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  #1  
Old 29-09-2017, 06:12 PM
Amilius777 Amilius777 is offline
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Father-Son-Spirit / Mind, Body, Soul

I want people to get to know that the Trinity is a Truth. But it is not a literal truth.

The Trinity is the "theory of God" that Jesus experienced and practiced, and saw himself as an active participant in that activity.

We live in the 3RD dimension, thus consciousness manifests in three ways.

And humans have a soul, mind, and body. Even if they do not have a "physical" body when they die they still have a body of awareness, a whole or a separate Self from one another. That is why the heavenly plane is even realer than the physical and the physical is simply a shadow of that. The body is in it's truest form, the form of the soul and it can change at will.

We are eternally formless (soul) and form (body) with the mind which dictates and moves the two into action. I made up "my mind", which creates.

The ancient Israelities have a long history shrouded in myths, legends, and folklore. It is even discovered that 80 percent of the Bible is not history but written by creative geniuses who knew how to tell a spiritual parable or midrash, myth to educate and raise awareness in their tribes. But of course another part of the Bible is Law and order which can be see as a repressive patriarchal society.

The Jewish people didn't have concepts, dogmas, and doctrines. They kept only one belief "that Yahweh was the One True God". They didn't deny the existence of other deities until the time of Jesus. Yet the word "BELIEF", get this goes back to the word PRACTICE. Thus another mistranslation.

Greek thought did a lot of good for Christianity but it also harmed it, stripping it of it's native Judaism. Christianity is really a variant of Judaism that mixes ideas with Greek philopshy and Hellenism.

Jesus didn't believe, he practiced. And he as a follow of John practiced their religion. Jesus began to have his own "God experience" before he left John's Baptismal movement. Jesus was raised in a culture that expected a fiery end, a messiah who fought with the sword. Jesus came to understand something about his Religion which became lost over time. The idea that Practice or spirituality must be performed in materiality.

It is about bringing the Kingdom of Heaven into the earth. The ancient Israelites believed in their God in a very physical way, and saw his power demonstrated in magic, earth upheavals, miracles, etc. Whereas the Greeks, the Hellenized thought which was spreading in most of the world focused more on wisdom and ideology separating soul from body.

Jesus wasn't bringing something "new", he was restoring something Old and updating it with a new consciousness. He did not pray all day with his apostles. He prayed in his own time with God. Instead he did what? he BROKE- bread, and POURED - wine as his body and blood, his body and soul shared with them so that they could become one with the awareness that he had, the knowledge he possessed of God. And that knowledge and awareness coming from his own purity. He went around not asking for people to recite a creed, instead he healed people who were sick, he restored them in THIS world.

His words of "salvation", freed from the hellfire did not speak of the afterlife. Very rarely Christ spoke of the afterlife. He never used the phrase, "and when your body dies, and your soul goes before God". Instead he made references to heaven and hell as metaphors, states of consciousness either in this life or the next. The Jewish people did NOT separate the After-life from this Life. It was all one.

Back to the TRINITY. Jesus realized for himself, which is what made him the Christ, the anointed One that he represented the "Son". You can not come to "the Father" unless you go through "the Son". Meaning you must manifest God in your everyday, physical encounters with Others all the time. Jesus didn't have some esoteric knowledge, he realized it from his own Scripture. Israel was called as a whole "the son of God". Thus God must be experienced in your body, everyday life to truly come to God. We don't go to the Father until we pass over, but here and now we must manifest the Son.

God is an Entity that is beyond a singular identity. God manifests as Father (mind), Son (body), and Holy Spirit (soul). The entire body of Creation is the Son. "All things were made through this One". The body of Christ as Paul calls it and we are all members of it.

The Divine Energy flows and moves through all. The All that Is - a better definition for what we call God. The Father is the supreme Being -Creator Parent which is the (mind) of this Entity. The Son or Creation is the experienced, the encountering or manifested (the body) of this Entity, and the Holy Spirit is the force, activity, awareness behind all of this that allows a shared existence among everything (the spirit) of this Entity.

The High Priests who hated Jesus, and there was only a few saw him doing "foreign things". But it was Jesus who told THEM that they were practicing "added" and edited words to the Law. Jesus was saying how the purity codes, the washing of hands before you do x, y, and z was an example of bad religion. It was a way of creating elites over the common man. That is why Clergy means "the separated Ones". Clergy was meant to help people "reconnect" with God. That is why priests, priestess, and shamans of pagan cultures never lost this. They never stood above others. But there is a temptation to anyone who is a priest, a teacher, a rabbi, a Seer to use their ego over others. Religion means "to reconnect" and very few true priests walk the earth today to do this for us.

They hated Christ because Jesus had no shame and no guilt. They couldn't believe he paid no attention to the purity codes and laws. Instead he was bringing God back into the People, into their bodies, in their lives and healing them here and now.

And they saw Jesus making himself equal to God in these activities. But you must understand, it was the grace of God, the unmerited grace of the Father given to Jesus to make him perfect. He was made perfect for us, as a human being to show us, remind us of what had ALWAYS been but was forgotten. Jesus lived in the Divine Flow in balance and joy in his entire human life. On a soular level, at the depths of our soul we are perfect. We come from a Higher plane. But on earth, in these earthly egos we tend to engage ourselves with unwholesome and negative beliefs and attitudes which further separate ourselves from God, when God who is the Spirit-essence in us has never separated Himself from us.

That is why Jesus could make the Holy Spirit available to everyone because he knew this truth. He never said 'look at me! I healed you!" instead he said "your faith has healed you". The Spirit is already inside of you, because your very soul which is who you are is an extension of the Holy Spirit.

This angered them because their power would be taken away by empowering the average person with the Spirit of God within them. He was truly restoring the "Davidic kingdom", the old ways of the Prophets, not in an actual empire but in expressing God in the physical body, allowing that Presence to enliven and bring joy and love to people. An actual empire or kingdom would be a sin since the Israelities were never meant to have an actual kingdom like the Pagan nations. Such a thing always turns into Imperialism. Another reason Jesus didn't believe in fighting the Romans with the sword, but fighting them with his religion, his practice of all-inclusive love and mercy. A way to convert or transform the hearts of the Gentiles. This is why a Roman Centurion approached him and was evident of his teachings of nonviolence.

All these acts- blood letting, animal sacrifice, circumcision were earlier/poorer attempts at bringing the Spirit of God into the physical everyday world, uniting body and soul, matter and spirit as one (the Christ-anointed self).

If you have experienced this Theory of God that Jesus believed in and practiced let us know. The Saints knew it in their own lives, and many people do an just don't know it and call it something else.

Remember, Jesus didn't raise his "soul" from the dead. God raised Jesus' "body" from the dead; it is the physical world that needs to be transformed and liberated from the violence, negativity, and cruelty we have imposed upon it from our egos and selfishness. That is why an actual crucifixion happened to the Messiah.
This is why gurus and teachers of all types come and go. And we can read their books and study their wisdom which is all good and helpful to raise our awareness. but unless you have "the Son", unless you practice and imitate the way Jesus encountered and treated others, you will never truly come to "the Father", come to the Truth. you may just have to come back into the physical world with some harder tests to overcome :-/

Forgive and let go and let God. That creates the kingdom of heaven on Earth.

"Thy will be done, on EARTH, as it is in heaven". It's already in heaven, but is in on Earth for you and those you love?
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  #2  
Old 29-09-2017, 07:46 PM
Molearner Molearner is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Amilius777
I want people to get to know that the Trinity is a Truth. But it is not a literal truth.

The Trinity is the "theory of God" that Jesus experienced and practiced, and saw himself as an active participant in that activity.

?

Amilius777,

Nice......EXCEPT.....:) I take issue with your designation of mind, body, spirit. The original trichotomy referred to in scripture is body, soul and spirit. This trichotomy was abolished by the Catholic church in 869 A.D. by the 8th Ecumenical Council of Constantinople specifically in the 11th Canon. While this might seem irrelevant to many it has had important consequences for believers. I believe these 3 elements(body, soul, spirit) should be viewed as distinct.
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Old 30-09-2017, 05:29 PM
Ab Origine Ab Origine is offline
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Hi Folks..

Amilius; Hmm - if the Trinity is a truth (it is) - then how can it also be a "theory of god" that is NOT a LITERAL truth..??..lol..

All legitimate truth is "literal" by its very definition - a thing is either a literal truth or it is something else entirely - no thing can truly exist that is not a "literal truth" OF that existance lol obviously as it is the existence and the reality of it that defines "what is truth" - and just as obviously, no "truth" thus experienced, is a mere theory and no "theory" can ever be considered as a truth" lol - a truth is something tangeable substantial and repeatable - a theory - is just an educated guess and little more..lol.. HUGE huge difference Id say...

Quote:
We live in the 3RD dimension, thus consciousness manifests in three ways.

Ah but - isn't that actually FOUR dimensions..??...three SPATIAL measurements plus one TIME measurement = means Actually we exist as a four dimensional Being HERE (but this is actually just a small part of a much greater MULTI dimensional entitty that we have very limited access to)..

Quote:
And humans have a soul, mind, and body. Even if they do not have a "physical" body when they die they still have a body of awareness, a whole or a separate Self from one another.

No that doesn't work - the "body of awareness that is separate" is indeed your MIND - same mind you have now INSIDE your physical body...You try to say we are now a Trinity but upon mortal death - for sure, we will lose one part of that make upon entirely as we will no longer have a physical body at all - yet we will still exist as same core SELF unchanged I assure you..

Quote:
That is why the heavenly plane is even realer than the physical and the physical is simply a shadow of that.

Hmm - simply put - it seems "more real" simply because now free from mortal body - slow slow brain and its very limited mental capacity - so we start to use now the WHOLE MIND out of body, and thus we take in a whole lot more information, build a much more vivid reality from what is available...HERE in the body we simply IGNORE around 95% of all the energetic stimulus we receive - free from body though, and Conscious awareness is likewise freed to reclaim its full potential..

Quote:
The ancient Israelities have a long history shrouded in myths, legends, and folklore. It is even discovered that 80 percent of the Bible is not history but written by creative geniuses who knew how to tell a spiritual parable or midrash, myth to educate and raise awareness in their tribes. But of course another part of the Bible is Law and order which can be see as a repressive patriarchal society.

