Tempted By Meat?
 

Between the age of 18 and 22 I was a vegetarian (I did not Smoke/drink either and exercised regularly). THEN I went to Art School and all those disciplines collapsed so that I ended up eating meat, smoking, drinking, and not exercising. It's not Art Schools fault; it's my fault. Also I met a Woman who had all those 'habits' too. Now that I'm 40 I still can't give up meat or the other vices however much I'd like to. I've sort of gotten into a rut of being dependent on all those bad habits.
I do feel sure that one day the need for those vices will pass. My spiritual strength is increasing and the apeal of meat, cigarettes etc. is slowly dying down.
To have a healthy and conscientious lifestyle is a priceless achievement which I'm not going to give up striving for!

I guess the point I was trying to make is that I'd love to be a vegetarian, but I struggle with the temptation to eat meat. Trying to give up meat is like trying to give up smoking (well maybe not that bad).
Is anyone else struggling to be a veggie? Or is anyone struggling to stay a veggie? For someone like me who loves the taste of meat and enjoys smoking giving these vices up is difficult.
I think a spiritual life is built up slowly through discipline and perseverence and good will. When it collapses on you like mine did (for all sorts of reasons) it is a real challenge to build it back up again. :icon_porc: :icon_porc:

hi honza

i used to smoke and gave up so many times before i stopped completely. i became a vegetarian at 13 and tried to eat meat again a few times in my early 20's but out of habit just went back to being vege each time.

the longer i went without cigarettes the worse they tasted when i gave in and had them again...eventually i went off them.

i would say...don't be hard on yourself. sometimes we go to the other extreme and become a "body fascist" instead. how many ex smokers have you met who are "born again" and so anti it's ludicrous? i've met many LOL. the higher the pedestal you create for yourself and your standards, the harder you fall. so that's where binging becomes a problem.

just start small. go with your body if it craves them but ease it off the meat and ciggies. your body prefers to be without toxins so it will adjust in time the less and less you put toxins into it. then it will go towards the healthy options.

try and not eat meat for a few days. don't be hard on yourself if you eat some steak after. try another few meatless days after. keep trying calmly. pick yourself up and dust yourself off and start again.

remember to substitute the protein well like with protein shakes, legumes, tofu etc...other wise it will be harder to say no to meat because the body is craving protein. it will make you crave the main kind it knows if your deprive it.

my weakness is carbs...and loads of them. my body lets me know when i need to cleanse it though. the healthier our bodies get, the easier it is to turn away from the junk. i ease more veges and fruit into my diet so it leaves less room for bread etc and cheese (mmmm....cheese)exercise...especially walking is so important as well. it clears so much.

good luck...you'll do it. you'll be a good influence on your partner also. small changes are better than none at all.

Cigs? I would wait untill my next bout of cold or flu when We go off the wretched things and give up.
Meat? we need to find alternatives. Give up red meat, it is not good. Deep water fish, away from poluted shores is better.
Mix your meat thing in with rice and eat less of it.
Pay more and get organic meat. Pigs are not good for eating, we can use their organs for human transplant, which is as close to canibalism as you want to go.
White meat, then on to tofu, tempeh etc.
Brown rice, millet, barley(cook well) etc. Corn is a grain also.
There is nothing wrong with a bowl of porridge every morning. Use barley malt or rice syrup, or raisins to sweeten. Baby figs even.
Use sya milk instead.

Not sure I understand what you're getting at here, AL. Why are pigs not good for eating? Although humans can receive transplants from pigs I think the DNA of a pig is sufficiently removed from that of a human for there not to be a moral objection on that point. And yes, I am aware of humans being referred to as "long pig" in parts of the world, and the fact that charred human flesh is said to smell of roast pork.

Generally I struggle with the meat eating thing... I am not veggie and don't think I ever could be, but I don't eat a lot of meat, and very little red meat. But somehow I can't seem to get round the fact that humans would appear to be programmed to eat meat; I'm thinking of our teeth and digestive system here. So although the process of rearing animals for meat is a little unsavoury (sorry!), I just can't seem to feel guilty about it.


