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Go Back   Spiritual Forums > Spirituality & Beliefs > Non Duality

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  #1  
Old 20-09-2017, 03:44 AM
Iamit Iamit is offline
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Mind and Ego

I'm sure you know the origin of the term "Ego"and its use made popular by Freud so no need to go into that.

We know from our own experience that mind works on, thinks about, worries about, feelings of discomfort experienced by the organism it serves. It searches through its memeory to see if it has already solved the discomfort and applies that again or, if not dealt with before, it searches externally for more data in the hope of finding a solution and if successful applies that new solution.

One of the discomforts in life that we exprience is rejection, usually starting at an early age. That discomfort is passed to mind like any other discomfort. What mind comes up with in an attempt at a solution, is the construction of a character that it thinks will deflect rejection. That construction is our Ego. It is a defensive construction designed to protect the organism from rejection. Some constructions are more successful at doing that than others. Like all the constructions of mind, it takes energy to maintain that character. Mind does not use energy unnecessarily and monitors the construction to see if the defence can be reduced as we evolve through our experience of life. This happens automatically as does all the activity of mind. Once we understand the purpose and function of our mind and its child Ego we do not have to eliminate either but can simply leave it do its thing. It is automatically kept under review.

The idea that ego needs purifying and the mind quitening will be because that is what mind has come up with in response to the particular details of the rejection experienced by the organism it serves. It is no better or worse that any other solution because each solution relates to the particular context of the organism concerned. Mind will put in place whatever eliefs are necessary to maintain its Ego construction.

This need for protection is why the mind will not allow itself to be undermined but will present as undermined if that is what is required for its survival. Taking on the mind is always a losing battle. Ironically it will drive you mad or kill you as a last resort to stop itself being undermined because it thinks, quite rightly, that you cannot survive without it.

What you think you see as the appearance of mind overcome is a construction of mind! It is far too clever to allow the Ego it has created to be successful in overcoming it
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  #2  
Old 20-09-2017, 01:13 PM
naturesflow naturesflow is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iamit
I'm sure you know the origin of the term "Ego"and its use made popular by Freud so no need to go into that.

We know from our own experience that mind works on, thinks about, worries about, feelings of discomfort experienced by the organism it serves. It searches through its memeory to see if it has already solved the discomfort and applies that again or, if not dealt with before, it searches externally for more data in the hope of finding a solution and if successful applies that new solution.

One of the discomforts in life that we exprience is rejection, usually starting at an early age. That discomfort is passed to mind like any other discomfort. What mind comes up with in an attempt at a solution, is the construction of a character that it thinks will deflect rejection. That construction is our Ego. It is a defensive construction designed to protect the organism from rejection. Some constructions are more successful at doing that than others. Like all the constructions of mind, it takes energy to maintain that character. Mind does not use energy unnecessarily and monitors the construction to see if the defence can be reduced as we evolve through our experience of life. This happens automatically as does all the activity of mind. Once we understand the purpose and function of our mind and its child Ego we do not have to eliminate either but can simply leave it do its thing. It is automatically kept under review.

The idea that ego needs purifying and the mind quitening will be because that is what mind has come up with in response to the particular details of the rejection experienced by the organism it serves. It is no better or worse that any other solution because each solution relates to the particular context of the organism concerned. Mind will put in place whatever eliefs are necessary to maintain its Ego construction.

This need for protection is why the mind will not allow itself to be undermined but will present as undermined if that is what is required for its survival. Taking on the mind is always a losing battle. Ironically it will drive you mad or kill you as a last resort to stop itself being undermined because it thinks, quite rightly, that you cannot survive without it.

What you think you see as the appearance of mind overcome is a construction of mind! It is far too clever to allow the Ego it has created to be successful in overcoming it

I like your views in this...Rejection is a big issue and often it contaminates the whole of one's processors in that mode of being, unless of course your in review and self aware to notice yourself in this way. Rejection and abandonment for the inner child can be so traumatic, so to stabilize and control re entering fully into that pain and trauma and manage oneself, there is often a block/wall put in place. Most often because these issues create a perceived idea that pain represents a severe loss.
So for it's own survival, those protective alliances within the bodies system will set itself up to manage further points of pain and trauma mimicking and replaying throughout ones life. When it is time for the walls to come down, at times the whole system will fall away conditioned in this manner, so it can be a profound shift in total awareness of self realization.