Really..??..Actually nearly all the Hebrew heritage comes DIRECTLY from Babylon - ancient Sumer and the ANNUNAKI who recorded ALL the Jewish narrative some 4000 years before any Jewish nation even existed..lol.. The entire foundation of the Torah can be traced directly back to those ancient babylonian "gods"..lol...its all a SHAM... If we really want the truth of any of this then the bible is NOT the place to look, as that is just a RETELLING of a much much EARLIER version of this so called "truth"..

I will remind us all - back then when all this started - these "gods" were actual flesh and blood PEOPLE that walked and talked interacted day to day with us - so they record for all to see.. By the time the Jews come along with the Torah, MANY "gods" had stated many nations and they were all pitted against each other for domination - one "god" the god of the jews won out over the rest and so we now have our twisted history and twisted "truth" given BY that "god" alone.. This is ALL ACTUAL HISTORY - real world events - not just fables and myths and allegory from a Jewish heritage, but recorded elsewhere THE ENTIRE WORLD OVER and always spoken of as a LITERAL and historical truth !!!

Quote:
Greek thought did a lot of good for Christianity but it also harmed it, stripping it of it's native Judaism. Christianity is really a variant of Judaism that mixes ideas with Greek philopshy and Hellenism.

Pretty irrelevant though - unless you make a clear distinction - RELIGIOUS christianity is NOT the same truth that CHRIST gave - and actually HIS truth is NOT even "a variant of Judaism" - totlall 100 % AGAINST that religion lol - He ACTUALLY SAID that "god" was an IMPOSTER and not the Father source of Creation that it had claimed - truth from Christ is what started ALL THE TROUBLE as He said to us all most clearly that we had been LIED DECIEVED and MANIPULATED by that "Jewish god" - because of this radical truth He gave freely they MURDERED HIM and the religion that bares His name used the same tactics to silence any and all who opposed them..

So - lets not forget the truth of the historical ORIGIN of this religion or its god - and lets not forget what they did to Christ and WHY they did it - keep the background context as we examine all that has been done and we soon start to make sense of it all..

Quote:
Jesus didn't believe, he practiced. And he as a follow of John practiced their religion. Jesus began to have his own "God experience" before he left John's Baptismal movement.

Ah but that's just plain incorrect on almost every level...First - Christ niether believed nor practiced - whatever that means..??.. He simply WAS DIVINE - didn't need to "believe it" as he was the LIVING TRUTH - didn't need to "practice" anything as He was the LIVING TRUTH..lol...He was just BEING - true to Himself..

Second, he did not "follow John" - where did you get that..?...even in the bible it clearly states that this John PREPARED THE WAY for CHRIST - not the other way around..lol..

Thirdly - if you LISTEN TO CHRIST - it soon becomes apparent that He was having a "god experience" EVEN BEFORE HE TOOK MORTAL FORM - I mean - that is what HE CLAIMED DIRECTLY - to be ACTUALLY PRESENT at the start of ALL CREATION as the WORD and an integral part OF THE TRINITY that starts it all off !!!

Yeshua was not a "man who became god" - no no no - totally off track there - He was the true Divine Source of Creation that BECAME MAN made flesh and blood - again, your view presented here is entirely back to front based on what HE HIMSELF says.. Iam the Light that is over all Creation - lift the stone - split the wood Iam there - all came forth FROM Me and all will again return TO Me He said - for those with ears tot hear.. NOT a man first - He was DIVINE and that is what caused all the problems here - the priests of this god Yhvh KNEW and recognised Christ truth so they murdered Him to protect their sham bogus "god" and so remained in power...Simple... Divine Source became man among us and taught us a truth that sets us free from spiritual slavery imposed BY the jewish god Yhvh - for this truth they kill Him and twist the rest to suit their own agenda - you cannot get truth of Christ or truth of the Divine from ANY religion - He already told us plainly they will deceive us ON PURPOSE !!

Quote:
Jesus wasn't bringing something "new", he was restoring something Old and updating it with a new consciousness

Again entirely inaccurate based on things HE HIMSELF SAYS DIRECTLY - His teaching was indeed NEW - UNHEARD OF - NEVER BEFORE ENCOUNTERED HE said - a brand new unknown Great Invisible Spirit He said - Our Father -abiding in a likewise totally unknon spiritual realm -not even the angels or god Yhvh knew HIS truth He said so SPECIFICALLY - two entirely seperate and distinct "truths" - not a continuation at all - He told people to come AWAY from the religion - read all those sayings in the Thomas thread for clarity -at every opportunity He pushes people right out from under that religion influence - NOT Our Father He said - NOT HIS truth.... Again I remind us - for the things HE SAID - they MURDERED HIM - they ARE ENEMIES - two entirely SEPERATE TRUTHS about two entirely SEPERATE gods !! Never forget the background context - keep it real Folks..

Quote:
His words of "salvation", freed from the hellfire did not speak of the afterlife. Very rarely Christ spoke of the afterlife.

Again though entirely inaccurate based on things HE HIMSELF SAYS DIRECTLY - like 100% inaccurate as His whole teaching is actually FOR AFTER LIFE and the NEXT LIFE to come - preparation for what comes next so that we will not be ensnared in Yhvh spiritual trap any more - read Thomas thread again for clarity - this time see all those times He has us Turn AWAY from the world entirely - find the world He said and you finda dead carcass -and once you reach that stage He said this world is not ven worthy of you any longer -His truth has NOTHING to do with living THIS life - seek the LIVING ONE all the while you are here He actually said, else you will die and be unprepared to meet that truth - thus the cycle of confusion will repeat he warned - you will reincarnate He warned in ignorance of Self again.. His truth is an ETERNAL TRUTH OF SELF - not a mere mortal world view..What can I say..??.. He is the SOURCE OF CREATION made into flesh and His truth given freely prepares US to encounter that Source DIRECTLY also, moment to moment - to BECOME it once we are free from mortal ties that bind us here.. For those with ears to hear..

Quote:
Back to the TRINITY. Jesus realized for himself, which is what made him the Christ, the anointed One that he represented the "Son". You can not come to "the Father" unless you go through "the Son". Meaning you must manifest God in your everyday, physical encounters with Others all the time. Jesus didn't have some esoteric knowledge, he realized it from his own Scripture.

Hmm - yet again though - entirely inaccurate based on the things HE HIMSELF said DIRECTLY - such as - He EXPLAINS the Trinity in full detail - in modern English it is the forming of PERSONALITY within the Divine Mind - tells us how and why it happened - He did NOT "realise for himself" - He was born here AS CHRIST He said so directly - CHOSE to come here among us with his full Divine faculty intact as he had a SPECIFIC INTENT to free the lost Souls here and life them from this imposed spiritual ignorance that held us captive and dominated - only one limitation was the mortal form of Yeshua HAD TO DIE - in order to allow the Soul to continue its Intent and in order to allow that full capacity of the Christ to be demonstrated as the Resurrection.. NOT allegory Folks - literal truth.. Christ is the MIND that CAUSES and controls the ENERGY of ALL CREATION - PRESENT right there at the start - not just a mortal man who just happened to learn some secrets - but the SOURCE OF CREATION that TAUGHT man all we know !!

Really we should listen to CHRIST (not religion) and what HE said if we truly want HIS truth !!

Quote:
The High Priests who hated Jesus, and there was only a few saw him doing "foreign things".

Only a few..?? They took a council decision to act to silence Him - so it was MAJORITY for sure !! And the reason they are against Him is simple to see - HE ALONE IS DIVINE and they and their god are NOT !!

Keep the CONTEXT Folks...They have a god who CLAIMS to be superior to all else - yet here is a man who tells them their god is an IMPOSTER - He then performs bona fide miracles that NO PRIEST OF YHVH CAN ATTAIN !!! Such things as for example HEALS A LEPER first off - and look - a leper is an OUTCAST to that society made so BY their god yhvh whos priests REFUSE to even try to heal such a one saying their god has ABANDONED THEM and so they are POWERLESS to heal !!

Christ chose a leper specifically, healed him fully with just touch and a spoken Word - HE IS DIVINE just as I say NO priest of yhvh can do such a thing !! He told the leper again specifically pleases go to the priest now and show them what I have done - no fuss or confrontation - He wanted to share His truth freely... The leper didn't do that and instead goes off to market and boast of the MESSIAH who heals with a simple touch !!! Let it sink in - keep the context - lets not slip into religious confusion or wishful thinking - see how it would play out in the real world given all we know..

The priests confront Him ( see bible John) where He tells them point blank face to face that THEIR god is NOT His god - in modern plain English that say "W T F ??? , WHO ARE YOU to go around doing and saying such things..??.." - I parphrase of course but thats pretty much how it went down - Christ tells them "Iam CHRIST and my Father empowers me" - they reply "we are gods chosen followjng the true god of Abraham and Moses" and Christ replies to that "YES you do follow THAT god, but that god IS NOT MY FATHER !!!" Let it sink in deep - He told them straight that their ancestral heritage and their god is NOT the same as His, their god Yhvh is NOT the Father that He reveals !! He then goes on to tell them that THEIR god is a charlatan, an imposter a liar and a murderer !!

Its like they confront Him to find out how come HE can heal a LEPER that they can NOT heal - and His reply is to tell them I CAN do it because MY FATHER IS LEGITIMATE DIVINE - you can NOT do it as your god is an imposter !!! It must have been something like that as AFTER this first public healing the priesthood are dead set against Him - and He does tell them clearly that their god is a lying deceiving murdering imposter - so only conclusion must be that HIS truth is NOT their truth, and so they "hate" Him as you state it simply because He is a direct and obvious threat to their very status, power and authority - not to mention the fact He is repeatedly telling the people to come away from the religion and the temple and to stop all that nonsense entirely..lol...again see the Thomas thread for clrity if needed - its all rather obvious IF we keep the CONTEXT and allow the things HE said directly - they were enemies and this is because as said we are dealing with two entirely seperate truths - two entirely separate entities and "gods" - the Jewish god is not the truth of the Father that Christ alone reveals..

He PROVED His truth with many such miracles that NO PRIEST OF YHVH COULD PERFORM - thus Christ is a direct immediate and present threat to their authority and for THAT reason primarily they murdered Him !!