Love and Light,
Jeremy :cool:

fair enough. i don't believe in forcing one's beliefs on others. how do any of us know what is truly the way to be?

my views on vegetarianism have changed and grown since i started. i personally believe eating meat is ok as it's part of the food chain. i have issues with the way it's raised. obviously. but i have some leather shoes still, i have sweat shop sneakers...etc etc.

i just personally don't eat meat. and it's easy for me. we all have different ways of doing our bit. some is better than nothing.

well, yes we do have meat eating teeth. they're there for a reason. although ive done some reading on cancer patients healing themselves through cycles of fasting and consuming raw fruits and veggies. organic would be the way to go to be more healthy (factory processed is obviously unhealthy). personally i believe, a great deal of the worlds cancers and disease originate with the consumption of factory processed foods, with all the chemicals they add to preserve etc.

back to the point: if you can find a way to quit smoking, im sure quitting meat would be a breeze.

nice to meat you
 

There are many reasons why some are unlikely to be vegy, one small example may be those who are Tigers in Chinese astrology.
It is good to know what we are eating. For instance, If I ate meat (I have not eaten meat fish or eggs for over 25 years and people struggle to accept my age, when they ask. So ther are no problems in terms of health, if we do it right.)
Some of the things involved in the processing of meat as far as I am aware-
Hormones, anti biotics, steroids and a host of other chemicals etc.
I would suggest, eat organic meat if you must. Beter still, wild game or fish/ chicken, white meat.
The thing about meat is that it breaks down too well, in fact, the human intestine is too long and so the meat has gone off by the time it passes through our body. Bowel Cancer?
The intestines of a cow on the other hand are longer, so eating grass is not the ultimate answer as our intestines are too short and may not extract the goodness before it has past through our system.
So the human body is designed to eat cooked food perhaps with some raw.
Consider the size of a cow, from eating only grass.
Consider all these big strong vegy creatures like elephants, gorillas, giraffe
etc. Then when we look at predatory meat eaters, they are generally small thin and fast. Ok, big cats.
The predators will get veg matter from the contents of the stomach.
I cant think of one meat eater who eats none vegetarians. To eat a meat eater is obviously considered too toxic by nature. Fish are not animals.
I remember reading that, a sack of brown rice has an aura of, I think it was 7 feet radius. I wonder what size the aura of a sack of flesh would be?
Chew a lot, it saves the digestive system work.
peace Al

I agree with this! It's like when we try really ultra hard to quit something or stay away from something then there is an equally imbalanced reaction to that thing and all of the karmas are still there, tightly interwoven. If I still wanted to eat meat, then I'd still be eating it. It's only because I really genuinely went off it, and genuinely went off cigarettes too, that I don't do either of them any more. But I'm not a raging anti-smoker or a raging vegetarian - if everyone else still does it then that's fine. (obviously I care about the welfare of the animals and cringe at factory farming methods, but I think that's a different issue to the consumption of meat per se).

extreme
 

When I look at the world, it is almost as if another species is controlling our diet. Predators who live on flesh and who want to subdue us all to make us weak.
Change, but do it gradually and don't get fanatical. But don't mock those who are making genuine effort and therefore holding a mirror to your own weaknesses. People have been abused in a big way, if NATURAL seems extreme, it only goes to show how far we have strayed, or been taken, from our natural ways. We need to go slowly if we choose to change.
lol Al

thanks e-ma. we are of like minds i think :)

AL - i like what you said. i have noticed many people get so defensive and rude when i say i don't eat meat. but a few of those people have admitted to feeling guilt themselves. i just hold a mirror to them...but not intentionally.

i have never wanted to make people feel bad about not doing what i do. i don't want to feel bad when i see people living self sufficiently. i want to be pleased for them and be inspired by their efforts.

i wish people could accept each other more. and not have a go or make digs about the leather shoes etc etc. not all vegetarians have the same reason for not eating meat. the reasons are vast for many. just like the reasons for eating meat are also.

bone
 

As we are in changing times, people WILL get a little rigid and religious about the food thing. Dogmatic even when they feel the benefits. It seems to be a natural honeymoon sort of thing with it. After a year or two, we tend to ease off and it just becomes natural. People need to be allowed to go through their initial phase /fad thing. Some eventually go back to their old ways and others start to take in more of what they have given up, retaining the essence of what they have learnt, but the period of cleansing will have done them good. There are good vegetarians, and not so good ones, because it is all about knowledge, knowledge which should be taught to us in school, from our parents, tv etc, then given the practical experience of preparing that which we have knowledge of in terms of food.
The best way to convince others about the diet thing is to let them taste the food. The proof of the ......
Blaming out parents is a none starter, not a wise thing. It lacks understanding.
Come on meat eaters, you can surely knock up more of a debate than this. Heh, sorry if that is a bit close to the er.. bone.
peace Al.

close to the bone, tee hee :toothy4:

Yup, I know what you mean about the tolerance thing rose, I guess that's why I try to mention it as little as possible, and generally pass the issue off by saying 'oh, I don't eat that much meat really', it's full acceptance of them and nobody gets defensive.