Taking on the mind is always a losing battle- indeed!
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  #3  
Old 20-09-2017, 02:08 PM
God-Like God-Like is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iamit
What you think you see as the appearance of mind overcome is a construction of mind! It is far too clever to allow the Ego it has created to be successful in overcoming it


In a way your personalising the mind and suggesting the mind has an agenda to keep you within / of it .

I see the mind perhaps differently from most in that it is the environment for one to experience the mind-body experience .

The mind in that respect is impartial to whether you can transcend it or not or become trapped within it's fields of supposed influence .

Is it the mind's fault that one can be swayed by the sense of one's ego? I say not .


x daz x
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  #4  
Old 20-09-2017, 02:35 PM
weareunity weareunity is offline
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As mentioned elsewhere, the behaviour which some--but not all--describe as egotistic is--imo--designed to provide those who exhibit such behaviour with a sense of significance or an increased sense of significance. Attempting to do so by comparative means, relative means, such as needing to be more than, richer than , more noticeable than, etc. Doing so produces artificial differentials between folk with often destructive consequences I think. I believe that loving compassion is the only true and fulfilling way of transfer of significance one to another. petex
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  #5  
Old 21-09-2017, 12:36 AM
naturesflow naturesflow is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by God-Like
In a way your personalising the mind and suggesting the mind has an agenda to keep you within / of it .

I see the mind perhaps differently from most in that it is the environment for one to experience the mind-body experience .

The mind in that respect is impartial to whether you can transcend it or not or become trapped within it's fields of supposed influence .

Is it the mind's fault that one can be swayed by the sense of one's ego? I say not .


x daz x
'
Hey daz.

Would an open mind have an agenda of itself or more an awareness inclusive of the mind/body/spirit? In this way what leads, is a more aware connection from within as a "whole being" as I see it. In some ways the mind is working in harmonized "emptiness" but open, in this way, it is more a vessel of open flow awareness without attachment. So the transcending point is really being open more holistically from your whole being, so there is a more inclusive movement or response in this way. Of course how you determine your own movements will be from the point of your own connection in yourself. Unless of course you can see more beyond that point before your being this..
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The wisdom of samadhi is quite different. Higher level wisdom cannot be written down. It cannot be spoken. True wisdom is the knowledge of the universe that is beyond physical expression.
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  #6  
Old 21-09-2017, 01:53 AM
Iamit Iamit is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iamit
I'm sure you know the origin of the term "Ego"and its use made popular by Freud so no need to go into that.

We know from our own experience that mind works on, thinks about, worries about, feelings of discomfort experienced by the organism it serves. It searches through its memeory to see if it has already solved the discomfort and applies that again or, if not dealt with before, it searches externally for more data in the hope of finding a solution and if successful applies that new solution.

One of the discomforts in life that we exprience is rejection, usually starting at an early age. That discomfort is passed to mind like any other discomfort. What mind comes up with in an attempt at a solution, is the construction of a character that it thinks will deflect rejection. That construction is our Ego. It is a defensive construction designed to protect the organism from rejection. Some constructions are more successful at doing that than others. Like all the constructions of mind, it takes energy to maintain that character. Mind does not use energy unnecessarily and monitors the construction to see if the defence can be reduced as we evolve through our experience of life. This happens automatically as does all the activity of mind. Once we understand the purpose and function of our mind and its child Ego we do not have to eliminate either but can simply leave it do its thing. It is automatically kept under review.

The idea that ego needs purifying and the mind quitening will be because that is what mind has come up with in response to the particular details of the rejection experienced by the organism it serves. It is no better or worse that any other solution because each solution relates to the particular context of the organism concerned. Mind will put in place whatever eliefs are necessary to maintain its Ego construction.

This need for protection is why the mind will not allow itself to be undermined but will present as undermined if that is what is required for its survival. Taking on the mind is always a losing battle. Ironically it will drive you mad or kill you as a last resort to stop itself being undermined because it thinks, quite rightly, that you cannot survive without it.

