The distinction between ''spiritual'' and ''religious'' is problematic. Religion means ''to commune with the divine'', spiritual relates to spirits or spiritual phenomena. Religions can believe in a personal deity or they don't, similarly true for 'spiritual' people..

When I see people say ''I'm spiritual, not religious'' and then check their beliefs and practices I see a mix of Hindu and Buddhist beliefs and a very liberal interpretation of Jesus and Christianity. It might not be a particular religion they follow but they still try and ''commune with the divine'' and believe in things that religions believe in...

It's nice to hear you see people being attentive to the natural world, but I think these people are the exception and not the norm. I've spend plenty of time in various environment and conservation groups and I don't notice a lot of 'spiritual' people there, just as I don't see people in spiritual communities (online and offline) discuss these issues much. There's more of a disinterest in it and a desire to escape the world and focus purely on the self, which I see as a reflection of the environment and society we have created..

Thank you for your thoughts..

I'm glad other people are recognizing that we have some serious issues to confront beyond the whole "what are we?" questions.

Chances are that people are more focused on making money and providing a living for themselves, rather than caring for the planet and their surroundings. My generation knows about all of these issues but we've been tagged with the "broke college student" situation of debts and starting at the bottom of a long way up in terms of making a living for ourselves, plus the decade or two of indoctrination as to how to think, we're at an incredible disadvantage to fund the projects we see would help the most, especially compared to the bigger companies that care more about profit than liberation and have a much larger say over the trends.

And that attachment to money is what's breaking us. Competition over cooperation leads to separation instead of unionizing. Deception through altered perceptions over honest communication. And a money system that gradually sucks away our abilities over time, this is the root of what I believe is the problem. Because it's all fun to liberate lives, but if you can't pay those bills...

Hello

How were you able to tell whether someone is spiritual by looking at them? Are they suppose to display certain clothes or jewelry to distingish someone being spiritual? I've noticed some pagans don't bother to wear any jewelry pertaining to their beliefs. I know I don't. That doesn't mean they're not pagan. Same for spiritual people. And helping the environment and conservation group can be a spiritual experience. Especially for those who view the Earth sacred. Some are even calling the Earth a Goddess. Science has been able to prove that Earth is a living organism further legitimizing an existential deity, Gaia.

I believe many don't discuss these topics is because many spiritual seekers want to improve their lives, and religious followers are more concerned with an outside force to arrive to 'save them' from the 'end of times'.

But there are some people making a difference in nature regardless whether they're spiritual or not.

Lepus

I don't know about clothes and jewellery Lepus! :D
I go with people's views, actions, and beliefs, and how it shapes the environment they live in, and how people are also shaped by their environment..


I believe it to be a reflection of the society we have created. Removed from nature, existing in but sterile man made landscapes with a handful of domesticated animals. All that remains is 'the self'. Buddhism for instance was born and raised to maturity in an urban context. Christianity believes humans are God's most precious creation. People start to imagine they are the only thing that matters, that they are the epitome of life ((central in all mainstream religion)), and that their suffering and existential dread gives a glimpse into the secret of the universe..

The connection is lost, and 'the other', be it the Earth, the animals, or other people become only tools to said individual..

You mentioned Gaia. I think this would be a good example as well. Do we worship a deity for our own gain, just as ''an aspect'' of some supersoul, or do we recognize, revere, and respect diversity of life and the very creativity of the universe, which includes some spirits occupying other bodies and having unique functions in this web of life..?

It seems to me this recognition is a taboo outside of the 'pagan' context...

Yes.. that is funny. People can actually worship and revere the Earth and the Sun even if they're not using those words..
In practice I see no difference.. :wink:

Thank you for your thoughts, Lepus..

I came across this and thought it was well put..