The rest is twisted religious history as it was this religion of Yhvh and its off shoots that give the world all our "historical truth" lol - only thing is its ALL been a pack of lies right from the start.. If we want truth of Christ or truth of the legitimate Divine - then really only one option - we MUST do as Christ advised and cone right out from that religious influence altogether - that god there is not even our Father that Christ alone reveals - that god yhvh is a singular unique INDIVIDUAL - that is because it is a CREATURE just like You and I are - a CREATED BEING and not the SOURCE of Creation despite what it claimed.. That legitimate source does exist as a TRINITY - three distinct personalities within the same Divine mind all explained in full by Chrits directly -
He says that these ACTUALLY EXIST - this Great Invisible Spirit and this great unknown realm are actual and LITERAL - see the ORIGINAL gospel of John (google secret John) for this truth - these personalities combine and their interactions cause the entire Creation to unfold - some good way into this Creation process we learn indeed how and why YHVH is created and all the rest follows from that...All explained as said in the ORIGINAL disciple gospels - banned to you all as a damnable heresy by this gods religion as it vainly tried to hide the truth - but given freely always to those with ears to hear...

Last edited by Ab Origine : 30-09-2017 at 06:55 PM.
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Old 30-09-2017, 08:22 PM
Jeremy Bong Jeremy Bong is offline
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Ab Origine,

your every post cook the same soup of false God , false Jesus, false Bible, false this and false that.... May I ask you a few questions ?

1) Do you really know how the relationship between Jesus and God Jehovah? By how? If they are as you said, they're on war from Jesus nailed dead on the cross up to now. Or Jesus can anytime come back to tell us the truth, but there's nothing happen afterwards of now?

2) Why don't you call God Jehovah by his name and just write Yhvh only? Just try to see whether he can get angry with you or not?

3) You said, the Bible is false , then any scripture can be false. The writer can by mistaken written or even he just not the first hand listener or other reasons....

4) You said, the religion or all the religions are false. Just tell me how can you know either they're true or false? Don't just answer me by your guessing work or you ask the so call Holy Spirit of you because I've seen what's happened to you. This is not belong to Christian Holy Spirit.

5)Your source of asking for information is not reliable then you dare to say the one third of the world population believers of Christianity is not believed to the right God, but believe a false God or religion? Who are you? You have to know a false religion can't survive long or they're the minority.

6) What did you gain from what you said "no" to all these you said false or fraud? You're cheated by demons that are inside your body. That your understanding is wrong so your thoughts are cheated by demons and lead you astray.

7) So your Holy Spirit isn't from Christianity group, your Paradise isn't from Christianity God. You even don't really know what's inside the true Paradise (youtold me) that's from God. And all you see from the Paradise is blur and not real. So how can you really understand what's ourside your body or the outside world?
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Old 01-10-2017, 08:01 AM
Amilius777 Amilius777 is offline
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Okay. Ob Origine. First off. You don't know the definition of THEORY

Theory is a body of knowledge containing laws. The Theory of Evolution is a fact. Somewhere in Western civilization because a lot of garbage has seeped into the educational system, theory became confused with hypothesis, or something that wasn't proven yet.

The trinity is a theory based on the God-experience that Jesus had. His relationship with what we call God was a collective consciousness. He spoke as a member of that consciousness. The trinity is simply our understanding of God on the third dimension, thus a "theory" not that God is literally three guys in white robes. And plus, God is more than three. There are so many aspects, members, and persons in God that we would confuse it with polytheism if we sat at the "right hand of the Father" which is the highest level of vibration, it is beyond our capacity to understand.

God, I can't believe I have to rebuttal all of this. It's aggravating.

Ab Origine. You don't experience a fourth dimension, neither do I or anyone else. You are kidding yourself. Unless you have a gift for clairvoyance or mediumship with Spirits and occasionally see into the fourth dimension, then yes. But I doubt it for you.,

We ARe multi-dimensional beings. But in this current mode and form, in the human form we are experiencing our consciousness in THREE dimensions.

---

Yes you are correct that a lot of Jewish history began from Babylon. A lot of Jewish scribes retold their stories of Moses through the lenses of captivity in Babylon. We don't even know if Moses even existed in way he does in Exodus. He probably didn't. And a lot of Jewish beliefs were actually polythesistic with Yahweh as the Head God.

I know a lot of about this too because I read about it. But you obviously skim over the works of all NT scholars in the world.

Jesus as a divine being or as God is only found in JOHN's Gospel which was written almost 70-90 years after the death of Jesus to a largely Greek community, a community mainly anti-Semitic.

Judging by your constant changing of usernames over the last three years and tearing down Judaism left and right I am not surprised if you've been kicked off Spiritual Forums several times or perhaps you have siblings with the same exact beliefs, wording, and grammar punctuations.

Another thing is that Jesus was most definitely a follower of John the Baptist. John speaking of being a lesser person than Jesus is also found mainly in John's Gospel. In Mark, the OLDEST Gospel, the Baptist is a forerunner and Jesus even says no greater prophet has risen since John the Baptist. John led a movement which has some historical truth with many disciples. John was waiting for the messiah to come, and one of his own, Jesus of Nazareth who followed him was that One. The Baptism was a rite of passage, an announcement to people present that it was Jesus who was chosen by God, BEFORE he was born.

Honestly I don't even want to continue this because you sound unhinged and I don't want to bother. Just read the top New Testament and Old Testament scholars in the world-

Francesca Stavrakapoulou, Bart Ehrman, John Dominic Crossan to name a few.

I get my information from experts. I don't pull things out of my behind. And if I get a "sense" of something for a theological purpose it is from my own experience from God in my day to day life.






[quote=Ab Origine]Hi Folks..

Amilius; Hmm - if the Trinity is a truth (it is) - then how can it also be a "theory of god" that is NOT a LITERAL truth..??..lol..

All legitimate truth is "literal" by its very definition - a thing is either a literal truth or it is something else entirely - no thing can truly exist that is not a "literal truth" OF that existance lol obviously as it is the existence and the reality of it that defines "what is truth" - and just as obviously, no "truth" thus experienced, is a mere theory and no "theory" can ever be considered as a truth" lol - a truth is something tangeable substantial and repeatable - a theory - is just an educated guess and little more..lol.. HUGE huge difference Id say...



Ah but - isn't that actually FOUR dimensions..??...three SPATIAL measurements plus one TIME measurement = means Actually we exist as a four dimensional Being HERE (but this is actually just a small part of a much greater MULTI dimensional entitty that we have very limited access to)..



No that doesn't work - the "body of awareness that is separate" is indeed your MIND - same mind you have now INSIDE your physical body...You try to say we are now a Trinity but upon mortal death - for sure, we will lose one part of that make upon entirely as we will no longer have a physical body at all - yet we will still exist as same core SELF unchanged I assure you..



Hmm - simply put - it seems "more real" simply because now free from mortal body - slow slow brain and its very limited mental capacity - so we start to use now the WHOLE MIND out of body, and thus we take in a whole lot more information, build a much more vivid reality from what is available...HERE in the body we simply IGNORE around 95% of all the energetic stimulus we receive - free from body though, and Conscious awareness is likewise freed to reclaim its full potential..



Really..??..Actually nearly all the Hebrew heritage comes DIRECTLY from Babylon - ancient Sumer and the ANNUNAKI who recorded ALL the Jewish narrative some 4000 years before any Jewish nation even existed..lol.. The entire foundation of the Torah can be traced directly back to those ancient babylonian "gods"..lol...its all a SHAM... If we really want the truth of any of this then the bible is NOT the place to look, as that is just a RETELLING of a much much EARLIER version of this so called "truth"..

I will remind us all - back then when all this started - these "gods" were actual flesh and blood PEOPLE that walked and talked interacted day to day with us - so they record for all to see.. By the time the Jews come along with the Torah, MANY "gods" had stated many nations and they were all pitted against each other for domination - one "god" the god of the jews won out over the rest and so we now have our twisted history and twisted "truth" given BY that "god" alone.. This is ALL ACTUAL HISTORY - real world events - not just fables and myths and allegory from a Jewish heritage, but recorded elsewhere THE ENTIRE WORLD OVER and always spoken of as a LITERAL and historical truth !!!



Pretty irrelevant though - unless you make a clear distinction - RELIGIOUS christianity is NOT the same truth that CHRIST gave - and actually HIS truth is NOT even "a variant of Judaism" - totlall 100 % AGAINST that religion lol - He ACTUALLY SAID that "god" was an IMPOSTER and not the Father source of Creation that it had claimed - truth from Christ is what started ALL THE TROUBLE as He said to us all most clearly that we had been LIED DECIEVED and MANIPULATED by that "Jewish god" - because of this radical truth He gave freely they MURDERED HIM and the religion that bares His name used the same tactics to silence any and all who opposed them..

So - lets not forget the truth of the historical ORIGIN of this religion or its god - and lets not forget what they did to Christ and WHY they did it - keep the background context as we examine all that has been done and we soon start to make sense of it all..



Ah but that's just plain incorrect on almost every level...First - Christ niether believed nor practiced - whatever that means..??.. He simply WAS DIVINE - didn't need to "believe it" as he was the LIVING TRUTH - didn't need to "practice" anything as He was the LIVING TRUTH..lol...He was just BEING - true to Himself..

Second, he did not "follow John" - where did you get that..?...even in the bible it clearly states that this John PREPARED THE WAY for CHRIST - not the other way around..lol..

Thirdly - if you LISTEN TO CHRIST - it soon becomes apparent that He was having a "god experience" EVEN BEFORE HE TOOK MORTAL FORM - I mean - that is what HE CLAIMED DIRECTLY - to be ACTUALLY PRESENT at the start of ALL CREATION as the WORD and an integral part OF THE TRINITY that starts it all off !!!

Yeshua was not a "man who became god" - no no no - totally off track there - He was the true Divine Source of Creation that BECAME MAN made flesh and blood - again, your view presented here is entirely back to front based on what HE HIMSELF says.. Iam the Light that is over all Creation - lift the stone - split the wood Iam there - all came forth FROM Me and all will again return TO Me He said - for those with ears tot hear.. NOT a man first - He was DIVINE and that is what caused all the problems here - the priests of this god Yhvh KNEW and recognised Christ truth so they murdered Him to protect their sham bogus "god" and so remained in power...Simple... Divine Source became man among us and taught us a truth that sets us free from spiritual slavery imposed BY the jewish god Yhvh - for this truth they kill Him and twist the rest to suit their own agenda - you cannot get truth of Christ or truth of the Divine from ANY religion - He already told us plainly they will deceive us ON PURPOSE !!



