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Go Back   Spiritual Forums > Spirituality & Beliefs > Non Duality

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  #21  
Old 17-12-2017, 12:32 AM
Gem Gem is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iamit
Yes it can be ironic. Try it on yourself, you might be surprised:) But it sounds like you think you are clear of distortion. Now that would be ironic.

:)

I have no interest in making personal assertions that are anything less than complimentary. With me its all on a feel level, and hence I know this thread was impelled to be 'challenge free'. I understand things on that level, the level of intent. That's why I don't always reply to the words that are said, but rather, to what is actually being communicated.
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  #22  
Old 17-12-2017, 02:52 AM
sentient sentient is offline
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So you are Irish, eh, Joe Mc

Perhaps there is a little bit of Irish in all of us.
I have got 2-3 Scottish Ancestors, who’s paternal lines originally came from Ireland.
To tune into their ancestry – this is the song that gave me the chills of their “Soul Group”:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=exjUiHlAhJg

Now whether some of my cousins (descendants of Cianachta, "the race of Cian") were related to Tuatha De Danann I do not know, but perhaps they had lived somewhere around there

*
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  #23  
Old 17-12-2017, 04:37 AM
Iamit Iamit is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by naturesflow
The dream is all encompassing yes?

According to the concept "All is One" the manifestation/dream of difference, where there is no difference whatsoever, is all there is. A fiction, nothing beyond it, no beyond at all. And yet within that play there arises the idea that Oneness is the only reality

Its like being in a play in which all the characters are played by One Actor, which also manifests as the stage, the props, and the set. In that play there is the plot/story that asserts non duality as the only reality, but that story arises only in the play.
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  #24  
Old 17-12-2017, 05:32 AM
naturesflow naturesflow is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iamit
According to the concept "All is One" the manifestation/dream of difference, where there is no difference whatsoever, is all there is. A fiction, nothing beyond it, no beyond at all. And yet within that play there arises the idea that Oneness is the only reality

Its like being in a play in which all the characters are played by One Actor, which also manifests as the stage, the props, and the set. In that play there is the plot/story that asserts non duality as the only reality, but that story arises only in the play.

Which is why I mentioned all encompassing. The dream within dream within dreams, within dreams...

Once you let go of the play in any shape or form, there is only life creating itself as part of the interconnectedness. So which dream your in, often determines your reality in the whole unfolding of understanding "life is but a dream"
If your aware your just dreaming yourself into being, then being yourself and dreaming can become a more conscious practice and movement aware you are.
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  #25  
Old 17-12-2017, 09:29 AM
Iamit Iamit is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by naturesflow
Which is why I mentioned all encompassing. The dream within dream within dreams, within dreams...

Once you let go of the play in any shape or form, there is only life creating itself as part of the interconnectedness. So which dream your in, often determines your reality in the whole unfolding of understanding "life is but a dream"
If your aware your just dreaming yourself into being, then being yourself and dreaming can become a more conscious practice and movement aware you are.

Understood. But that objective is not for everyone. For some the end of feeling disconnected is more than enough and that can happen following a resonance with the concept All is One by the mind, depending on the frequency match between the mind and the concept. For that to happen there does not have to be any practise, conscious or otherwise.

Its often referred to as the direct approach. See the reference to Nisargadatta in the initial post in the thread "Neo Advaita and the character".
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  #26  
Old 17-12-2017, 10:01 AM
naturesflow naturesflow is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iamit
Understood. But that objective is not for everyone. For some the end of feeling disconnected is more than enough and that can happen following a resonance with the concept All is One by the mind, depending on the frequency match between the mind and the concept. For that to happen there does not have to be any practise, conscious or otherwise.

Its often referred to as the direct approach. See the reference to Nisargadatta in the initial post in the thread "Neo Advaita and the character".

True I agree. The end of feeling disconnected through the mind can be enough to change the whole self into natural progression of that shift. It moves itself naturally into change.

I am more speaking from the being state of oneness where you are more conscious of yourself in the totality of your being where every part of you is integrated into that being. In this way the self knows it is the one leading itself open and connected more holistically.

In your bringing up of direct approach through the mind shift, it still requires as the initiation to bring the whole being into alignment.
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“God’s one and only voice are Silence.” ~ Herman Melville

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  #27  
Old 17-12-2017, 02:21 PM
Iamit Iamit is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by naturesflow
True I agree. The end of feeling disconnected through the mind can be enough to change the whole self into natural progression of that shift. It moves itself naturally into change.

I am more speaking from the being state of oneness where you are more conscious of yourself in the totality of your being where every part of you is integrated into that being. In this way the self knows it is the one leading itself open and connected more holistically.

In your bringing up of direct approach through the mind shift, it still requires as the initiation to bring the whole being into alignment.

From the perpective of Oneness as the only reality, it is impossible not to be integrated in the way you suggest because that integration (total connection to Oneness) is not dependant on the state you are in. Oneness is all states. This of course includes the state of not realizing any of this, because it is already Oneness not realizing! Even the feeling of non integration/disconnection is not disconnected for the same reason.

