Bhagavan Sri Ramana Marharshi

[Chanine]

This thread is devoted to Bhagavan.

Please contribute anything from the life of Bhagavan Sri Ramana Marharshi, his talks, self inquiry, pictures, your views etc

Lets use this thread to stir the Pyre and burn the stick :smile:

[Miss Hepburn]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lLnrqpQyZDo


Well, here is a short youtube.:smile:

[Chanine]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lLnrqpQyZDo


Well, here is a short youtube.:smile:

Great little video Miss H, thank you for sharing

[Miss Hepburn]

Jan 21, 1937
Q: How will the sexual impulse cease to be?
RM: When differentiation ceases.
Q: How can it be effected?
RM: The ''opposite' sex, and it's relation, are only mental concepts.
The Upanishad says that all are dear because the Self is beloved of all.
One's happiness is within; the love is of the Self only. It is only within;
do not think it to be without. Then differentiation ceases to operate.

[Miss Hepburn]

Anyone can look up quotes of Ramana and that is wonderful. :thumbsup:
I intend to write out some talks with him...not as easy to find. :wink:


6/14/36
Q: What about bringing down divine consciousness from above?
RM: As if the same is not already in the Heart?......
Realization is only the removing of obstacles to the recognition of the eternal, immanent Reality
Reality is.
It need not be taken from place to place.

[Unseeking Seeker]

All that is required to realise the Self is to “Be Still.”
― Ramana Maharshi

***

[Miss Hepburn]

Q: ...how is the mind to be eliminated...?
RM: The mind is by nature restless. Begin liberating it from its restlessness;
give it peace, make it free from distractions, train it to look inward, and make
all this a habit. This is done by ignoring the external world and removing the obstacles to peace of mind.


2/4/35

[Shivani Devi]

https://goo.gl/images/vzKYXk

[Chanine]

4 This clear 'Lamp of Supreme Truth'
was not one that myself lit with my infantile and
immature knowledge - I whose heart had not seen the truth shine.
It was lit by my Lord Ramana with his ripe, supreme jnana.

Gura Vachaka Kovai

[Still_Waters]

All that is required to realize the Self is to “Be Still.”
― Ramana Maharshi

***

....and Ramana Maharshi's definition of "Be Still" is "I AM" with no other thoughts or qualifications.

Eventually, as he pointed out, that which is no longer even says "I AM".

(Ramana is one of my favorites.)

[Still_Waters]

Jan 21, 1937
Q: How will the sexual impulse cease to be?
RM: When differentiation ceases.
Q: How can it be effected?
RM: The ''opposite' sex, and it's relation, are only mental concepts.
The Upanishad says that all are dear because the Self is beloved of all.
One's happiness is within; the love is of the Self only. It is only within;
do not think it to be without. Then differentiation ceases to operate.

That quote is priceless and true.

[Chanine]

That which exists is only the one consciousness. The many conceptualised varieties of objective consciousness are only an imaginary notion in that which is.

Bhagavan

[Still_Waters]

There is an Arunchala Ashram in New York City and I go there for some of the programs when they are in the day time. (The ashram is in the far end of Queens and I live in the southern part of Brooklyn, so it's a long trek and daytime programs work best for me.) They're worth attending for those who live nearby.

http://www.arunachala.org/ashrama/new-york/

[Unseeking Seeker]

....and Ramana Maharshi's definition of "Be Still" is "I AM" with no other thoughts or qualifications.

Eventually, as he pointed out, that which is no longer even says "I AM".

(Ramana is one of my favorites.)

***

This evokes the unnecessary & inadequate elaboration that ...

In, as and one within the sea of oneness
Is the be-ness
Awareness
Just awareness
Of movement within stillness
Of consciousness
Knowing & becoming itself
The That Awareness

***

[Unseeking Seeker]

From an interview:

D.: What does Maharshi think of the theory of universal illusion (Maya)?
M.: What is Maya? It is only Reality.
D.: Is not Maya illusion?
M.: Maya is used to signify the manifestations of the Reality. Thus Maya is only Reality.

***

[Miss Hepburn]

Q: "Not this---not this." That is the teaching to the seeker. He is told
that the Self is Supreme. How is it to be found?
RM: The Self is said to be the hearer, thinker, knower, etc. But that is not all.
It is also described ear of ear, the mind of mind, etc.; and by what means
to know the knower?
Q: But this does not say what the Self is.
RM: "Not this---not this."

[Miss Hepburn]

Q: I have limitations. I am unable to rise to the occasion.
Grace may achieve for me what I can not achieve by myself.
RM: True, but unless there is Grace, this desire will not arise.




