself/god (or whatever you want to call god), the physical universe and everything in the universe.

The self is the physical manifestation/form of god or whatever you want to call god, thus god and the self are one!

The mind is in a symbiotic relationship with the ego and is not subordinate to it, it's one of the aspects of the framework of the ego. The self encompasses the ego and the unconscious, which also has a number of processes 'operating' that most people don't even know exist, but yet are instrumental in choices, decisions and beliefs - they are a part of the creation of the framework or one's reality. What you become conscious of is, for the most part, a 'product' of those 'subsystems. Jung says that the ego (one of the descriptors he uses anyway) is the centre of the field of consciousness. The self encompasses both the conscious (the ego) and unconscious aspects, the unconscious aspects being the Shadow Self, cognitive behaviour and dissonance, animus and anima...........

If you prefer a more Spiritual approach then you should be aware of Ahamakara and its underlying Chitta, Ahamkara has been described as the "I-maker" and Chitta is Lower Mind. It's worth noting that Jung was a scholar of Eastern Spirituality and based his model of the ego on Ahamkara, and that many understandings psychology has have parallels to ancient Eastern understandings.

So my question is, are people truly self aware when they don't know how (or even about) the unconscious 'subsystems' of the self are even 'operating'? Because they are part of the self.

"People measure their self-knowledge by what the average person in their social environment knows of himself, but not the real psychic facts which are for the most part hidden from them."
Anyone who has any ego-consciousness at all takes it for granted that he knows himself. But the ego knows only its own contents, not the unconscious and its contents.

"People measure their self-knowledge by what the average person in their social environment knows of himself, but not by the real psychic facts which are for the most part hidden from them. In this respect the psyche behaves like the body, of whose physiological and anatomical structure the average person knows very little too.
Carl Jung, "The Undiscovered Self.

The ego utilises reason, intelligence, logic.... all that 'mind stuff' to 'process' and 'navigate' this level of reality - your "tools and instruments," they're all used to interact with the physical world around us. The unconscious is apart from mind and utilises dream-like states which have a very different 'logic and reason' the the mind. This is where dream interpretations come from, often they are the unconscious trying to communicate with the conscious mind, but in consciousness.

The self encompasses both the conscious and the unconscious aspects, the unconscious aspects being what Jung calls "the real psychic facts."

If we don't truly understand ourselves are we ready to understand what's beyond ourselves?

Greenslade 04-11-2020 10:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by loopylucid
Whats wrong with being human, why do we have to seperate ourselves off into all these labels, and then disown them to call ourselfs spiritual lol, esp when if we agree all is energy, then we have plenty o time to experience the rest in the here after lol

Does Spirit do Spirituality?

“The temple of the most high begins with the body which houses our life, the essence of our existence. Africans are in bondage today because they approach spirituality through religion provided by foreign invaders and conquerors. We must stop confusing religion and spirituality. Religion is a set of rules, regulations and rituals created by humans, which was suppose to help people grow spiritually. Due to human imperfection religion has become corrupt, political, divisive and a tool for power struggle. Spirituality is not theology or ideology. It is simply a way of life, pure and original as was given by the Most High of Creation. Spirituality is a network linking us to the Most High, the universe, and each other…”
― Haile Selassie I

MikeS80 04-11-2020 12:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Greenslade
The mind is in a symbiotic relationship with the ego and is not subordinate to it, it's one of the aspects of the framework of the ego. The self encompasses the ego and the unconscious, which also has a number of processes 'operating' that most people don't even know exist, but yet are instrumental in choices, decisions and beliefs - they are a part of the creation of the framework or one's reality. What you become conscious of is, for the most part, a 'product' of those 'subsystems. Jung says that the ego (one of the descriptors he uses anyway) is the centre of the field of consciousness. The self encompasses both the conscious (the ego) and unconscious aspects, the unconscious aspects being the Shadow Self, cognitive behaviour and dissonance, animus and anima...........

If you prefer a more Spiritual approach then you should be aware of Ahamakara and its underlying Chitta, Ahamkara has been described as the "I-maker" and Chitta is Lower Mind. It's worth noting that Jung was a scholar of Eastern Spirituality and based his model of the ego on Ahamkara, and that many understandings psychology has have parallels to ancient Eastern understandings.

So my question is, are people truly self aware when they don't know how (or even about) the unconscious 'subsystems' of the self are even 'operating'? Because they are part of the self.

"People measure their self-knowledge by what the average person in their social environment knows of himself, but not the real psychic facts which are for the most part hidden from them."
Anyone who has any ego-consciousness at all takes it for granted that he knows himself. But the ego knows only its own contents, not the unconscious and its contents.

"People measure their self-knowledge by what the average person in their social environment knows of himself, but not by the real psychic facts which are for the most part hidden from them. In this respect the psyche behaves like the body, of whose physiological and anatomical structure the average person knows very little too.
Carl Jung, "The Undiscovered Self.

The ego utilises reason, intelligence, logic.... all that 'mind stuff' to 'process' and 'navigate' this level of reality - your "tools and instruments," they're all used to interact with the physical world around us. The unconscious is apart from mind and utilises dream-like states which have a very different 'logic and reason' the the mind. This is where dream interpretations come from, often they are the unconscious trying to communicate with the conscious mind, but in consciousness.

The self encompasses both the conscious and the unconscious aspects, the unconscious aspects being what Jung calls "the real psychic facts."

If we don't truly understand ourselves are we ready to understand what's beyond ourselves?

I am speaking from my own personal and non-conditioned inner self-realization or experience. I am not speaking from someone else's or other people's conditioned/subjective inner "self-realization" or "experience".

Did you truly or genuinely self-realize or experience for yourself what you and Jung said about the ego, mind, Chitta, and etc or is it all speculation and maybe even wishful thinking?


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