Again entirely inaccurate based on things HE HIMSELF SAYS DIRECTLY - His teaching was indeed NEW - UNHEARD OF - NEVER BEFORE ENCOUNTERED HE said - a brand new unknown Great Invisible Spirit He said - Our Father -abiding in a likewise totally unknon spiritual realm -not even the angels or god Yhvh knew HIS truth He said so SPECIFICALLY - two entirely seperate and distinct "truths" - not a continuation at all - He told people to come AWAY from the religion - read all those sayings in the Thomas thread for clarity -at every opportunity He pushes people right out from under that religion influence - NOT Our Father He said - NOT HIS truth.... Again I remind us - for the things HE SAID - they MURDERED HIM - they ARE ENEMIES - two entirely SEPERATE TRUTHS about two entirely SEPERATE gods !! Never forget the background context - keep it real Folks..



Again though entirely inaccurate based on things HE HIMSELF SAYS DIRECTLY - like 100% inaccurate as His whole teaching is actually FOR AFTER LIFE and the NEXT LIFE to come - preparation for what comes next so that we will not be ensnared in Yhvh spiritual trap any more - read Thomas thread again for clarity - this time see all those times He has us Turn AWAY from the world entirely - find the world He said and you finda dead carcass -and once you reach that stage He said this world is not ven worthy of you any longer -His truth has NOTHING to do with living THIS life - seek the LIVING ONE all the while you are here He actually said, else you will die and be unprepared to meet that truth - thus the cycle of confusion will repeat he warned - you will reincarnate He warned in ignorance of Self again.. His truth is an ETERNAL TRUTH OF SELF - not a mere mortal world view..What can I say..??.. He is the SOURCE OF CREATION made into flesh and His truth given freely prepares US to encounter that Source DIRECTLY also, moment to moment - to BECOME it once we are free from mortal ties that bind us here.. For those with ears to hear..



Hmm - yet again though - entirely inaccurate based on the things HE HIMSELF said DIRECTLY - such as - He EXPLAINS the Trinity in full detail - in modern English it is the forming of PERSONALITY within the Divine Mind - tells us how and why it happened - He did NOT "realise for himself" - He was born here AS CHRIST He said so directly - CHOSE to come here among us with his full Divine faculty intact as he had a SPECIFIC INTENT to free the lost Souls here and life them from this imposed spiritual ignorance that held us captive and dominated - only one limitation was the mortal form of Yeshua HAD TO DIE - in order to allow the Soul to continue its Intent and in order to allow that full capacity of the Christ to be demonstrated as the Resurrection.. NOT allegory Folks - literal truth.. Christ is the MIND that CAUSES and controls the ENERGY of ALL CREATION - PRESENT right there at the start - not just a mortal man who just happened to learn some secrets - but the SOURCE OF CREATION that TAUGHT man all we know !!

Really we should listen to CHRIST (not religion) and what HE said if we truly want HIS truth !!



Only a few..?? They took a council decision to act to silence Him - so it was MAJORITY for sure !! And the reason they are against Him is simple to see - HE ALONE IS DIVINE and they and their god are NOT !!

Keep the CONTEXT Folks...They have a god who CLAIMS to be superior to all else - yet here is a man who tells them their god is an IMPOSTER - He then performs bona fide miracles that NO PRIEST OF YHVH CAN ATTAIN !!! Such things as for example HEALS A LEPER first off - and look - a leper is an OUTCAST to that society made so BY their god yhvh whos priests REFUSE to even try to heal such a one saying their god has ABANDONED THEM and so they are POWERLESS to heal !!

Christ chose a leper specifically, healed him fully with just touch and a spoken Word - HE IS DIVINE just as I say NO priest of yhvh can do such a thing !! He told the leper again specifically pleases go to the priest now and show them what I have done - no fuss or confrontation - He wanted to share His truth freely... The leper didn't do that and instead goes off to market and boast of the MESSIAH who heals with a simple touch !!! Let it sink in - keep the context - lets not slip into religious confusion or wishful thinking - see how it would play out in the real world given all we know..

The priests confront Him ( see bible John) where He tells them point blank face to face that THEIR god is NOT His god - in modern plain English that say "W T F ??? , WHO ARE YOU to go around doing and saying such things..??.." - I parphrase of course but thats pretty much how it went down - Christ tells them "Iam CHRIST and my Father empowers me" - they reply "we are gods chosen followjng the true god of Abraham and Moses" and Christ replies to that "YES you do follow THAT god, but that god IS NOT MY FATHER !!!" Let it sink in deep - He told them straight that their ancestral heritage and their god is NOT the same as His, their god Yhvh is NOT the Father that He reveals !! He then goes on to tell them that THEIR god is a charlatan, an imposter a liar and a murderer !!

Its like they confront Him to find out how come HE can heal a LEPER that they can NOT heal - and His reply is to tell them I CAN do it because MY FATHER IS LEGITIMATE DIVINE - you can NOT do it as your god is an imposter !!! It must have been something like that as AFTER this first public healing the priesthood are dead set against Him - and He does tell them clearly that their god is a lying deceiving murdering imposter - so only conclusion must be that HIS truth is NOT their truth, and so they "hate" Him as you state it simply because He is a direct and obvious threat to their very status, power and authority - not to mention the fact He is repeatedly telling the people to come away from the religion and the temple and to stop all that nonsense entirely..lol...again see the Thomas thread for clrity if needed - its all rather obvious IF we keep the CONTEXT and allow the things HE said directly - they were enemies and this is because as said we are dealing with two entirely seperate truths - two entirely separate entities and "gods" - the Jewish god is not the truth of the Father that Christ alone reveals..

He PROVED His truth with many such miracles that NO PRIEST OF YHVH COULD PERFORM - thus Christ is a direct immediate and present threat to their authority and for THAT reason primarily they murdered Him !!

The rest is twisted religious history as it was this religion of Yhvh and its off shoots that give the world all our "historical truth" lol - only thing is its ALL been a pack of lies right from the start.. If we want truth of Christ or truth of the legitimate Divine - then really only one option - we MUST do as Christ advised and cone right out from that religious influence altogether - that god there is not even our Father that Christ alone reveals - that god yhvh is a singular unique INDIVIDUAL - that is because it is a CREATURE just like You and I are - a CREATED BEING and not the SOURCE of Creation despite what it claimed.. That legitimate source does exist as a TRINITY - three distinct personalities within the same Divine mind all explained in full by Chrits directly -
He says that these ACTUALLY EXIST - this Great Invisible Spirit and this great unknown realm are actual and LITERAL - see the ORIGINAL gospel of John (google secret John) for this truth - these personalities combine and their interactions cause the entire Creation to unfold - some good way into this Creation process we learn indeed how and why YHVH is created and all the rest follows from that...All explained as said in the ORIGINAL disciple gospels - banned to you all as a damnable heresy by this gods religion as it vainly tried to hide the truth - but given freely always to those with ears to hear...[/QUOT
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Old 01-10-2017, 08:01 AM
Amilius777 Amilius777 is offline
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Okay. Ob Origine. First off. You don't know the definition of THEORY

Theory is a body of knowledge containing laws. The Theory of Evolution is a fact. Somewhere in Western civilization because a lot of garbage has seeped into the educational system, theory became confused with hypothesis, or something that wasn't proven yet.

The trinity is a theory based on the God-experience that Jesus had. His relationship with what we call God was a collective consciousness. He spoke as a member of that consciousness. The trinity is simply our understanding of God on the third dimension, thus a "theory" not that God is literally three guys in white robes. And plus, God is more than three. There are so many aspects, members, and persons in God that we would confuse it with polytheism if we sat at the "right hand of the Father" which is the highest level of vibration, it is beyond our capacity to understand.

God, I can't believe I have to rebuttal all of this. It's aggravating.

Ab Origine. You don't experience a fourth dimension, neither do I or anyone else. You are kidding yourself. Unless you have a gift for clairvoyance or mediumship with Spirits and occasionally see into the fourth dimension, then yes. But I doubt it for you.,

We ARe multi-dimensional beings. But in this current mode and form, in the human form we are experiencing our consciousness in THREE dimensions.

---

Yes you are correct that a lot of Jewish history began from Babylon. A lot of Jewish scribes retold their stories of Moses through the lenses of captivity in Babylon. We don't even know if Moses even existed in way he does in Exodus. He probably didn't. And a lot of Jewish beliefs were actually polythesistic with Yahweh as the Head God.

I know a lot of about this too because I read about it. But you obviously skim over the works of all NT scholars in the world.

Jesus as a divine being or as God is only found in JOHN's Gospel which was written almost 70-90 years after the death of Jesus to a largely Greek community, a community mainly anti-Semitic.

Judging by your constant changing of usernames over the last three years and tearing down Judaism left and right I am not surprised if you've been kicked off Spiritual Forums several times or perhaps you have siblings with the same exact beliefs, wording, and grammar punctuations.

Another thing is that Jesus was most definitely a follower of John the Baptist. John speaking of being a lesser person than Jesus is also found mainly in John's Gospel. In Mark, the OLDEST Gospel, the Baptist is a forerunner and Jesus even says no greater prophet has risen since John the Baptist. John led a movement which has some historical truth with many disciples. John was waiting for the messiah to come, and one of his own, Jesus of Nazareth who followed him was that One. The Baptism was a rite of passage, an announcement to people present that it was Jesus who was chosen by God, BEFORE he was born.

Honestly I don't even want to continue this because you sound unhinged and I don't want to bother. Just read the top New Testament and Old Testament scholars in the world-

Francesca Stavrakapoulou, Bart Ehrman, John Dominic Crossan to name a few.

I get my information from experts. I don't pull things out of my behind. And if I get a "sense" of something for a theological purpose it is from my own experience from God in my day to day life.






[quote=Ab Origine]Hi Folks..

Amilius; Hmm - if the Trinity is a truth (it is) - then how can it also be a "theory of god" that is NOT a LITERAL truth..??..lol..