:wink:

[Still_Waters]

Q: "Not this---not this." That is the teaching to the seeker. He is told
that the Self is Supreme. How is it to be found?
RM: The Self is said to be the hearer, thinker, knower, etc. But that is not all.
It is also described ear of ear, the mind of mind, etc.; and by what means
to know the knower?
Q: But this does not say what the Self is.
RM: "Not this---not this."

Talk 41 from "Talks with Ramana Maharshi":

D.: I meditate neti-neti ("Not this --- not this").
M.: No --- that is not meditation. Find the source. You must reach the source without fail. The false "I" will disappear and the real "I" will be realized. The former cannot exist apart from the latter.

[Chanine]

"I" invokes this, because "I" is the last stand...RM

[Still_Waters]

"I" invokes this, because "I" is the last stand...RM

Verily, the "I" (the great I AM to many) is the last stand.

(Even Nisargadatta Maharaj has mentioned that the "I" (as in the great I AM) is on the border of the Absolute. It is both the first stand and the last stand. :smile:)

[Still_Waters]

Talk 177 from "Talks with Ramana Maharshi" (this goes deep into the process of creation):

Ramana: "...the body and all other objects are contained in the brain. The LIGHT (my caps) is projected on the brain. The impressions in the brain become manifest as the body and the world. Because the ego identifies itself with limitations, the body is considered separate and the world separate."

I've practiced conscious sleep for years with the understanding that "Man is made in the image of God" and "As above so below". When one watches dream formation from start to finish, one can see how the light (of the dreamer in this case) projects on the brain of the dream-objects and how the impressions in the brain of the dream-object project the dream-body and the entire dream-world. It was Ramana's words, as noted above, that moved me to explore in this direction.

When one can still the mind ("Be still and know ... that ... I AM ... God"), one can sense alluring vibrations that are more subtle than thoughts. These vibrations, as many sages will affirm, pull one from the crown chakra (sahasrara) towards the LIGHT of the Source. The sounds are as alluring as the sounds of the sirens luring sailors to the distant shore in the Homeric epic, the Odyssey. This would be an very interesting subject for further discussion. (Edgar Cayce, the American Christian mystic who was reportedly able to read the Akashic Records of the Cosmic mind, talks about a dot --- possibly the OM point in Hindu terminology --- which he becomes as he travels towards the LIGHT drawing him to the Source. The "dot" --- bindu --- in OM is generally considered to be the seed from which the universe springs into existence.)

[Miss Hepburn]

Surrender unreservedly. One of two things must be done. Either surrender
because you admit your inability and also require a Higher Power to help you;
or investigate into the cause of misery, go into the source.....
AAANNDD,
here I lost the page! Hahahaha, but I'll leave it...:biggrin:

[Still_Waters]

Surrender unreservedly. One of two things must be done. Either surrender
because you admit your inability and also require a Higher Power to help you;
or investigate into the cause of misery, go into the source.....
AAANNDD,
here I lost the page! Hahahaha, but I'll leave it...:biggrin:

Surrender is definitely the way and it is the natural outcome of investigating into the cause of misery and going into the Source.

One eventually realizes that the limited ego can only take us so far and that the limited separatist perspective doesn't always come up with the best course of action (or inaction). By surrendering to the higher power, one soars like an eagle into the spiritual sky of consciousness and intuitively knows what's best to do. Surrendering is not necessarily due to admitting inabilities and a need for help (though that is part of it); it can also be due to realizing that surrendering ALWAYS works while one's limited separatist perspective often leads to hit-or-miss decisions that are not always in the best interests of all. :smile:

[Chanine]

Surrender is definitely the way and it is the natural outcome of investigating into the cause of misery and going into the Source.

One eventually realizes that the limited ego can only take us so far and that the limited separatist perspective doesn't always come up with the best course of action (or inaction). By surrendering to the higher power, one soars like an eagle into the spiritual sky of consciousness and intuitively knows what's best to do. Surrendering is not necessarily due to admitting inabilities and a need for help (though that is part of it); it can also be due to realizing that surrendering ALWAYS works while one's limited separatist perspective often leads to hit-or-miss decisions that are not always in the best interests of all. :smile:

For the old thought of me it was an inability to cope that caused the start of surrender....I knew the self but I refused to be it until I had to give up

[Still_Waters]

For the old thought of me it was an inability to cope that caused the start of surrender....I knew the self but I refused to be it until I had to give up

For me, a Phi Beta Kappa who relied strongly on intellect, the start of surrender came with the realization that my own limited separatist-ego perspective was hit-and-miss while surrender was an unerring guide (via direct experiences) to the course of action (or inaction) that is in the best interests of all.

It did not come easily, but started with faith ... (absolutely necessary to get started) ... which led to confidence (as positive results were undeniable) ... which led to trust ... which ultimately led to SURRENDER.

[Miss Hepburn]

Q: How is it that Self-knowledge is said to be the easiest?


RM: Any other vidya (knowledge) requires a knower, knowledge, and an object to be known,
whereas this does not require any of them.
It is the Self.
Can anyone be as obvious as that?
Hence, it is the easiest.
All that you need do is inquire, "Who am I?"
A man's true name is mukti. (liberation)

[Still_Waters]

Q: How is it that Self-knowledge is said to be the easiest?


RM: Any other vidya (knowledge) requires a knower, knowledge, and an object to be known,
whereas this does not require any of them.
It is the Self.
Can anyone be as obvious as that?
Hence, it is the easiest.
All that you need do is inquire, "Who am I?"
A man's true name is mukti. (liberation)

If I recall correctly, Ramana made other comments about the various practices and, although, he did place self-inquiry (jnana) at the top of the list, he also indicated that the practice might not be suitable for all.

For others, he recommended bhakti.

For still others, he recommended karma yoga (service).

For those who were not drawn to any of the above, he recommended that the practitioner focus on the breath since that constituted a "Natural Sedative". :smile:

[iamthat]

When one can still the mind ("Be still and know ... that ... I AM ... God"), one can sense alluring vibrations that are more subtle than thoughts. These vibrations, as many sages will affirm, pull one from the crown chakra (sahasrara) towards the LIGHT of the Source. The sounds are as alluring as the sounds of the sirens luring sailors to the distant shore in the Homeric epic, the Odyssey. This would be an very interesting subject for further discussion. (Edgar Cayce, the American Christian mystic who was reportedly able to read the Akashic Records of the Cosmic mind, talks about a dot --- possibly the OM point in Hindu terminology --- which he becomes as he travels towards the LIGHT drawing him to the Source. The "dot" --- bindu --- in OM is generally considered to be the seed from which the universe springs into existence.)

The practice of Shabd Yoga has two components, meditation on the Sound and meditation on the Light.

Meditation on the Sound involves tuning in to the Sound Current which is continuous and unchanging. On going deeper, it is felt as vibration drawing one inwards.

Meditation on the Light begins with an inner eye of brilliant Light at the brow chakra, and at the centre of this Light there is a dark point. This dark centre has been described as the beginning of the spiritual path. The meditator concentrates on this dark centre which then reveals its own shining luminosity.

Becoming immersed in the Light and the Sound we lose our sense of the separate self.

Peace.

[Still_Waters]

The practice of Shabd Yoga has two components, meditation on the Sound and meditation on the Light.

Meditation on the Sound involves tuning in to the Sound Current which is continuous and unchanging. On going deeper, it is felt as vibration drawing one inwards.

Meditation on the Light begins with an inner eye of brilliant Light at the brow chakra, and at the centre of this Light there is a dark point. This dark centre has been described as the beginning of the spiritual path. The meditator concentrates on this dark centre which then reveals its own shining luminosity.

Becoming immersed in the Light and the Sound we lose our sense of the separate self.

Peace.

Thank you for sharing that. With me personally, without knowing about Shabd Yoga, I found myself drawn to the subtle sound vibrations at the crown (sahasrara chakra) "drawing one inward", as you indicated. Becoming immersed in that sound, "we lose our sense of the separate self", as you also indicated. (I used to meditate on the ajna chakra at the brow, but that has now been superceded by the natural pull of the crown chakra.)

Thanks again for sharing that.

Peace.

P.S. The Light aspect of Shabd Yoga seems to correspond to the Edgar Cayce experience. Does Shabd Yoga indicate that one or the other are sufficient ?

[Chanine]

Witness is applicable when there is an object to be seen. Then it is duality

Ramana Marharshi

[Still_Waters]

Witness is applicable when there is an object to be seen. Then it is duality

Ramana Marharshi

That is an excellent Ramana Maharshi quote. While witnessing is most assuredly an intermediate step, as Ramana clearly states, not very many people understand that. Witnessing is indeed still duality.

Great post !

[Miss Hepburn]

The practice of Shabd Yoga has two components, meditation on the Sound and meditation on the Light.
Meditation on the Sound involves tuning in to the Sound Current which is continuous and unchanging.
On going deeper, it is felt as vibration drawing one inwards.
Meditation on the Light begins with an inner eye of brilliant Light at the brow chakra, and at the centre of this Light there is a dark point.
This dark centre has been described as the beginning of the spiritual path. The meditator concentrates on this dark centre which
then reveals its own shining luminosity.
Becoming immersed in the Light and the Sound we lose our sense of the separate self.
Peace.I couldn't have said it better...meditators get what we are saying. :thumbsup:

[iamthat]

P.S. The Light aspect of Shabd Yoga seems to correspond to the Edgar Cayce experience. Does Shabd Yoga indicate that one or the other are sufficient ?

Shabd Yoga usually incorporates both Light and Sound and there are different techniques for each. Some people find that meditation on the Sound is easier, while others find the Light easier.

There is another technique which enables meditation on both simultaneously but I find doing them separately is more effective. I know some people who hear Sound while doing the Light techniques or see Light while doing the Sound technique, but alas, my concentration is usually insufficient to get deep enough to enjoy both at the same time.

Peace.

[Still_Waters]

Shabd Yoga usually incorporates both Light and Sound and there are different techniques for each. Some people find that meditation on the Sound is easier, while others find the Light easier.

There is another technique which enables meditation on both simultaneously but I find doing them separately is more effective. I know some people who hear Sound while doing the Light techniques or see Light while doing the Sound technique, but alas, my concentration is usually insufficient to get deep enough to enjoy both at the same time.

Peace.

In the case of Edgar Casey, he only experienced the Light according to his readings. I only experience the sound, the subtler vibrations of which one becomes aware once the grosser sound vibrations of thoughts are stilled.

Since I was unaware of the Shabd techniques, this happened quite naturally and I find myself drawn to the Source of the subtler vibrations/sounds (the "Word" becoming flesh) with the intuitive understanding that this will facilitate a re-connection with the Source. (Many years ago, I had experiences of colors and light, but that was not as compelling.) For me, this is not a question of choosing the "easier" technique; it is simply a matter of following one's pure intuition on how best to re-connect with the Source. My sense is that either approach is sufficient depending on the temperament of the meditator.

In any case, thanks for your informed responses. It's encouraging to know that Shabd Yoga points to an approach that I came upon quite naturally and spontaneously.

P.S. I just read an article on Shabd Yoga and it seems to utilize a mantra such as "OM" (or others). (That is an approach to which I gravitated quite naturally for other reasons and NOT as a technique to experience the sound Shabd. The "sound" just happened, and I now have some understanding regarding why it is happening and continues to happen. My sense is that the sound is not an end in itself but rather a means to proceeding to the next step.) After having written the above, I noticed that the article talks about "colors and light" at the ajna chakra just as I had experienced many years ago. (My teacher always said not to get obsessed with visions, colors and lights as they can become a distraction and eventually hold one back or develop a sense of pride and accomplishment, which obviously can create issues.) The subtle sound vibrations, however, have become far more compelling over the last few years.

If I may ask, what has been your direct experience, as opposed to repeating the Shabd Yoga theory? When something resonates, my approach is to validate though, in this particular case, the validation is coming after the fact since I've had the experience and am only now learning about the theory. My teacher NEVER developed expectations of results as that can easily become a self-fulfilling prophecy (as the expression goes). If one concentrates on seeing colors and light, my sense is that one will eventually conjure up a visionary experience of colors and light as the mind can play some insidious tricks on one who meditates and give one a false sense of progress.

https://www.stylecraze.com/articles/simple-meditation-techniques-for-surat-shabd-yoga/#gref

[Still_Waters]

I couldn't have said it better...meditators get what we are saying. :thumbsup:

As you duly noted, meditators do indeed get a sense of what is being said about the "sound and light" Shabd meditative technique being discussed here. However, now, let's go a step deeper to where this all leads. :thumbsup:

:smile:

[Miss Hepburn]

'Q:... Tulsidas and others are said to have seen Maha Vishnu. How did they see Him?
RM: In what manner? Just in the same manner as you see me now and I see you here.
They would also have seen Vishnu in this way only.


.......
Still Waters, Where does all this lead ? Shabd meditation...short answer: Bliss. :icon_cool:
Longer answer: As a consequence, wisdom and insights galore, peace and confidence extraordinaire, power and patience humbly...basically seeing God within all.
A supernatural transformation that can only happen when one
experiences Divine Love....
and that It is permeating all ...every rock, every vacuumous space light years away....the infinite and the infinitesimal.
PS This is our destiny....might as well get used to the idea....your ego is yesterday's news!! :tongue: Boring, humdrum...useless for our purposes.

[Unseeking Seeker]

[QUOTE=Miss Hepburn]'Q:... Tulsidas and others are said to have seen Maha Vishnu. How did they see Him?
RM: In what manner? Just in the same manner as you see me now and I see you here.
They would also have seen Vishnu in this way only.


***

Wow!
Deeper the truth
The simpler it is
If elucidated
By a seer!

***

[Still_Waters]

'Q:... Tulsidas and others are said to have seen Maha Vishnu. How did they see Him?
RM: In what manner? Just in the same manner as you see me now and I see you here.
They would also have seen Vishnu in this way only.


.......
Still Waters, Where does all this lead ? Shabd meditation...short answer: Bliss. :icon_cool:
Longer answer: As a consequence, wisdom and insights galore, peace and confidence extraordinaire, power and patience humbly...basically seeing God within all.
A supernatural transformation that can only happen when one
experiences Divine Love....
and that It is permeating all ...every rock, every vacuumous space light years away....the infinite and the infinitesimal.
PS This is our destiny....might as well get used to the idea....your ego is yesterday's news!! :tongue: Boring, humdrum...useless for our purposes.


It's interesting that you should choose that quote from Ramana Maharshi and I agree with it completely. When I was at the Khumba Mela in Haridwar, India, in 1998, there was a being who appeared out of nowhere to my friend and myself in an open field with no one else in sight. Without being asked, he answered my pressing question in six simple words that were completely satisfying. Just as mysteriously, he vanished immediately thereafter. Who was he? Maha Vishnu? Shiva ? Who knows? In any case, the two of us rushed back to the ashram where my spiritual mentor was sitting with various sages. As we recounted the story and described the extraordinary being, they just looked at us in knowing silence. Finally, my spiritual mentor spoke and identified the being as "Sri <don't recall his name>". Knowing the being whom we had just described (since he had been at a bandara/feast the previous day on which occasion the entire spiritual hierarchy had bowed to him and had touched his feet), she added that "he does this from time to time; everyone knows that". She reminded us that this was an auspicious happening upon which we should meditate throughout the day IN SILENCE.

Hence, Ramana Maharshi's response to that question resonates well with me. This being appeared like everyone else and yet, as one can surmise, he was quite different. (It should be noted that this experience has happened more than once in my lifetime, but this particular experience was chosen because others were involved and this was not a personal hallucination which had come to mind initially.) There is more to the story but that should suffice.

As for your response to my question, your longer answer was intriguing though the "bliss" response in the shorter answer didn't do much for me since that word ("bliss") is so often over-used that has become virtually meaningless at least for me.

Since you mentioned in your longer answer that you see God in all (with which I agree completely), what is the process whereby you shift attention from the universal (for lack of a better word) to the personal/actor role? As sages have often said, pointedly stating and acting like God is in all creates some obvious difficulties in functioning in the so-called "normal" society. :smile:

In keeping with this question, I will cite one of my favorite Zen quotes: "Equality without differentiation is poor equality; differentiation without equality is poor differentiation." :smile:

[Miss Hepburn]

Since you mentioned in your longer answer that you see God in all (with which I agree completely),
what is the process whereby you shift attention from the universal (for lack of a better word) to the personal/actor role?

As sages have often said, pointedly stating and acting like God is in all creates some
obvious difficulties in functioning in the so-called "normal" society. :smile:
Great story....oh my! Reminds me of Mary Baker's, if alive still, prob 90.
At 15 with a friend in a field going off to get in 'trouble' (Arkansas?)...a man appeared to both...changing their lives
forever...later she realized it was Jesus.

Comment: I am sorry the word bliss means little to you...I ignore how others use it flippantly...
would Spiritual-ecstasy-entwined-with-profound-knowledge work better? Ha! :wink:

You kinda ans'd your own question to me! Ha!:smile:
I deliberately 'shift my attention'...I stop, breathe, get centered and expand my awareness is all....to what?
To what 'Is'....to Reality! Ha!

What that means for my mind to lock onto with pleasure is the Truth of the situation....
the 'situation' being: here I am looking out of these eyes at things that are simply not real...
I am looking at things, people, pets that are not people, things or pets AT ALL!

God is the Cosmic-Shape Shifter....He makes things look like a wall....you think the wall there is a wall?
Oh my God, no...it's love...it is atoms vibrating at a certain speed and distance apart with a certain
amt of electrons to appear as a wall....being held together consciously to maintain that appearance...by a superior power, the Divine Mind...
Whose Presence is palpable.

All around you at this second you are being bombarded by thousands of waves...radio waves, UHF waves,
cosmic rays from outer space...they are going thru your roof and right thru your body passing into the ground.
Example: Get a receptor to pick up these 1000s of waves...a shortwave radio, an AM-FM radio, a TV....and turn the dials.

WE are the receptors for God's Divine Cosmic Infinite Frequency within everything.
So tune to It...To His Divine Presence daily.

It will become so easy like practicing looking at a 3D picture and suddenly
your vision
changes and you see the elephant that was 'always' right there.


Does that help? :) Such a pleasure to have a kindred spirit to chat with!

[iamthat]

P.S. I just read an article on Shabd Yoga and it seems to utilize a mantra such as "OM" (or others). (That is an approach to which I gravitated quite naturally for other reasons and NOT as a technique to experience the sound Shabd. The "sound" just happened, and I now have some understanding regarding why it is happening and continues to happen. My sense is that the sound is not an end in itself but rather a means to proceeding to the next step.) After having written the above, I noticed that the article talks about "colors and light" at the ajna chakra just as I had experienced many years ago. (My teacher always said not to get obsessed with visions, colors and lights as they can become a distraction and eventually hold one back or develop a sense of pride and accomplishment, which obviously can create issues.) The subtle sound vibrations, however, have become far more compelling over the last few years.

Many spiritual writings emphasise repeating the Name of God through japa, so people repeat Ram or OM or whatever their preference is. I would suggest that the true repetition of the Name of God is meditation on Divine Sound. Some people talk about Shabd Yoga and give a mantra, saying that if you repeat the mantra then eventually you might hear the Sound. My own experience was that I was initiated into Light and Sound through shaktipat.

Guru Nanak was one teacher who taught the importance of the Name of God. One website gives the following:

Naam, Shabad, or Word, is the quintessence of Sikh spirituality and is mentioned 2546 times in the Sikh Holy Scripture, the Guru Granth Sahib, literally meaning the Name of Gods or God. But what exactly is Naam and why is it so important?

Naam is the great creative and controlling power of God. Naam has no beginning and no end. It is unchanging, ancient and eternal and it is the life current which pervades the entire creation.

Naam is characterised by sweet strains and melodious tunes and powerful light which can be seen and witnessed. This sound current is active in the whole of creation. This is one of the ways humans experience this phenomenon within themselves.

Our mind is always in a state of oscillation and all the time our mental faculties are always flowing outward into the world. Never for a moment have they known any rest. Until we internalise our focus and allow the mind to become purified and stilled, one cannot listen to the reverberations of the sound current.

Naam, the primal sound current is in fact only one continuous vibration. However as it steps down through 5 different planes of existence, with their varying degrees of density, the frequency of Naam changes and this creates the ‘Panj Shabad’, the five distinct melodies, which are contained within the mantra Sat Naam.

Guru Nanak Dev Ji, the first Sikh Master, enumerates the many advantages that accrue from the hearing and acceptance of Naam by saying:

“By communion with Naam, one can attain the status of a super human being with spiritual powers, a god and a yoga master. By communion with Naam, the earthly regions, the heavens and the nether regions stand revealed. By communion with Naam one becomes immortal. Says Nanak, God’s devotees live in perpetual ecstasy for the Naam washes away all sin and sorrow.”

If I may ask, what has been your direct experience, as opposed to repeating the Shabd Yoga theory? When something resonates, my approach is to validate though, in this particular case, the validation is coming after the fact since I've had the experience and am only now learning about the theory. My teacher NEVER developed expectations of results as that can easily become a self-fulfilling prophecy (as the expression goes). If one concentrates on seeing colors and light, my sense is that one will eventually conjure up a visionary experience of colors and light as the mind can play some insidious tricks on one who meditates and give one a false sense of progress.

As I said, I was initiated into Light and Sound through shaktipat nearly 40 years ago. I was also taught the meditation techniques. This has been my main practice ever since.

My direct experience was that I heard Sound and saw Light. At my initiation it was very strong. Doing it on my own afterwards it was much fainter. I struggled with meditation throughout the first year, but I persisted. Then it became much stronger, and the Sound would fill my head and sometimes descend into the body. The Light would become brilliant and the dark centre you mentioned earlier would become very clearly defined. In longer meditates it becomes very powerful.

Obviously this is a practice which suits me - perhaps it may not resonate with others.

Peace.

[Miss Hepburn]

Still Waters ...and iamthat would prob agree...sit in perfect stillness...
place earplugs in your ears...(The best are the 'gummy', play-doe kind...not the sponge kind)
You'll hear Celestial Music or Harmony or Sound alright.

Buy the book 'Naam or Word', Kirpal Singh...it will be of great benefit to someone like you...I think
the quotes above may have come from that book.
Now, we better get back to Ramana!! :smile:

[Chanine]

Power implies movement. Though God moves by his own power, which is movement, he transcends the movement. He is motionless, transcendent

Bhagavans reply to a question about movement

[Still_Waters]

Great story....oh my! Reminds me of Mary Baker's, if alive still, prob 90.
At 15 with a friend in a field going off to get in 'trouble' (Arkansas?)...a man appeared to both...changing their lives
forever...later she realized it was Jesus.

Comment: I am sorry the word bliss means little to you...I ignore how others use it flippantly...
would Spiritual-ecstasy-entwined-with-profound-knowledge work better? Ha! :wink:

You kinda ans'd your own question to me! Ha!:smile:
I deliberately 'shift my attention'...I stop, breathe, get centered and expand my awareness is all....to what?
To what 'Is'....to Reality! Ha!

What that means for my mind to lock onto with pleasure is the Truth of the situation....
the 'situation' being: here I am looking out of these eyes at things that are simply not real...
I am looking at things, people, pets that are not people, things or pets AT ALL!

God is the Cosmic-Shape Shifter....He makes things look like a wall....you think the wall there is a wall?
Oh my God, no...it's love...it is atoms vibrating at a certain speed and distance apart with a certain
amt of electrons to appear as a wall....being held together consciously to maintain that appearance...by a superior power, the Divine Mind...
Whose Presence is palpable.

All around you at this second you are being bombarded by thousands of waves...radio waves, UHF waves,
cosmic rays from outer space...they are going thru your roof and right thru your body passing into the ground.
Example: Get a receptor to pick up these 1000s of waves...a shortwave radio, an AM-FM radio, a TV....and turn the dials.

WE are the receptors for God's Divine Cosmic Infinite Frequency within everything.
So tune to It...To His Divine Presence daily.

It will become so easy like practicing looking at a 3D picture and suddenly
your vision
changes and you see the elephant that was 'always' right there.


Does that help? :) Such a pleasure to have a kindred spirit to chat with!


Excellent response ! Somehow, I thought that you would say something like that, "kindred spirit". Our techniques may vary slightly, but I understand what you are doing. It is indeed difficult to put such things in words, isn't it?

On another note, I do prefer "Spiritual-ecstasy-entwined-with-profound-knowledge work better" to the overused word "bliss" but it's obviously a bit awkward to say all that so, in the future, "Bliss" in your case is perfectly all right since I know how you are using the word. (Many people associate "bliss" with the stoned out hippies of the 60s.)

As for the Mary Baker story, such appearances are not as uncommon as people think. Thanks for sharing.

[Still_Waters]

Still Waters ...and iamthat would prob agree...sit in perfect stillness...
place earplugs in your ears...(The best are the 'gummy', play-doe kind...not the sponge kind)
You'll hear Celestial Music or Harmony or Sound alright.

Buy the book 'Naam or Word', Kirpal Singh...it will be of great benefit to someone like you...I think
the quotes above may have come from that book.
Now, we better get back to Ramana!! :smile:

I have read some of Kirpal Singh's works but not that particular one. In addition, I sometimes go to the Sikh Temple in Queens (NYC). Not only are the atmosphere and people uplifting, but there is indeed a "free lunch" (langar) there ..... though I do make a voluntary appropriate donation to support that function.

I sometimes play the Sikh chant, "Sat Naam", but it is not my primary mantra/chant. Nonetheless, it is quite appealing.

Now .... back to Ramana. :smile:

[Still_Waters]

Many spiritual writings emphasise repeating the Name of God through japa, so people repeat Ram or OM or whatever their preference is. I would suggest that the true repetition of the Name of God is meditation on Divine Sound. Some people talk about Shabd Yoga and give a mantra, saying that if you repeat the mantra then eventually you might hear the Sound. My own experience was that I was initiated into Light and Sound through shaktipat.

Guru Nanak was one teacher who taught the importance of the Name of God. One website gives the following:

Naam, Shabad, or Word, is the quintessence of Sikh spirituality and is mentioned 2546 times in the Sikh Holy Scripture, the Guru Granth Sahib, literally meaning the Name of Gods or God. But what exactly is Naam and why is it so important?

Naam is the great creative and controlling power of God. Naam has no beginning and no end. It is unchanging, ancient and eternal and it is the life current which pervades the entire creation.

Naam is characterised by sweet strains and melodious tunes and powerful light which can be seen and witnessed. This sound current is active in the whole of creation. This is one of the ways humans experience this phenomenon within themselves.

Our mind is always in a state of oscillation and all the time our mental faculties are always flowing outward into the world. Never for a moment have they known any rest. Until we internalise our focus and allow the mind to become purified and stilled, one cannot listen to the reverberations of the sound current.

Naam, the primal sound current is in fact only one continuous vibration. However as it steps down through 5 different planes of existence, with their varying degrees of density, the frequency of Naam changes and this creates the ‘Panj Shabad’, the five distinct melodies, which are contained within the mantra Sat Naam.

Guru Nanak Dev Ji, the first Sikh Master, enumerates the many advantages that accrue from the hearing and acceptance of Naam by saying:

“By communion with Naam, one can attain the status of a super human being with spiritual powers, a god and a yoga master. By communion with Naam, the earthly regions, the heavens and the nether regions stand revealed. By communion with Naam one becomes immortal. Says Nanak, God’s devotees live in perpetual ecstasy for the Naam washes away all sin and sorrow.”



As I said, I was initiated into Light and Sound through shaktipat nearly 40 years ago. I was also taught the meditation techniques. This has been my main practice ever since.

My direct experience was that I heard Sound and saw Light. At my initiation it was very strong. Doing it on my own afterwards it was much fainter. I struggled with meditation throughout the first year, but I persisted. Then it became much stronger, and the Sound would fill my head and sometimes descend into the body. The Light would become brilliant and the dark centre you mentioned earlier would become very clearly defined. In longer meditates it becomes very powerful.

Obviously this is a practice which suits me - perhaps it may not resonate with others.

Peace.


Thank you very much for your very informative post. As I mentioned to Miss Hepburn in another post, I do frequent the Sikh Temple in Queens (NYC) and often sit in the main hall where they are chanting "Sat Naam" or "Waheguru .." as well as other chants. I play some of those chants at home as well though they are not my primary chants. Nonetheless, I find them uplifting and I enjoy the time spent at the Sikh Temple. (I also enjoy the free meals --- langars --- at the Sikh Temple though I do make an appropriate voluntary donation.)

When I was in Hounslow, England (just outside of London) at our ashram there, I used to go with my teacher to the nearby Sikh Temple to just hang out and/or dine with the devotees there. We used to go there every day while I was at the ashram in England.

Thanks again for the very informative post. It's very clear. :thumbsup:

[Miss Hepburn]

“By communion with Naam, one can attain the status of a super human being with spiritual powers,
a god and a yoga master. By communion with Naam, the earthly regions, the heavens and the
nether regions stand revealed. By communion with Naam one becomes immortal. Says Nanak,
God’s devotees live in perpetual ecstasy for the Naam washes away all sin and sorrow.”

:smile:

[Miss Hepburn]

Q: Difficulties are encountered. How is one to get the necessary strength to
overcome the obstacles that beset one's path?

RM: By means of devotion and the company of sages.

[Chanine]

It is to know the truth that the "I" is not different from the lord and to be free from the feeling of being the doer

[Miss Hepburn]

It is to know the truth that the "I" is not different from the lord and to be free from the feeling of being the doerYes! Be free!!!:hug3:
"Be what you are.
That which is, is ever present. Even now you are It,
and not apart from It."
-RM
Thank you, RM. :smile:

[Miss Hepburn]

...the ego nor the mind really exists...

[Chanine]

That which is (declared to be) peace in the Heartward view is itself power in the outward view. To those who have enquired and known (the truth), the two are one and the same

Bhagavan 6

[Chanine]

The true heart, whose nature is indescribable, can be deemed to be an unmoving mirror in which all manifestations appears.

The heart, the birthplace of the ego, is the ground for the appearance, sustenance and subsidence of the entire moving and unmoving universe.

256, 257 guru vachaka kovia

[janielee]

Speculations about God and world avail nothing: Self-realization is the hearts cry of all.

Of what avail to debate whether the world is real or unreal, sentient or insentient, pleasant or unpleasant? Extinguishing the ego, transcending the world, realizing the Self — that is the state which is dear to all, and free from the sense of unity and duality.

[janielee]

Wanting to reform the world without discovering one's true self is like trying to cover the world with leather to avoid the pain of walking on stones and thorns. It is much simpler to wear shoes.


Eating, bathing, going to the toilet, talking, thinking, and many other activities related to the body are all work. How is it that the performance of one particular act is alone (considered) work? To be still is to be always engaged in work. To be silent is to be always talking.

[Miss Hepburn]

"Thoughts change, but not you.

-RM

[Unseeking Seeker]

"Thoughts change, but not you.

-RM

***

Good topic for a 100 page thread :smile:

***

[Miss Hepburn]

***
Good topic for a 100 page thread :smile:
***Yes, the posts would always change, but not you.:wink:

[Chanine]

"what is happening inside produces events outside"

Beautiful.....me thinks?

[Miss Hepburn]

Can there be darkness before the Sun?
Similarly, can there be ignorance before the Self-evident and Self-luminous Self?
If you know the Self, there will be no darkness, no ignorance, and no misery.


-RM, 1937

[Primrose]

Q: How can I tell if I am making progress with my enquiry?
A: The degree of the absence of thoughts is the measure of your
progress towards Self-realization. But Self-realization itself does not
admit of progress, it is ever the same. The Self remains always in
realization. The obstacles are thoughts. Progress is measured by the
degree of removal of the obstacles to understanding that the Self is
always realized. So thoughts must be checked by seeking to whom
they arise. So you go to their source, where they do not arise.

Be As You Are

[Miss Hepburn]

Q: How can I tell if I am making progress with my inquiry?
A: The degree of the absence of thoughts is the measure of your
progress towards Self-realization.
I didn't know he said that ! :hug3:

[Miss Hepburn]

"The only happiness there is, is of the Self."
"There is no happiness in worldly objects."