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Go Back   Spiritual Forums > Spirituality & Beliefs > Affirmations > Manifesting, Creating, & The Law of Attraction

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  #11  
Old 05-04-2017, 11:45 PM
SaturninePluto SaturninePluto is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lorelyen
Most of this seems about acquisition which is nice if you want to transfer the contents of your local mall to your home but hardly spiritual refinement. Acquisition and wealth using occult techniques (of which LOA is a pale shadow) were often the topics of black magic(k)ians back in the day. A form of spirituality? Sure, but it does tie you to the earth
It becomes spiritual when individuals realize they are capable of changing their lives, and when they realize they have a choice to feel good instead of bad. Also instead of complaining and finding fault with our problems it gives incentive to take a more positive perspective and to turn the tables and work out the problem and work on a problem to improve oneself. It is not merely about I want this product. Many use it in according with wanting for others and wanting good for others. Sort of how prayer works. In that sense it becomes spiritual. Also using something to improve oneself in some way is not lazy. Taking a negative feeling and choosing instead to come at this feeling with more of a sense of positivism is not lazy. It requires an amount and a fairly good amount of work to change negative thought habits and patterns. This sense of Loa is not lazy. Attracting material things also is not lazy as a lot of it requires action. It requires one to seek out ways to acquire said thing whatever it is, those who simply want something and wish for it are at a place for wanting and wishing something, those whom actively state what it is or want and then proceed to find ways of achieving it and act to achieve are not lazy. It requires one to act. Sitting there thinking about it and getting it would seem lazy but it truly isn't as it requires putting time, effort and energy into a thought. I hope I explained that right. Also thinking positive and trying to atrract good to oneself is neither black magic or selfish . Those who claim to be spiritual and focus solely on that, and actually deny the earth they walk and the physical realm, and the fact that we as people live here on Earth. Need food and shelter and luxuries in life are living in a fool's paradise. Imo. This world is a very real place with very real problems and very real hardships. Many go through their days and weeks working yes working for a selfish unethical company of some type or sort grinding their hides of week in and week out for a small paycheck and bills to pay and not very much to look forward to day after day after day. And you know? One thing that gives some comfort just happens to be a positive belief that their work paid off. That there is some force out there for them and not against them, so they happen to get something they really wanted and needed at the time if only to give them a faith that there is good out there and that their work by some way means something. They feel they are deserving of having something they love and enjoy, and by human very human stand points they do. I do not see how something meant to be positive and a positive look at the material world a more positive outlook of the material world, and yes it is material what do you think form is made from? Energy? This is true but also form takes physical qualities. So what do we have, giving to give and giving back to others and gratitude for that which we as people do have. Looking at things from a perspective of feeling good and happy, showing a pay off for the hard work physical and spiritual people do every day over and over and over in drudgery, helping others, helping others when feeling good in a place of feeling positive about it, manifesting one's hopes and dreams and gaining confidence bit by bit because of this and the realization one does not have to take a back seat in their life and let the dice role... and on and on. I am sorry, but these and healthy thoughts like this bother you? Feeling good. What is not spiritual about this? Being a positive person, this is not spiritual? I personally never set out on my spiritual path expecting misery and to suffer. If God expects me to do his work for him. I expect to have good in my life, yes even if it means I happened to come across a couple rooster wall art prints today and have been thinking about how much I love roosters in my space and having a couple more wouldn't bother me. Guess what? I feel very good about it too. Yep, if God expects me to help countless people in my life often enough times with no thanks or not even an acknowledgement or glance from others sometimes then yes, yes I expect a manifested pay out in return. Also a raise.