All legitimate truth is "literal" by its very definition - a thing is either a literal truth or it is something else entirely - no thing can truly exist that is not a "literal truth" OF that existance lol obviously as it is the existence and the reality of it that defines "what is truth" - and just as obviously, no "truth" thus experienced, is a mere theory and no "theory" can ever be considered as a truth" lol - a truth is something tangeable substantial and repeatable - a theory - is just an educated guess and little more..lol.. HUGE huge difference Id say...



Ah but - isn't that actually FOUR dimensions..??...three SPATIAL measurements plus one TIME measurement = means Actually we exist as a four dimensional Being HERE (but this is actually just a small part of a much greater MULTI dimensional entitty that we have very limited access to)..



No that doesn't work - the "body of awareness that is separate" is indeed your MIND - same mind you have now INSIDE your physical body...You try to say we are now a Trinity but upon mortal death - for sure, we will lose one part of that make upon entirely as we will no longer have a physical body at all - yet we will still exist as same core SELF unchanged I assure you..



Hmm - simply put - it seems "more real" simply because now free from mortal body - slow slow brain and its very limited mental capacity - so we start to use now the WHOLE MIND out of body, and thus we take in a whole lot more information, build a much more vivid reality from what is available...HERE in the body we simply IGNORE around 95% of all the energetic stimulus we receive - free from body though, and Conscious awareness is likewise freed to reclaim its full potential..



Really..??..Actually nearly all the Hebrew heritage comes DIRECTLY from Babylon - ancient Sumer and the ANNUNAKI who recorded ALL the Jewish narrative some 4000 years before any Jewish nation even existed..lol.. The entire foundation of the Torah can be traced directly back to those ancient babylonian "gods"..lol...its all a SHAM... If we really want the truth of any of this then the bible is NOT the place to look, as that is just a RETELLING of a much much EARLIER version of this so called "truth"..

I will remind us all - back then when all this started - these "gods" were actual flesh and blood PEOPLE that walked and talked interacted day to day with us - so they record for all to see.. By the time the Jews come along with the Torah, MANY "gods" had stated many nations and they were all pitted against each other for domination - one "god" the god of the jews won out over the rest and so we now have our twisted history and twisted "truth" given BY that "god" alone.. This is ALL ACTUAL HISTORY - real world events - not just fables and myths and allegory from a Jewish heritage, but recorded elsewhere THE ENTIRE WORLD OVER and always spoken of as a LITERAL and historical truth !!!



Pretty irrelevant though - unless you make a clear distinction - RELIGIOUS christianity is NOT the same truth that CHRIST gave - and actually HIS truth is NOT even "a variant of Judaism" - totlall 100 % AGAINST that religion lol - He ACTUALLY SAID that "god" was an IMPOSTER and not the Father source of Creation that it had claimed - truth from Christ is what started ALL THE TROUBLE as He said to us all most clearly that we had been LIED DECIEVED and MANIPULATED by that "Jewish god" - because of this radical truth He gave freely they MURDERED HIM and the religion that bares His name used the same tactics to silence any and all who opposed them..

So - lets not forget the truth of the historical ORIGIN of this religion or its god - and lets not forget what they did to Christ and WHY they did it - keep the background context as we examine all that has been done and we soon start to make sense of it all..



Ah but that's just plain incorrect on almost every level...First - Christ niether believed nor practiced - whatever that means..??.. He simply WAS DIVINE - didn't need to "believe it" as he was the LIVING TRUTH - didn't need to "practice" anything as He was the LIVING TRUTH..lol...He was just BEING - true to Himself..

Second, he did not "follow John" - where did you get that..?...even in the bible it clearly states that this John PREPARED THE WAY for CHRIST - not the other way around..lol..

Thirdly - if you LISTEN TO CHRIST - it soon becomes apparent that He was having a "god experience" EVEN BEFORE HE TOOK MORTAL FORM - I mean - that is what HE CLAIMED DIRECTLY - to be ACTUALLY PRESENT at the start of ALL CREATION as the WORD and an integral part OF THE TRINITY that starts it all off !!!

Yeshua was not a "man who became god" - no no no - totally off track there - He was the true Divine Source of Creation that BECAME MAN made flesh and blood - again, your view presented here is entirely back to front based on what HE HIMSELF says.. Iam the Light that is over all Creation - lift the stone - split the wood Iam there - all came forth FROM Me and all will again return TO Me He said - for those with ears tot hear.. NOT a man first - He was DIVINE and that is what caused all the problems here - the priests of this god Yhvh KNEW and recognised Christ truth so they murdered Him to protect their sham bogus "god" and so remained in power...Simple... Divine Source became man among us and taught us a truth that sets us free from spiritual slavery imposed BY the jewish god Yhvh - for this truth they kill Him and twist the rest to suit their own agenda - you cannot get truth of Christ or truth of the Divine from ANY religion - He already told us plainly they will deceive us ON PURPOSE !!



Again entirely inaccurate based on things HE HIMSELF SAYS DIRECTLY - His teaching was indeed NEW - UNHEARD OF - NEVER BEFORE ENCOUNTERED HE said - a brand new unknown Great Invisible Spirit He said - Our Father -abiding in a likewise totally unknon spiritual realm -not even the angels or god Yhvh knew HIS truth He said so SPECIFICALLY - two entirely seperate and distinct "truths" - not a continuation at all - He told people to come AWAY from the religion - read all those sayings in the Thomas thread for clarity -at every opportunity He pushes people right out from under that religion influence - NOT Our Father He said - NOT HIS truth.... Again I remind us - for the things HE SAID - they MURDERED HIM - they ARE ENEMIES - two entirely SEPERATE TRUTHS about two entirely SEPERATE gods !! Never forget the background context - keep it real Folks..



Again though entirely inaccurate based on things HE HIMSELF SAYS DIRECTLY - like 100% inaccurate as His whole teaching is actually FOR AFTER LIFE and the NEXT LIFE to come - preparation for what comes next so that we will not be ensnared in Yhvh spiritual trap any more - read Thomas thread again for clarity - this time see all those times He has us Turn AWAY from the world entirely - find the world He said and you finda dead carcass -and once you reach that stage He said this world is not ven worthy of you any longer -His truth has NOTHING to do with living THIS life - seek the LIVING ONE all the while you are here He actually said, else you will die and be unprepared to meet that truth - thus the cycle of confusion will repeat he warned - you will reincarnate He warned in ignorance of Self again.. His truth is an ETERNAL TRUTH OF SELF - not a mere mortal world view..What can I say..??.. He is the SOURCE OF CREATION made into flesh and His truth given freely prepares US to encounter that Source DIRECTLY also, moment to moment - to BECOME it once we are free from mortal ties that bind us here.. For those with ears to hear..



Hmm - yet again though - entirely inaccurate based on the things HE HIMSELF said DIRECTLY - such as - He EXPLAINS the Trinity in full detail - in modern English it is the forming of PERSONALITY within the Divine Mind - tells us how and why it happened - He did NOT "realise for himself" - He was born here AS CHRIST He said so directly - CHOSE to come here among us with his full Divine faculty intact as he had a SPECIFIC INTENT to free the lost Souls here and life them from this imposed spiritual ignorance that held us captive and dominated - only one limitation was the mortal form of Yeshua HAD TO DIE - in order to allow the Soul to continue its Intent and in order to allow that full capacity of the Christ to be demonstrated as the Resurrection.. NOT allegory Folks - literal truth.. Christ is the MIND that CAUSES and controls the ENERGY of ALL CREATION - PRESENT right there at the start - not just a mortal man who just happened to learn some secrets - but the SOURCE OF CREATION that TAUGHT man all we know !!

Really we should listen to CHRIST (not religion) and what HE said if we truly want HIS truth !!



Only a few..?? They took a council decision to act to silence Him - so it was MAJORITY for sure !! And the reason they are against Him is simple to see - HE ALONE IS DIVINE and they and their god are NOT !!

Keep the CONTEXT Folks...They have a god who CLAIMS to be superior to all else - yet here is a man who tells them their god is an IMPOSTER - He then performs bona fide miracles that NO PRIEST OF YHVH CAN ATTAIN !!! Such things as for example HEALS A LEPER first off - and look - a leper is an OUTCAST to that society made so BY their god yhvh whos priests REFUSE to even try to heal such a one saying their god has ABANDONED THEM and so they are POWERLESS to heal !!

Christ chose a leper specifically, healed him fully with just touch and a spoken Word - HE IS DIVINE just as I say NO priest of yhvh can do such a thing !! He told the leper again specifically pleases go to the priest now and show them what I have done - no fuss or confrontation - He wanted to share His truth freely... The leper didn't do that and instead goes off to market and boast of the MESSIAH who heals with a simple touch !!! Let it sink in - keep the context - lets not slip into religious confusion or wishful thinking - see how it would play out in the real world given all we know..

The priests confront Him ( see bible John) where He tells them point blank face to face that THEIR god is NOT His god - in modern plain English that say "W T F ??? , WHO ARE YOU to go around doing and saying such things..??.." - I parphrase of course but thats pretty much how it went down - Christ tells them "Iam CHRIST and my Father empowers me" - they reply "we are gods chosen followjng the true god of Abraham and Moses" and Christ replies to that "YES you do follow THAT god, but that god IS NOT MY FATHER !!!" Let it sink in deep - He told them straight that their ancestral heritage and their god is NOT the same as His, their god Yhvh is NOT the Father that He reveals !! He then goes on to tell them that THEIR god is a charlatan, an imposter a liar and a murderer !!

Its like they confront Him to find out how come HE can heal a LEPER that they can NOT heal - and His reply is to tell them I CAN do it because MY FATHER IS LEGITIMATE DIVINE - you can NOT do it as your god is an imposter !!! It must have been something like that as AFTER this first public healing the priesthood are dead set against Him - and He does tell them clearly that their god is a lying deceiving murdering imposter - so only conclusion must be that HIS truth is NOT their truth, and so they "hate" Him as you state it simply because He is a direct and obvious threat to their very status, power and authority - not to mention the fact He is repeatedly telling the people to come away from the religion and the temple and to stop all that nonsense entirely..lol...again see the Thomas thread for clrity if needed - its all rather obvious IF we keep the CONTEXT and allow the things HE said directly - they were enemies and this is because as said we are dealing with two entirely seperate truths - two entirely separate entities and "gods" - the Jewish god is not the truth of the Father that Christ alone reveals..