I would be just as happy for a push towards totally humane organic meat than I would full vegetarianism.. but veggie food really can be 100% lush..

AL, I doubt many meat eaters would daaaare to come into a Veggie and Vegan forum?!!

who's line is it anyway
 

I uderstand your stance there, not to rock the boat. The other side is, I feel as if I am not dealing with people and THEIR ways, but am dealing with those who have made them this way, from birth. Ignorance is bliss.
We must of course accept others ways, many of my friends eat meat. But I wonder if they know what they are really eating. The real problem in the world is that people just don't care, it is this giving up despondency thing which is most dificult to deal with in the self and others.
Spirituality can help to bring hope and faith.
Al

Yup, spirituality can bring hope and faith.. but that's only good if you actually need hope and faith.. before I had a spiritual awakening I didn't need any of these things, there were plenty of other pleasures and trapments in the material world that were keeping me totally absorbed and happy. I think it takes an awareness from birth or a wake-up call to become spiritually aware and to commence your spiritual evolution.

As for wanting to make the others realise what they're doing, I know exactly what you mean, but at the moment all I can do is live my life with my philosophies and maybe provide an example.

At my work I have been devastated because the Rentokil people have been called in and piles of rat bait and traps have been installed everywhere, outside, around the grass and trees and bushes.. everywhere. A letter was distributed to everyone saying 'There has been an infestation of vermin' and giving instructions on what to do to try and get this plague finished as quickly as possible. I have had the pleasure of watching a family of rats raising their young, I saw them every morning before work and used to love observing their habits and their environment. And now the family has gone, and hundreds of others have been killed, and all of the trees and bushes are to be removed from the site as well. I felt sick when I heard this news from my superiors, and said to all of my colleagues that I was gutted, and that I felt sorry for the rats. Is this the 16th Century? Where do people stop, when the entire natural world has been destroyed?

But, sorry for the ramble and getting back to the point, although I feel strongly and I do want to run around screaming "Don't you realise?!" I will simply carry on and leave that decision to the people who are making the decision.

It's a really tough one eh.

These creatures have no sphincter, which means they have no control over their urine excretion etc.
If they happen to be on your loaf of bread at the time......
So, there is a limit. If they are in my kitchen, I have the rite.
Rats urine is very poisonous. However, I suspect they were blaimed for the likes of the plague when it may not have been them.
These rats will have a food supply nearby, is someone leaving things out for the birds for instance? They seem to nest where there is grub, and why not.
peace.

I guess so Al, but I wish we could use a humane method of removing them - these rentokil methods are just draconian if you ask me. There is a pretty big source of food nearby, a bread factory next door. LOL. But I still think that if the factories secure all of their rubbish and waste and everything is cleaned and sealed properly, the problem would take care of itself. I couldn't personally take the life of an animal :icon_frown:

mice
 

You can get devices which use sound to scare them off these days. I am about to get something and like yourself, dont want to kill.
Mice have excellent homing heads, you have to take them miles to let them go, or they find their way back.
The shops and restraunts bellow my flat and the many single folk/ students in the area keep them going.
The only true way is not to leave any food/ crumbs for them and they will go elsewhere.
I am in the situation at the moment where I need to do something though.
We had a rat in the back garden which was sustained by the bird feeder on a tree.
cheers

hehe, I hope you manage to find a decent and humane method of getting rid of them, Al. I always think about those sonic sound devices but in real life I never hear of them anywhere. I heard that mice really hate Cayenne Pepper.. Also, putting Moth Balls into a laundry bag and hanging that up, gets rid of every living thing (without harming them). OK, this is beginning to sound like a daytime TV article..

Hi,

I think I am the world's worst vegetarian. Everyone appears so healthy on this forum. I am one of those terrible people who doesn't eat meat but then fails to consume the correct substitutes - like beans, lentils and tofu - sorry can't hack it. I seem to live on pasta for the most part. I know, I know, very bad eating habits.

I became a vegetarian nine years ago and the only flesh I consume is tuna. Had to because the canteen at work did not have anything vegetarian. The only thing close was a tuna roll. I developed a taste for it before I got my act together to bring my own lunch. Anyway, I grew up on a farm and ate meat my entire life. Eventually I realised that it was making me ill. Ever since I stopped a series of health problems I had also ceased. I have never gone back.

I think if you want to eat meat go for it. I think it's a bit harsh that some poor animal has to die just so we can have a nice juicy steak - but also agree that we are in many ways designed to eat meat and have consumed it for a long time. It is a legitimate part of a healthy diet.