What you think you see as the appearance of mind overcome is a construction of mind! It is far too clever to allow the Ego it has created to be successful in overcoming it

Yes one can imagine a scenario in which mind no longer has to maintain the character (ego). as a defense against rejection. In that scenario rejection would no longer cause the organism any discomfort whatsoever so the defense would no longer be required. In classic non dual terms there would be non-one there.The organism would then present only as that, a happening organism with no filter of character whatsoever. (and declare that openly as the great masters do). Exactly as it would have been had no ego been constructed in the first place.

It would be what we call Liberation but specific about what that liberation was from, namely the need to present as a separate person/character or at least a full awareness of what that character is/was. In fact that full awareness is probably what triggers the Liberation!!!

For that state to be described as Enlightenment, the embodiment of the concept of Oneness, would be correct without the filter of a defensive construction of character. It is all the unique constructions of ego that make us feel and see ourselves as sepatate from each other. It gives an interesting insight into Nisargaddata's beautiful statement :-

"Knowing you are nothing is wisdom, knowing you are everything is love".
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  #7  
Old 21-09-2017, 02:31 AM
Iamit Iamit is offline
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Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: West Wales. u.k
Posts: 478
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by God-Like
In a way your personalising the mind and suggesting the mind has an agenda to keep you within / of it .

I see the mind perhaps differently from most in that it is the environment for one to experience the mind-body experience .

The mind in that respect is impartial to whether you can transcend it or not or become trapped within it's fields of supposed influence .

Is it the mind's fault that one can be swayed by the sense of one's ego? I say not .


x daz x

Yes mind is not concerned about ego's attempt to undermine it because it will simply not allow that to happen.The purpose of mind as our protector reamins constant.

What I'm suggesting is that each organism has its own mind as the protector of that organism in terms of providing solutions to discomfort. Do we not know from our own experience that we have that operating? Mind in this sense is defined as the activity of the brain.

That the child ego gets into wanting to usurp the parent mind by quitening it, is ego with inflated ideas of its own importance. A defense gone haywire. Mind will not allow this to happen and will, as a last resort, destroy the ego rather than allow itself to be undermined in that way. Our mental hospitals are full of those whose idea of self/character has disintegrated.
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  #8  
Old 21-09-2017, 07:59 AM
God-Like God-Like is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by naturesflow
'
Hey daz.

Would an open mind have an agenda of itself or more an awareness inclusive of the mind/body/spirit? In this way what leads, is a more aware connection from within as a "whole being" as I see it. In some ways the mind is working in harmonized "emptiness" but open, in this way, it is more a vessel of open flow awareness without attachment. So the transcending point is really being open more holistically from your whole being, so there is a more inclusive movement or response in this way. Of course how you determine your own movements will be from the point of your own connection in yourself. Unless of course you can see more beyond that point before your being this..

Hey :)

The mind cannot be open or closed or have an agenda of itself . Tis what you are of the mind that can be open or closed or have an agenda .

There can be emptiness of the mind because one is of the mind not engaging in thought or one has transcended the intellectual fields beyond any self reflection .

You suggesting that it is more a vessel of open flow awareness without attachment is more in line with what I have said .


x daz x
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  #9  
Old 21-09-2017, 08:03 AM
God-Like God-Like is offline
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Originally Posted by Iamit
Yes mind is not concerned about ego's attempt to undermine it because it will simply not allow that to happen.

The mind cannot do anything . The mind doesn't constrain you or keep you in a specific state of ego, just like the beer you drink doesn't keep you addicted to it .

It is you that is addicted to the beer, it is you that is constricted within mind .


x daz x
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  #10  
Old 21-09-2017, 10:29 AM
naturesflow naturesflow is offline
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Originally Posted by God-Like
Hey :)

The mind cannot be open or closed or have an agenda of itself . Tis what you are of the mind that can be open or closed or have an agenda .

There can be emptiness of the mind because one is of the mind not engaging in thought or one has transcended the intellectual fields beyond any self reflection .

You suggesting that it is more a vessel of open flow awareness without attachment is more in line with what I have said .


x daz x

That makes sense now. thanks.
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