He PROVED His truth with many such miracles that NO PRIEST OF YHVH COULD PERFORM - thus Christ is a direct immediate and present threat to their authority and for THAT reason primarily they murdered Him !!

The rest is twisted religious history as it was this religion of Yhvh and its off shoots that give the world all our "historical truth" lol - only thing is its ALL been a pack of lies right from the start.. If we want truth of Christ or truth of the legitimate Divine - then really only one option - we MUST do as Christ advised and cone right out from that religious influence altogether - that god there is not even our Father that Christ alone reveals - that god yhvh is a singular unique INDIVIDUAL - that is because it is a CREATURE just like You and I are - a CREATED BEING and not the SOURCE of Creation despite what it claimed.. That legitimate source does exist as a TRINITY - three distinct personalities within the same Divine mind all explained in full by Chrits directly -
He says that these ACTUALLY EXIST - this Great Invisible Spirit and this great unknown realm are actual and LITERAL - see the ORIGINAL gospel of John (google secret John) for this truth - these personalities combine and their interactions cause the entire Creation to unfold - some good way into this Creation process we learn indeed how and why YHVH is created and all the rest follows from that...All explained as said in the ORIGINAL disciple gospels - banned to you all as a damnable heresy by this gods religion as it vainly tried to hide the truth - but given freely always to those with ears to hear...[/QUOT
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  #7  
Old 01-10-2017, 08:01 AM
Amilius777 Amilius777 is offline
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Okay. Ob Origine. First off. You don't know the definition of THEORY

Theory is a body of knowledge containing laws. The Theory of Evolution is a fact. Somewhere in Western civilization because a lot of garbage has seeped into the educational system, theory became confused with hypothesis, or something that wasn't proven yet.

The trinity is a theory based on the God-experience that Jesus had. His relationship with what we call God was a collective consciousness. He spoke as a member of that consciousness. The trinity is simply our understanding of God on the third dimension, thus a "theory" not that God is literally three guys in white robes. And plus, God is more than three. There are so many aspects, members, and persons in God that we would confuse it with polytheism if we sat at the "right hand of the Father" which is the highest level of vibration, it is beyond our capacity to understand.

God, I can't believe I have to rebuttal all of this. It's aggravating.

Ab Origine. You don't experience a fourth dimension, neither do I or anyone else. You are kidding yourself. Unless you have a gift for clairvoyance or mediumship with Spirits and occasionally see into the fourth dimension, then yes. But I doubt it for you.,

We ARe multi-dimensional beings. But in this current mode and form, in the human form we are experiencing our consciousness in THREE dimensions.

---

Yes you are correct that a lot of Jewish history began from Babylon. A lot of Jewish scribes retold their stories of Moses through the lenses of captivity in Babylon. We don't even know if Moses even existed in way he does in Exodus. He probably didn't. And a lot of Jewish beliefs were actually polythesistic with Yahweh as the Head God.

I know a lot of about this too because I read about it. But you obviously skim over the works of all NT scholars in the world.

Jesus as a divine being or as God is only found in JOHN's Gospel which was written almost 70-90 years after the death of Jesus to a largely Greek community, a community mainly anti-Semitic.

Judging by your constant changing of usernames over the last three years and tearing down Judaism left and right I am not surprised if you've been kicked off Spiritual Forums several times or perhaps you have siblings with the same exact beliefs, wording, and grammar punctuations.

Another thing is that Jesus was most definitely a follower of John the Baptist. John speaking of being a lesser person than Jesus is also found mainly in John's Gospel. In Mark, the OLDEST Gospel, the Baptist is a forerunner and Jesus even says no greater prophet has risen since John the Baptist. John led a movement which has some historical truth with many disciples. John was waiting for the messiah to come, and one of his own, Jesus of Nazareth who followed him was that One. The Baptism was a rite of passage, an announcement to people present that it was Jesus who was chosen by God, BEFORE he was born.

Honestly I don't even want to continue this because you sound unhinged and I don't want to bother. Just read the top New Testament and Old Testament scholars in the world-

Francesca Stavrakapoulou, Bart Ehrman, John Dominic Crossan to name a few.

I get my information from experts. I don't pull things out of my behind. And if I get a "sense" of something for a theological purpose it is from my own experience from God in my day to day life.






[quote=Ab Origine]Hi Folks..

Amilius; Hmm - if the Trinity is a truth (it is) - then how can it also be a "theory of god" that is NOT a LITERAL truth..??..lol..

All legitimate truth is "literal" by its very definition - a thing is either a literal truth or it is something else entirely - no thing can truly exist that is not a "literal truth" OF that existance lol obviously as it is the existence and the reality of it that defines "what is truth" - and just as obviously, no "truth" thus experienced, is a mere theory and no "theory" can ever be considered as a truth" lol - a truth is something tangeable substantial and repeatable - a theory - is just an educated guess and little more..lol.. HUGE huge difference Id say...



Ah but - isn't that actually FOUR dimensions..??...three SPATIAL measurements plus one TIME measurement = means Actually we exist as a four dimensional Being HERE (but this is actually just a small part of a much greater MULTI dimensional entitty that we have very limited access to)..



No that doesn't work - the "body of awareness that is separate" is indeed your MIND - same mind you have now INSIDE your physical body...You try to say we are now a Trinity but upon mortal death - for sure, we will lose one part of that make upon entirely as we will no longer have a physical body at all - yet we will still exist as same core SELF unchanged I assure you..



Hmm - simply put - it seems "more real" simply because now free from mortal body - slow slow brain and its very limited mental capacity - so we start to use now the WHOLE MIND out of body, and thus we take in a whole lot more information, build a much more vivid reality from what is available...HERE in the body we simply IGNORE around 95% of all the energetic stimulus we receive - free from body though, and Conscious awareness is likewise freed to reclaim its full potential..



Really..??..Actually nearly all the Hebrew heritage comes DIRECTLY from Babylon - ancient Sumer and the ANNUNAKI who recorded ALL the Jewish narrative some 4000 years before any Jewish nation even existed..lol.. The entire foundation of the Torah can be traced directly back to those ancient babylonian "gods"..lol...its all a SHAM... If we really want the truth of any of this then the bible is NOT the place to look, as that is just a RETELLING of a much much EARLIER version of this so called "truth"..

I will remind us all - back then when all this started - these "gods" were actual flesh and blood PEOPLE that walked and talked interacted day to day with us - so they record for all to see.. By the time the Jews come along with the Torah, MANY "gods" had stated many nations and they were all pitted against each other for domination - one "god" the god of the jews won out over the rest and so we now have our twisted history and twisted "truth" given BY that "god" alone.. This is ALL ACTUAL HISTORY - real world events - not just fables and myths and allegory from a Jewish heritage, but recorded elsewhere THE ENTIRE WORLD OVER and always spoken of as a LITERAL and historical truth !!!



Pretty irrelevant though - unless you make a clear distinction - RELIGIOUS christianity is NOT the same truth that CHRIST gave - and actually HIS truth is NOT even "a variant of Judaism" - totlall 100 % AGAINST that religion lol - He ACTUALLY SAID that "god" was an IMPOSTER and not the Father source of Creation that it had claimed - truth from Christ is what started ALL THE TROUBLE as He said to us all most clearly that we had been LIED DECIEVED and MANIPULATED by that "Jewish god" - because of this radical truth He gave freely they MURDERED HIM and the religion that bares His name used the same tactics to silence any and all who opposed them..

So - lets not forget the truth of the historical ORIGIN of this religion or its god - and lets not forget what they did to Christ and WHY they did it - keep the background context as we examine all that has been done and we soon start to make sense of it all..



Ah but that's just plain incorrect on almost every level...First - Christ niether believed nor practiced - whatever that means..??.. He simply WAS DIVINE - didn't need to "believe it" as he was the LIVING TRUTH - didn't need to "practice" anything as He was the LIVING TRUTH..lol...He was just BEING - true to Himself..

Second, he did not "follow John" - where did you get that..?...even in the bible it clearly states that this John PREPARED THE WAY for CHRIST - not the other way around..lol..

Thirdly - if you LISTEN TO CHRIST - it soon becomes apparent that He was having a "god experience" EVEN BEFORE HE TOOK MORTAL FORM - I mean - that is what HE CLAIMED DIRECTLY - to be ACTUALLY PRESENT at the start of ALL CREATION as the WORD and an integral part OF THE TRINITY that starts it all off !!!

Yeshua was not a "man who became god" - no no no - totally off track there - He was the true Divine Source of Creation that BECAME MAN made flesh and blood - again, your view presented here is entirely back to front based on what HE HIMSELF says.. Iam the Light that is over all Creation - lift the stone - split the wood Iam there - all came forth FROM Me and all will again return TO Me He said - for those with ears tot hear.. NOT a man first - He was DIVINE and that is what caused all the problems here - the priests of this god Yhvh KNEW and recognised Christ truth so they murdered Him to protect their sham bogus "god" and so remained in power...Simple... Divine Source became man among us and taught us a truth that sets us free from spiritual slavery imposed BY the jewish god Yhvh - for this truth they kill Him and twist the rest to suit their own agenda - you cannot get truth of Christ or truth of the Divine from ANY religion - He already told us plainly they will deceive us ON PURPOSE !!



Again entirely inaccurate based on things HE HIMSELF SAYS DIRECTLY - His teaching was indeed NEW - UNHEARD OF - NEVER BEFORE ENCOUNTERED HE said - a brand new unknown Great Invisible Spirit He said - Our Father -abiding in a likewise totally unknon spiritual realm -not even the angels or god Yhvh knew HIS truth He said so SPECIFICALLY - two entirely seperate and distinct "truths" - not a continuation at all - He told people to come AWAY from the religion - read all those sayings in the Thomas thread for clarity -at every opportunity He pushes people right out from under that religion influence - NOT Our Father He said - NOT HIS truth.... Again I remind us - for the things HE SAID - they MURDERED HIM - they ARE ENEMIES - two entirely SEPERATE TRUTHS about two entirely SEPERATE gods !! Never forget the background context - keep it real Folks..



Again though entirely inaccurate based on things HE HIMSELF SAYS DIRECTLY - like 100% inaccurate as His whole teaching is actually FOR AFTER LIFE and the NEXT LIFE to come - preparation for what comes next so that we will not be ensnared in Yhvh spiritual trap any more - read Thomas thread again for clarity - this time see all those times He has us Turn AWAY from the world entirely - find the world He said and you finda dead carcass -and once you reach that stage He said this world is not ven worthy of you any longer -His truth has NOTHING to do with living THIS life - seek the LIVING ONE all the while you are here He actually said, else you will die and be unprepared to meet that truth - thus the cycle of confusion will repeat he warned - you will reincarnate He warned in ignorance of Self again.. His truth is an ETERNAL TRUTH OF SELF - not a mere mortal world view..What can I say..??.. He is the SOURCE OF CREATION made into flesh and His truth given freely prepares US to encounter that Source DIRECTLY also, moment to moment - to BECOME it once we are free from mortal ties that bind us here.. For those with ears to hear..



Hmm - yet again though - entirely inaccurate based on the things HE HIMSELF said DIRECTLY - such as - He EXPLAINS the Trinity in full detail - in modern English it is the forming of PERSONALITY within the Divine Mind - tells us how and why it happened - He did NOT "realise for himself" - He was born here AS CHRIST He said so directly - CHOSE to come here among us with his full Divine faculty intact as he had a SPECIFIC INTENT to free the lost Souls here and life them from this imposed spiritual ignorance that held us captive and dominated - only one limitation was the mortal form of Yeshua HAD TO DIE - in order to allow the Soul to continue its Intent and in order to allow that full capacity of the Christ to be demonstrated as the Resurrection.. NOT allegory Folks - literal truth.. Christ is the MIND that CAUSES and controls the ENERGY of ALL CREATION - PRESENT right there at the start - not just a mortal man who just happened to learn some secrets - but the SOURCE OF CREATION that TAUGHT man all we know !!

Really we should listen to CHRIST (not religion) and what HE said if we truly want HIS truth !!



Only a few..?? They took a council decision to act to silence Him - so it was MAJORITY for sure !! And the reason they are against Him is simple to see - HE ALONE IS DIVINE and they and their god are NOT !!

Keep the CONTEXT Folks...They have a god who CLAIMS to be superior to all else - yet here is a man who tells them their god is an IMPOSTER - He then performs bona fide miracles that NO PRIEST OF YHVH CAN ATTAIN !!! Such things as for example HEALS A LEPER first off - and look - a leper is an OUTCAST to that society made so BY their god yhvh whos priests REFUSE to even try to heal such a one saying their god has ABANDONED THEM and so they are POWERLESS to heal !!

Christ chose a leper specifically, healed him fully with just touch and a spoken Word - HE IS DIVINE just as I say NO priest of yhvh can do such a thing !! He told the leper again specifically pleases go to the priest now and show them what I have done - no fuss or confrontation - He wanted to share His truth freely... The leper didn't do that and instead goes off to market and boast of the MESSIAH who heals with a simple touch !!! Let it sink in - keep the context - lets not slip into religious confusion or wishful thinking - see how it would play out in the real world given all we know..

The priests confront Him ( see bible John) where He tells them point blank face to face that THEIR god is NOT His god - in modern plain English that say "W T F ??? , WHO ARE YOU to go around doing and saying such things..??.." - I parphrase of course but thats pretty much how it went down - Christ tells them "Iam CHRIST and my Father empowers me" - they reply "we are gods chosen followjng the true god of Abraham and Moses" and Christ replies to that "YES you do follow THAT god, but that god IS NOT MY FATHER !!!" Let it sink in deep - He told them straight that their ancestral heritage and their god is NOT the same as His, their god Yhvh is NOT the Father that He reveals !! He then goes on to tell them that THEIR god is a charlatan, an imposter a liar and a murderer !!

Its like they confront Him to find out how come HE can heal a LEPER that they can NOT heal - and His reply is to tell them I CAN do it because MY FATHER IS LEGITIMATE DIVINE - you can NOT do it as your god is an imposter !!! It must have been something like that as AFTER this first public healing the priesthood are dead set against Him - and He does tell them clearly that their god is a lying deceiving murdering imposter - so only conclusion must be that HIS truth is NOT their truth, and so they "hate" Him as you state it simply because He is a direct and obvious threat to their very status, power and authority - not to mention the fact He is repeatedly telling the people to come away from the religion and the temple and to stop all that nonsense entirely..lol...again see the Thomas thread for clrity if needed - its all rather obvious IF we keep the CONTEXT and allow the things HE said directly - they were enemies and this is because as said we are dealing with two entirely seperate truths - two entirely separate entities and "gods" - the Jewish god is not the truth of the Father that Christ alone reveals..

He PROVED His truth with many such miracles that NO PRIEST OF YHVH COULD PERFORM - thus Christ is a direct immediate and present threat to their authority and for THAT reason primarily they murdered Him !!

The rest is twisted religious history as it was this religion of Yhvh and its off shoots that give the world all our "historical truth" lol - only thing is its ALL been a pack of lies right from the start.. If we want truth of Christ or truth of the legitimate Divine - then really only one option - we MUST do as Christ advised and cone right out from that religious influence altogether - that god there is not even our Father that Christ alone reveals - that god yhvh is a singular unique INDIVIDUAL - that is because it is a CREATURE just like You and I are - a CREATED BEING and not the SOURCE of Creation despite what it claimed.. That legitimate source does exist as a TRINITY - three distinct personalities within the same Divine mind all explained in full by Chrits directly -
He says that these ACTUALLY EXIST - this Great Invisible Spirit and this great unknown realm are actual and LITERAL - see the ORIGINAL gospel of John (google secret John) for this truth - these personalities combine and their interactions cause the entire Creation to unfold - some good way into this Creation process we learn indeed how and why YHVH is created and all the rest follows from that...All explained as said in the ORIGINAL disciple gospels - banned to you all as a damnable heresy by this gods religion as it vainly tried to hide the truth - but given freely always to those with ears to hear...[/QUOT
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Old 01-10-2017, 11:51 AM
Ab Origine Ab Origine is offline
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Hi Folks..

Amilius;
Quote:
Theory is a body of knowledge containing laws. The Theory of Evolution is a fact. Somewhere in Western civilization because a lot of garbage has seeped into the educational system, theory became confused with hypothesis, or something that wasn't proven yet.

lol - no - a theory is a body of knowledge containing SUPPOSITIONS - NOT facts...lol...IF it contained ACTUAL facts then the theory would be LITERAL TRUTH just as I said - a theory can NOT be literal truth though BY DEFINITION - obviously - as a theory IS supposition and nothing more, something that we ASSUME to happen even if we cant quite explain the FACTS about it..lol...See the crucial difference..??..The bottom line is surely that a theory contains no knowledge that is ABSOLUTELY CERTAIN knowledge, and merely contains knowledge that MAY or MAY NOT BE CORRECT - whereas a bona fide FACT contains ONLY KNOWLEDGE THAT IS CORRECT - ergo a theory is always a guess - and a fact is always a literal truth..

The theory of evolution is a fact..??...lol....really..??..lol...check out the huge scientific debate about that were I you...It is not a fact at all - it is their best guess based on other things they do know - that is why they term it THEORY lol and NOT evolutionary fact...lol..obvious...

Quote:
The trinity is a theory based on the God-experience that Jesus had. His relationship with what we call God was a collective consciousness. He spoke as a member of that consciousness.

The Trinity is actually a FACT and a literal truth according to CHRIST DIRECTLY, as in He said this is the way it ACTUALLY HAPPENED - and He should know as He was PRESENT right at the start of all creation - He was NOT a "man that had god experience" despite what you say you are actually totally ignoring pretty much everything HE said about HIMSELF..

Quote:
The trinity is simply our understanding of God on the third dimension, thus a "theory" not that God is literally three guys in white robes. And plus, God is more than three. There are so many aspects, members, and persons in God that we would confuse it with polytheism if we sat at the "right hand of the Father" which is the highest level of vibration, it is beyond our capacity to understand.

The thing about this god being a guy in white robes is irrelevant here - it is religious Christian aspect and that wont even exist until 400 years AFTER Christ died - so no, he wasn't speaking about that..lol.. As to the many aspects -I already agreed didn't I when I said my Father is ACTUALLY a multi dimensional entity - but see, we are speaking SPECIFICALLY here about a TRINITY - not all the other aspects, just the PRIMAL THREE - the rest is irrelevant to the truth of this Trinity... If you wish to discuss my Fathers overall nature and the layout heirachy and sequence of Creation itself, then we can of course, but again by definition, a TRINITY is just THREE aspects and not all the rest..lol...

which is it to be then..?...Should I explain the Trinity for you as the thread title suggests..?..or the overall metaphysical arrangement and nature of the Divine..??.. Either way I promise to ONLY stick to the things CHRIST ACTUALLY SAID - and then that way it will all be FACTUAL rather than mere guesswork and theory...lol....He told you (all) quite plainly the religion has no truth to offer you - so why insist on using a religion to try to work this all out..??...HE Himself already explained it all quite fully - a said -just goggle SECRET JOHN - its a very deep read but I assure you , the full nature of this "god" the Trinity and all Creation is indeed laid out step by detailed step for us..

Quote:
God, I can't believe I have to rebuttal all of this. It's aggravating.

lol - as if you are some professor marking my grades..??..or as if you are some authority..?...I doubt you can rebut anything I said - because see - simply - as I keep reminding you - CHRIST HIMSLEF SAID IT ALL FIRST - so really you are trying to rebut HIM..lol...which obviously you are not up to that task as HE was PRESENT as creation started - you were not...lol..

Quote:
Ab Origine. You don't experience a fourth dimension, neither do I or anyone else

lol OMG - I wish some of you people would stop and think before you type...lol...how utterly ridiculous that statement actually is.... Tell me - do you exist now in 3 spatial dimensions..?...YES we all do - and alongside this, is TIME PASSING FOR YOU..??.. YES - same as for us all - so we do indeed have a 3 dimensional solid body object that is existing in a single fluid dimension we call TIME...

3+1 ALWAYS = 4 - now that IS a fact...lol...and indeed that is the FACT of our existence here is it not..?... If you have a body form as normal then you have your first 3 dimensions intact - if you experience the passage of time WITHIN that bodyform then you exist IN the 4th dimension along with everything else sharing that timeline - if you have a body still but do NOT experience the passage of time as you claim, then sorry mate, you must actually be DEAD..lol

Quote:
You are kidding yourself. Unless you have a gift for clairvoyance or mediumship with Spirits and occasionally see into the fourth dimension, then yes. But I doubt it for you.,

Actually YES I do have such a gift on occasion - frequently actually - but still - again - its irrelevant here....see these things happen when you step OUTSIDE the normal mortal arrangement..lol.. we are already existing IN the fourth dimension and this is our MORTAL realm - spiritual realms exist OUTSIDE our time and space arrangement and it is contact with these other dimensions that bring knowledge from OUTSIDE our timeline, premonitions and all the rest....Again, rather obvious and far far more common than you may suppose..

Quote:
We ARe multi-dimensional beings. But in this current mode and form, in the human form we are experiencing our consciousness in THREE dimensions.

I know we are multi dimensional - it was I who first told you that in the post above..lol..as said I agree - but the rest is just inaccurate - unless as said time has stopped for you personally then you do indeed exist here in FOUR dimensions not three..lol..

Quote:
I know a lot of about this too because I read about it. But you obviously skim over the works of all NT scholars in the world.

Again IRRELEVANT - see and UNDERSTAND - the NEW TESTAMANT IS A MAN MADE FRAUD - VERY easily proven !!! I did so just recently on another thread - showed the HISTORICAL ORIGIN of the entire religion, recorded by independent none biased historical sources..

So - it doesnt matter who comes along after and looks at the NEW testament - they are looking at a FRAUD - openly admitted even by the catholic church...lol...They can debate it all they like - still - they debate a FRAUD..lol...It doesnt matter what conclusions these experts come up - all their starting information is a FRAUD....do let it sink in..... NONE of it is what CHRIST SAID DIRECTLY... These scholarly experts along with the rest of us have been given MISDRECTION and have been manipulated ON PURPOSE by the religion Exactly as Christ actually warned...

We know all that is true simply because the way the church acts - literally cherry picking scripture to suit its agenda then discarding everything else as "heresy" - it then presented this cherry picked truth to the world as NEW testament and it is this cherry picked truth ALONE that these scholars get to work with.. !!!

Again OBVIOUS - their conclusions then are not reliable are they..??..simply because right at the start of their investigation they have been given only PARTIAL and TWISTED and MANIPULATED "truth" so whatever conclusion they come up with is always going to be just a false as the material they investigate !!

The ORIGINAL truth still exists and is once again today freely available thanks to this wonderous internet - and this is how we know the religion is wholly deceptive, because simply even to this day they will NOT OPEN THEIR ARCHIVES - will NOT show us ORIGINAL manuscripts - and that is because as I repeatedly tell you (all) - the ORIGINAL disciple gospels are NOTHING LIKE the ones they forced upon us in the bible - the bible IS a fraud - read the ORIGINAL manuscripts that all this canon is taken from and we soon get a much different view emerging - a view just as I present, where the god of the jews is NOT this great invisible spirit that Christ is now revealing...Two entirely separate truths about two entirely separate entities...

If we want actual truth from all this, then its best to trust CHRIST as after all, HE IS DIVINE claimed it DIRECTLY despite what the religion argue all day long about it, still, its what CHRIST ACTUALLY SAID of HIMSELF - that is ALL that matters - and He already told us to shun all that religious malarkey - don't trust them Pharisees He said - DAMN them - HATE your parents ways - they have all MISLED you He clearly warned.. If we want actual truth then - it pays greatly to go look at ALL the stuff the religion banned you to know - see what they hide and WHY - I assure you it is exactly as I present it in my posts - two entirely seperate "gods" - the first bogus god Yhvh - and the new truth of a great Divine spirit Christ alone revealed as Our Father - NOT the same at all despite the religious confusion Christ Himself is VERY clear....

It maybe hard to swallow - especially if you think your self religiously learned - but actually my friend - you and all the other religious types that rely on bible scripture alone, have been fully duped BY your religion...again this is EXACTLY what Christ warned you they would do to you - Im just setting the record straight on HIS behalf..
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Old 03-10-2017, 04:27 PM
Amilius777 Amilius777 is offline
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Listen,
You believe what you believe and I believe what I believe, all based on our own experiences.

Even though we are Spiritual, spirituality is also like having a religion. Some people are Jewish some people are Christian or what have you. Maybe things come to you differently because that's how you would understand them.

We have an Infinite God so I am not worried about the many contradictions that might be displayed as we can see have been displayed throughout history, in the lives of so many different people.

And I did some more research and Ab Orgine you are actually more correct about Old Testament beliefs. According to the most recent discoveries the ancient Israelites weren't as monotheistic as said. I've read that the Old Testament writings are a minority report written by Elite scribes and Priests in the temple of what they believed Israel OUGHT to have been like. And Yahweh was in fact a god among several with many graven images of other gods and Cults throughout Israel. Some interesting stuff

But all I was getting at was that God which is ALL THERE IS, manifests like us. Or let's say we manifest like our Parent.

God is Spirit and manifests as Mind, Body, and Soul or Father, Son, Holy Spirit. That's all I was getting at. And for me, Jesus of Nazareth embodied "the Son", It's just one way of looking at it.
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  #10  
Old 03-10-2017, 06:39 PM
Ab Origine Ab Origine is offline
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Hi Folks..

Amilius; Yes I hear you - we are not so different at the core... You are a rarity though, in that you are able to see past the religion(s) to find the common ground - but alas - for most people that is not so - and ALL the religions are actually pointing us off to the "wrong god" - we have a good idea now (thanks to Christ, Buddha gets a notable mention here too) of what the True Divine actually is, and how t attain its experience - and through such LEGITIMATE teachers we gain bona fide wisdom - but the religions themselves, are a definite obstacle and a hinderance to true enlightenment..

So, some time ago now, I did a thread about the origin of ALL the worlds reliigions, based on actual "hard evidence" that could NOT BE ALTERED - original writing from the VERY FIRST CIVILISATIONS(s) of ancient Sumer - exact same place of course where ALL the bible narrative occurs.. Gromthis real world hard unalterable evidence we know for sure beyond any dispute HOW the Hebrew nation and its god REALLY came about - it is laid out for us as said some FOUR THOUSAND years BEFORE the Hebrew nation ever existed, carved into those ancient Babylonian tablets - EXACT same story, characters events and narratives.. It all starts there I Sumer, but soon spreads out the ENTUIRE WORLD - all verified by both real world and circumstantial evidence - so much so, it makes perfect logical sense...

For instance - Cane and Abel in the bible - one is banished and "marked" with a curse from "god" - is recorded for all to see IN those Sumer texts - same names and events given, except THEY say the DETAILS of the event, as in the GENETIC MANIPULATION of Canes line, resulting in a FACT that his decendants would NOT HAVE MUCH FACIAL HAIR... These descendands are then taken directly to SOUTH AMERICA where they are left to fend for themselves....Bizarrely - when we go look AT south American indiginous people, we find indeed they genetically CANNOT GROW FACIAL HAIR as other cultures do !! That's not a cultural preferance, that IS a genetic DIFFERENCE - and look it WAS recorded for all to see as an ACCEPTED FACT by a culture in ancient Sumer that SHOULD NOT have known ANYTHING about S America OR its indiginous peoples...

Time and time again those ancient clay tablets give us real world proof - such as STAR CHARTS that modern man could only verify once we invented powerful telescopes but which Sumer recorded as FACT for all to see - dna and its manipulation openly discussed in Sumer thousands of years before modern man had any clue !!

Such things are proof in their own rights and evidence which adds up to a convincing truth - and that truth in the modern world is indeed that ALL religion is a sham - it ALL came from Sumer, set up on purpose to dominate and control the peoples and crucially, NONE of those who instigated all that were "spiritual beings" and there was very VERY limited involvement from the TRUE Divine, though there is some interesting DIVINE INTERVENTION that sets us onto our MODERN historical path...

As you say - to delve deep it becomes VERY INTERESTING with countless twists and turns throughout...BUT - one crucial thing I simply cannot forget or ignore - like a core foundational fact behind all else.. CHRIST HIMSELF came among us - claimed to be ACTUAL DIVINE SOURCE OF ALL - and told us point blank that EVERYTHING we thought and believed thus far about "spiritual eternal existence" was ENTIRELY WRONG HE said - the one that ACTUALLY created us, IS the Jewish god Yhvh (this is actually Enki and Enlil Sumer origin) - but that one Yhvh is NOT the supreme "spiritual god" All-that-Is, and the sequence of events that the bible gives us is NOT the complete truth of all this, nothing like...

For the real world history of how we physically came to be here in this condition we are now, the ancient Sumer record is probably entirely accurate...I say that simply because it does indeed contain fact after fact that these ancient people simply had no way of knowing, unless it is true and OTHERS came here and did all this TO us just as they recrd.. From that record it is easy to trace the spread of all religion all around the world for as said, they record they set out on purpose to portray themselves AS gods to dominate and hold us subserviant to them.. They record that they are not ACTUAL spiritual gods, just use religion as a tool for that purpose....

And for actual bona fide SPIRITUAL wisdom - well there is ONLY CHRIST - as He alone claims to BE THE SOURCE OF CREATION itself present as the very first Creation event unfolds, then lays out step by step details for us (original disciple gospels, not bible) that shows us how that real world history played out, with the true Divine intervening as it became necessary to do so...

Between ancient Sumer real word events - and wisdom from Christ Divine events - we soon piece together a very logical and provable series of events that makes perfect logical sense.. The crucial thing to grasp though from both accounts equally, is that religion itself has NO PART TO PLAY IN ACTUAL TRUTH !! Religion, especially the Judaic which became most dominant, was indeed invented on purpose with that sole intent TO DOMINATE US... Its been like that ever since hasn it..??...

And Christ..??...DIRECTLY TOLD US - repeatedly and insistantly WARNED US that the religion was a sham, had no truth to give, and should be discarded entirely before we would be able to understand HIM and HIS Divine truth...
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