Quote:

If we accept that spirituality compels us toward love, compassion, and ethical ways of living, then spirituality necessarily leads us toward a moral imperative to take better care of the Earth than we are now doing as a global society. All living beings are inextricably connected to the Earth. We are made of her elements and minerals. We emerge from her at birth; we eat the food and drink the water that she provides; and at the end of life, we become a part of her once again. As humans, we also intrinsically rely on far deeper aspects of our relationship with nature, such as our need for creative inspiration, peace and tranquility, and a deep interconnectedness to the energy and vibration of all life on the planet. The Earth is a complex and intricate web. When we negatively impact our planet, we harm all beings who depend on her for life. Likewise, when we hurt people, plants, or animals, we damage the Earth as well. If we look within, we are sure to find a longing in our hearts to protect the Earth herself from suffering and sadness, to create a world in which we can each pursue our dreams and aspirations without harming the one planet that supports the type of life that we love and treasure. - Jocelyn Mercado https://blog.pachamama.org/the-spiri...vironmentalism

Humans Are Driving One Million Species to Extinction
https://www.scientificamerican.com/a...to-extinction/


What we do with this information, how we act, etc gives us a clue about our own spirituality. Do we care only about our own self-discovery or do we extent our self beyond that and care about the living space of our own kind and of so many others..? Do we appreciate the world and it's diversity or do we turn our backs to it and only care about the self?

Choices, choices...

Good point.

Ultimately we're chained onto a system of our own creation. It seems like spiritualism is a movement for people to just "be okay and accept" it, when in truth all it takes is an active choice to step off the treadmill and learn what it means to be human again, with real connections and a real voice.

This certainly is a dilemma.

I think of and speak of Mother or Grandmother earth. I think act do and try to stay aware of Her as a relative.

It is a overwhelming subject to see or here of all the destruction.

Even Spiritual people like those that purchase crystals. Do they consider the destruction that happened when many of those crystals were mined?
It appears not.

The Grandmother earth can not continue to be raped without dire consequences.
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^^^^

Many many many people lack any understanding of what they are doing and why they are doing it, I work at a Biodynamic vineyard which means they grow grapes to make wine without any chemicals and use only natural products to speak with the cosmos, but after 8 months I have not seen anyone ever do anything about talking to spirits which inhabit the lands to decide what to do, instead they just follow a procedure from a organisation based of a mans beliefs from the other side of the world, and my work colleagues believe they are doing the right thing with their hearts because they think following these practices from a country on the other side of the world is the best thing to do for grapes/plants/animals/soil which is completely different, I know that these people have no idea when they are amazed at how I take photos of things like hawks and kingfishes and other things in nature and my timing is impeccable and when I can tell them how i knew things before they happened like a good harvest because I had a kingfisher show up the day before we picked a really good bunch of grapes just as example, but this is because i do energy working, quite often I’ll channel some energy and just leave it for anything to grab and use, and i also get a hawk which comes and sits by me when their are spirits which would like some energy channeled for some plants or animal. I also have a friendly neighborhood spirit ;) which I work with ( going on 6 months ) who I have tested and proves to be incrediblely trust worth and a all round great entity who together have made it so it can push thoughts into my mind no matter what I’m doing to alert me of things before they happen on things like go a different route and get your camera out, or there is something sitting in the next row like a bird which you can take a great photo of or there will be a item which will break very soon which you will need to stop and fix etc
Another thing which shows this issues of people not understanding what they are saying or doing is what I called borrowed wisedom, a example of this my brother will say “karma’s a ***** so watch out” when he gets ****ed of with me pointing out his bull**** lies, and then doesn’t believe me when I rely with the likes of “actually you don’t know that, my karma is something beautiful”. Best example I can give of borrowed wisedom is I used a phase of “that’s just your opinion...” which I would use when people are being nasty and disrespectful and dishonest to me and then days later when I say something honest which is true for them they just go “that’s just your opinion” and only repeat because I said it to them previously, the point I’m trying to make is people will just say what they want and use labels which make them feel better and push’s them higher on their own social status without caring about what it truely means only about how it puts them in a higher social status than someone else. People will use the term spiritual for beliefs in gods cos they see someone else use it and get viewed better than themselves and because of their current nature they will use the same labels to be included into a social group/area. but this is also a problem which deals with a lot of other things like dishonesty, people believing in everything they are told, instinctively following the crowds, desires to fit into a crowd just to name a few