Yes for the resonance between mind and the concept, it seems as though there has to be some frequency/vibration matching going on. As is often suggested in NA (and by N in the example given)ripeness for the resonance may have to do with a state of despair that nothing is working for the seeker. N does not say that to everyone and promotes practise in most cases, I guess because most are not in despair. So I guess he recognises which response is relevant depending on where he perceives the character of the seeker to be at. So as I often say here one size does not fit all, and it depends on the character.

Where are you at with all this?
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  #28  
Old 17-12-2017, 05:12 PM
Joe Mc Joe Mc is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sentient
So you are Irish, eh, Joe Mc

Perhaps there is a little bit of Irish in all of us.
I have got 2-3 Scottish Ancestors, who’s paternal lines originally came from Ireland.
To tune into their ancestry – this is the song that gave me the chills of their “Soul Group”:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=exjUiHlAhJg

Now whether some of my cousins (descendants of Cianachta, "the race of Cian") were related to Tuatha De Danann I do not know, but perhaps they had lived somewhere around there

*

Yes indeed, I'm Irish alright and yes wouldn't surprise me if there was little bit of Paddy in everyone lol. The connection between the Scottish and Irish as you know in huge. Thanks for sharing that great song. I've been to Newgrange a few times and we had an all concert one Summer Solstice and walked up to the site all bleary eyed to meet the arrival of the sun. Yep there is most likely a connection Back in time for you and your clan, isn't it amazing. My surname in Gaelic means Bear...Joe Bear sounds quite good lol hahaha Are you from a native or shamanic background ? I'll have to post you a couple of tracks man !!! thanks.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mpkrr0-qut4

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-p6zx1lDVoU
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  #29  
Old 18-12-2017, 02:13 AM
sentient sentient is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Mc
Yes indeed, I'm Irish alright and yes wouldn't surprise me if there was little bit of Paddy in everyone lol. The connection between the Scottish and Irish as you know in huge. Thanks for sharing that great song. I've been to Newgrange a few times and we had an all concert one Summer Solstice and walked up to the site all bleary eyed to meet the arrival of the sun. Yep there is most likely a connection Back in time for you and your clan, isn't it amazing. My surname in Gaelic means Bear...Joe Bear sounds quite good lol hahaha Are you from a native or shamanic background ? I'll have to post you a couple of tracks man !!! thanks.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mpkrr0-qut4

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-p6zx1lDVoU

Thanks Joe Bear
My genetic makeup places me at Zalavruga near Belomorsk (not that I’ve been there, it is on the bucket list as is Newgrange).
You don’t have to read all this, but just to give you an idea of the old cultural heritage:
http://rockartbridge.com/en/stati_i_..._9000_2500_bc/

From my Western (Indo-European) side I wasn’t sorry though to learn the ancestors of my (very) minor Scottish side had originally come from Ireland as it was during the 17th century that the Scots were enlisted to the Swedish army and stayed.
One of them was a rebel though and escaped the army life to the backwoods of (now Russia) and became a patriarch of a huge family
This is in the memory of him:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p8KmzzYCyJk

*
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  #30  
Old 18-12-2017, 05:17 AM
naturesflow naturesflow is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iamit
From the perpective of Oneness as the only reality, it is impossible not to be integrated in the way you suggest because that integration (total connection to Oneness) is not dependant on the state you are in. Oneness is all states. This of course includes the state of not realizing any of this, because it is already Oneness not realizing! Even the feeling of non integration/disconnection is not disconnected for the same reason.

Well yes and no I say. I get what you saying and I know this now. But those who are lost and confused, with feelings of being disconnected tend to walk through a process that over time brings the realizations that they are not, and never were. The process and unfolding of yourself to come back to that awareness, for SOME, ( I know many and myself as one) Is that there is a very real sense of disconnection and so the seeking to discover yourself in this way doesn't just flick a switch on. It is a life process sometimes a very long one that becomes their experience to discover this as a greater awareness. If you had of told me this twenty years ago, my internal world wouldn't have even comprehended this as you are suggesting it is.

Experience is a good teacher. I view myself in all this as someone who has had to integrate the pieces into one piece in myself to actually be able to say. Oh yes I get it now, not because someone told me, but because I did the work on myself, to discover it for myself.


Quote:
Yes for the resonance between mind and the concept, it seems as though there has to be some frequency/vibration matching going on. As is often suggested in NA (and by N in the example given)ripeness for the resonance may have to do with a state of despair that nothing is working for the seeker. N does not say that to everyone and promotes practise in most cases, I guess because most are not in despair. So I guess he recognises which response is relevant depending on where he perceives the character of the seeker to be at. So as I often say here one size does not fit all, and it depends on the character.

Exactly one size doesn't fit all in the greater scheme of life and experiences, awareness and knowing. And that can be associated to the whole interconnectedness and oneness that many haven't a clue about. Many have to "EXperience" themselves in life to grow and understand themselves as they are. Some don't even consider oneness, just a life and their own and others experiences. There is much to consider as someone who may understand there is nothing to realize in relation to oneness and it just is.
It is really only about those seeking to go that deep to know, or as you suggest, they just know.

Quote:
Where are you at with all this?

What do you mean?
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Man has learned how to challenge both Nature and art to become the incitements to vice! His very cups he has delighted to engrave with libidinous subjects, and he takes pleasure in drinking from vessels of obscene form! Pliny the Elder
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