Alot of people do get wierd when they find out I'm vegetarian - they seem to think they have to apologise or that you are going to start preaching animal rights to them. But I'm fine with it and have no trouble admitting it - so they usually chill out pretty quickly.

Now, before I stop going on here I just have to know - can someone please tell me how they know cooked human flesh smells like pork? This is all a bit gruesome. But now I have a morbid curiosity. Sorry.

Take care.

All these bald fields and hills, bleek, the sheep etc eat the tree shoots so humans can eat THEM. It does not stack up at all.
Sorry, never tried human flesh, cant help you there. Grunt!

I differ in opinion here slightly. I agree that meat is probably packed with chemicals just like most things these days but I do think you should be eating what your body tells you to eat-perhaps you could change to the organic meats though if you can afford to. I believe the reason you loose the need to eat meat as you become more spiritually advanced is because your vibrations are raised and meat does weigh you down. Its for this reason that meat is good for grounding. I'd say go with the flow and trust your body and intuition it knows what you need and what it doesnt.

Alana:)

I'm a veggie because I don't believe in many modern day farming pracitises or live transport. Its a personal choice and one that I don't like to preach about cause everyone has free will to do what they please with!

Personally once I can afford to eat meat from my local organic farm, who have a modern, clean slaughterhouse on site I will probably start to eat bits of meat again as my body asks for it. Otherwise I can't support farmers who show total disregard for the 'produce'.

Same here Whisperer...
Love and light,
AM

Meat eaters need to grow some balls and go look an animal in the eye before they kill it.
Mass slaughter is a heartless, ive seen it with my own eyes , its not natural its not right.

You're not the only person who has said this Gonzo.
A good friend recently said that this is the precise reason he does not eat meat...

In my opinion, taking life is a negative karmic game - and if somebody wants to play it, you can only really feel sorry for them.

Because they are the one's who have to do the work on correcting it.

Love and light,

AM

:hug3: I've been a veggie now for 20 years and for me, tis the only way to be. Tho i dont force it down peoples throats... and if they ask me to explain i just say oh its for health reasons (which it is partly)... and if they push me even more, i say well i read in Linda Goodman's Love Signs (an astrology book) that she could never eat anything with 2 eyes that looked back at her..and i agree with that,it's just how i feel bout it. also i tell them when I used to watch my mum stuffing a chicken as a kid i just knew i'd never be DOING that...

love n peace

jan xx

Meat... I understand the disdain
 

I understand the various reasons why many choose a vegetarian diet. There is no doubt that our beautiful animals have become simply a *mass produced product* in order to fill the pockets of their many producers. Some have forgotten that these animals are living creatures that deserve our utmost respect and care. Some have bypassed the natural ways in which an animal should be raised, in order to satisfy the never ending growing demand of their customers, more quickly and efficiently. These producers have forgotten that an animal NEEDS fresh air, sunshine, room to roam freely, excellent quality natural food, and fresh water.... not too mention...the two most important of all ingredients... our total love and appreciation.

I, for myself, do eat meat, but I have chosen not to encourage mass production. I only buy my meat from a farmer that I know, who loves and respects his cattle like he does his own children. They are not pumped with steroids or needless medications. They live a much longer life than the average massed produced cattle. His farm is much smaller, and extemely well cared for. He is grateful and happy to be leading the way towards a new understanding of the care needed by our animal friends, that many people are now demanding more and more.....

This type of raising cattle resonates with me. The same goes for our feathered friends and the eggs they so graciously present to us as gifts.

My wish is to see all animals loved and respected for the marvelous creatures that they are. I hope to see the day when *mass production for massive profit* will be a thing of the past.

Love and Hugs to all, Wind of Grace xo.... :hug3:

Very well said Wind of Grace!
That was an absolute pleasure to read!
Love and light,
AM

Indeed, a beautiful post Wind of Grace.

Hopefully if the RSPCA passes their Animal Welfare Bill, the raising of animals and the production of meat for our consumption will become a heck of a lot better.

Thank you for the compliments xo....
 

Thank you both, AM & Whisperer, for your kind compliments xo.... :smile:

I agree Whisperer that there is little legislation to enforce the proper care of our friends. At least we have the option to support the producers of our choice. Even if we live in the city, if we own a deep freezer, some of the smaller organic producers offer frozen products that we can buy in bulk and store, until our next visit to the countryside. Im happy to have the option available to me :D


Love and Hugs to both of you xo....

Wind of Grace xo.... :hug3: