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Old 15-01-2018, 01:03 PM
Podshell Podshell is offline
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I have heard similar about surgeons, to an outsider the surgeon may appear to be horrible and brutal in removing parts of the body, but with a bit more investigation we know a good one is likely saving a life.
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Old 19-01-2018, 01:21 AM
Shivani Devi Shivani Devi is offline
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Originally Posted by peteyzen
Hi Xmode, yes of course. What is important is your connection to the divine, and Krishna is a fabulous way to connect. Everyone is different, some people see Jesus and their hearts melt, while the same person might look at shiva and be turned off. We are individuals and our relationship with God is an individual thing and God has seen fit to give us many ways to connect to him. So if your heart swells when you look at Krishna, then, you already have a relationship with him!
The various religions and sects have their role, but when you cut through everything it is your relationship with krishna not your teachers that matters and nobody needs to be in a group to worship him, simply talk to him yourself, say a mantra with his name in it, offer everything up to him, this simple relationship is the strongest anyway. Just love him.

Originally Posted by ajay00
Religions and religious sects are conceptual frameworks that enable one to attain a nonconceptual state of being, without having to go through a parade of neverending conceptualisations in samsara.

Krishna, Shiva, Divine Mother all are different aspects of Saguna Brahman, and by adherence to the path, one can attain purification of consciousness.

Conflict in the name of religion or religious sects however promote discord and an impure consciousness due to the resultant mental agitation, which destroys mental equanimity.

As the Gita stated, " Equanimity of mind is yoga. "

And as Ashoka the Great stated, " Concord is virtue. "

Realising this, let us not create unnecessary discord while discussing over the various aspects of Saguna Brahman.
Not creating discord over Saguna Brahman because I understand all that - creating 'discord' over gurus (humans) and not 'Gods' - different story entirely imho. However, I am done with doing that, because I know what I know, which relates in no way and is totally irrelevant to what anybody else knows. True spirituality is a very lonely business...

Aum Namah Shivaya
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Old 28-01-2018, 07:44 AM
Joe Mc Joe Mc is offline
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Originally Posted by xmode
I want to ask, can you be a Krishna's devotee without joining in a community or cult organisation ?

The following and devotion to Krishna was here long before iskcon.How can a person or a movement claim to be the only real or true followers of God ? That claim alone should be enough to know that those who make such claims are in a partial truth but are like all fundamentalists not dealing with the complexity of the life as it manifests here on earth. I say partial because there are aspects of such movements which are very attractive, their worship, devotion and food. but realistically the black and white presentation of truth, in other words, I'm right and your wrong is easy at first on your head and thinking but in the end creates alot of problems for the seeker.

When I first encountered iskcon they were very adamant and still are id say about things like Buddhism. They would say, Oh the Mayavadis, they are like the rays of the sun but the personalists like us worship the Sun itself, which is Krishna. We can see they are blind. These kind of reasonings they revelled in up until the point that they would even defend their own points of view through rudeness perhaps even violence I know some devotees here who follow other teachers besides Prabupada and seem very mellow. If i had met with those options when i first encountered krishna consciousness i might still be a devotee but alas i ran into the 'stock version' yous are all karmis, yous are all going to hell etc.

So the short answer is yes, I dont think you need permission from say Prabupad to follow God. At least i hope not.


To Thine own Self be True

The Frost performs its secret ministry,Unhelped by any wind. Samuel Taylor Coleridge

And you won't find that Love comes easy but that Love is always right.

All Intellect falls prey to Love's Glory ! Rumi

He Made the Lock, He also Made the Key ! Rumi
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Old 04-03-2018, 04:33 PM
peteyzen peteyzen is offline
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Hi Joe,
Yes I have come across some at iskcon like that. Quite simply, as with other religions, this mentality is one of the stages the human ego goes through during its journey. I call it ego shape shifting into our spirituality. It's not just iskcon to be fair, it's a stage in all practices and religions. The problem is, nobody can measure spiritual growth, or soul growth, so people can get a lot of knowledge, mantra all day and genuinely love the divine and get given high places in whatever spiritual framework they are active in. This doesn't mean they have overcome the ego.
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Old 11-03-2018, 02:17 PM
Podshell Podshell is offline
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You don't need permission from Prabhupada to follow God and he confirms this himself, many times. Just two eamples here in which he points out other Bona Fide messengers/avatars etc.

On Christ,


" Prabhupada: We accept him as avatara, saktyavesa-avatara, empowered incarnation of God. That we accept."

And Buddha,


God became very much compassionate. When people were too much addicted in killing animals unnecessarily, He appeared as Lord Buddha.
Lecture on SB 6.1.40 -- Surat, December 22, 1970:

God became very much compassionate. When people were too much addicted in killing animals unnecessarily, He appeared as Lord Buddha. Sadaya-hṛdaya darśita-paśu-ghātam. Paśu-ghātam. The paśu-ghātam means they were being implicated in innumerable sinful activities by this process. Therefore God wanted to... Yadā yadā hi dharmasya glānir bhavati (BG 4.7). In the name of religion, they were killing so many animals. Therefore to stop this nonsense, he appeared. And he declined to accept the Vedic principles because there was no other way to stop. If he would have accepted Vedic principles, then these animal-killers would have shown him evidences that in the Vedas there is mention of animal-killing in the sacrifice. But he wanted to stop completely animal-killing; so therefore he adopted a new type of religion. But those who were followers of Vedic religion, they did not accept because that is not religion because it is against the Vedas. These are the principles.
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Old 13-03-2018, 02:00 PM
peteyzen peteyzen is offline
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That is one definition of Buddha`s life, however I do not believe Buddha was an Avatar, his very life story is one of spiritual growth, development from the human condition to realisation. Buddha is an example of the path we will all need to take to reach realisation. In this my beliefs differ to most hindus who believe he is an Avatar of Vishnu. I also believe that the Kalki Avatar is here now on the Earth, again, this point of view is different to the mainstream, and I get swathes of vedic calculations thrown at me when I mention it. Never the less, I remain happy with my perception of things. Truth is these points of argument are unimportant, what is important is a steady personal growth, of spiritual practice,self discipline, love and joy through correct action. This process is `lumpy` not smooth, this path is knobled, it goes up and down and is always changing. Through this process, as the masons say `the rough excrescences are smoothed`. We all need to spend less time on the field arguing and more time in the shrine room and with our families, loving.
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