Please also try and realize there is no disrespect intended in my post what so ever. I only write to give another view.
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  #12  
Old 06-04-2017, 08:52 AM
Lorelyen Lorelyen is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SaturninePluto
It becomes spiritual when individuals realize they are capable of changing their lives, and when they realize they have a choice to feel good instead of bad. Also instead of complaining and finding fault with our problems it gives incentive to take a more positive perspective and to turn the tables and work out the problem and work on a problem to improve oneself. It is not merely about I want this product. Many use it in according with wanting for others and wanting good for others. Sort of how prayer works. In that sense it becomes spiritual. Also using something to improve oneself in some way is not lazy. Taking a negative feeling and choosing instead to come at this feeling with more of a sense of positivism is not lazy. It requires an amount and a fairly good amount of work to change negative thought habits and patterns. This sense of Loa is not lazy. Attracting material things also is not lazy as a lot of it requires action. It requires one to seek out ways to acquire said thing whatever it is, those who simply want something and wish for it are at a place for wanting and wishing something, those whom actively state what it is or want and then proceed to find ways of achieving it and act to achieve are not lazy. It requires one to act. Sitting there thinking about it and getting it would seem lazy but it truly isn't as it requires putting time, effort and energy into a thought. I hope I explained that right. Also thinking positive and trying to atrract good to oneself is neither black magic or selfish . Those who claim to be spiritual and focus solely on that, and actually deny the earth they walk and the physical realm, and the fact that we as people live here on Earth. Need food and shelter and luxuries in life are living in a fool's paradise. Imo. This world is a very real place with very real problems and very real hardships. Many go through their days and weeks working yes working for a selfish unethical company of some type or sort grinding their hides of week in and week out for a small paycheck and bills to pay and not very much to look forward to day after day after day. And you know? One thing that gives some comfort just happens to be a positive belief that their work paid off. That there is some force out there for them and not against them, so they happen to get something they really wanted and needed at the time if only to give them a faith that there is good out there and that their work by some way means something. They feel they are deserving of having something they love and enjoy, and by human very human stand points they do. I do not see how something meant to be positive and a positive look at the material world a more positive outlook of the material world, and yes it is material what do you think form is made from? Energy? This is true but also form takes physical qualities. So what do we have, giving to give and giving back to others and gratitude for that which we as people do have. Looking at things from a perspective of feeling good and happy, showing a pay off for the hard work physical and spiritual people do every day over and over and over in drudgery, helping others, helping others when feeling good in a place of feeling positive about it, manifesting one's hopes and dreams and gaining confidence bit by bit because of this and the realization one does not have to take a back seat in their life and let the dice role... and on and on. I am sorry, but these and healthy thoughts like this bother you? Feeling good. What is not spiritual about this? Being a positive person, this is not spiritual? I personally never set out on my spiritual path expecting misery and to suffer. If God expects me to do his work for him. I expect to have good in my life, yes even if it means I happened to come across a couple rooster wall art prints today and have been thinking about how much I love roosters in my space and having a couple more wouldn't bother me. Guess what? I feel very good about it too. Yep, if God expects me to help countless people in my life often enough times with no thanks or not even an acknowledgement or glance from others sometimes then yes, yes I expect a manifested pay out in return. Also a raise.

Please also try and realize there is no disrespect intended in my post what so ever. I only write to give another view.
I'll repeat my previous post. I was referring to the following clause of the original post.
Quote:
3. Surround Yourself With The Things You Desire

You maybe asking, how can I surround myself with the things that I want if I don’t have it? It may not be yours at the moment but you can borrow, you can visit, above all you can place yourself in the environment and among the people who are closely link to the things you desire. The successful application of the law of attraction depends on you already being in that energy of what you want. It is up to you to create the state that you want to attract and you do so by being among the things that you want until it is fully yours. The law of attraction will give you quite easily what you bring into your focus, whether you are speaking of it or observing it. You get more of what you surround yourself with.
which, as I interpreted it, was about acquisition of earthly stuff. "borrow......to the things you desire.... the state that you want to attract and you do so by being among the things that you want until it is fully yours...."
but the exhortation didn't quite make sense throughout, hence "interpretation". There were grammatical ambiguities that allowed different interpretations.

However, on my occasional visits here I read many posts about bringing abundance on oneself and silently ask an abundance of what? Abundance has a mundane meaning and on looking at posts closely, they often extend into this arena - earthly wealth and goods. There's a popular poster on this forum who rightly thinks there's no shame whatever in such a pursuit. There's nothing wrong in the acquisition of earthly goods except, like I said, it tends to tie one to the material earth. Fine by me. It could also mean an abundance of spiritual wealth (if that's possible) but would pose a very awkward question about the process....which brings me to the closing remarks in that previous post.

But like I say, it's an interpretation.

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  #13  
Old 17-05-2017, 08:52 PM
jro5139 jro5139 is offline
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[quote=Joyce]
Quote:
[b]I'm going to comment on pretty much everything that's been said above, and chose this one to use for quotes. Thanks jre5139, but I believe ulterior motives carry their own energy different from true intention and whatever that is is going to attract, for our higher (the unknown) good. I also don't believe motives are even connected with intuition, but what do I know.

llp6185 and Aube Borealis, your points for attraction (for good) are certainly giving you a faaar better chance of attracting good. Yet Lorelyen believes this is all for acquisition, not spiritual alignment blabla as if you (she)doesn't get something wanted there's reason to be bitter. Small thinking and not sounding too spiritually minded to me in my humble opinion
[b]
Always conswquesces, and to me it sounds as if your first statements are correct, yet then where witchcraft if concerned, it sounds to me (messing with another's free will) as if you're mixing apples and oranges so to say. In other words, trying to understand the blending of someone else's energy (freewill, intentions . . )with our own . . can't be explained. Black magic, or whatever one calls messing on the dark-side certainly is never positive or good IMO!!!,
[/COLORLorelyen, I believe there's a lot more to your perception of this law than you're telling, or not telling I am not trying to be confrontational, I just believe it's better to thoroughly understand.

TechnicGeek: I watched, stopped, wrote, watched . . the YTube video by Miss Teal. Wow, she's got some agenda.

I don't know who she thinks she is, but her video seemed really over the top with her bias projecting her great wisdom or awareness. She speaks as if she IS talking to ones with "elementary understanding" and she's attempting to foster HER agenda, which is who cares.

She has colored this law of attraction into complication & confusion. Humans need a deeper understanding (spiritual wisdom?) of this law in order not to believe they'll get everything their little heart desires. This is what the movie, THE SECRET, attempted. Yes, the influences of this great mystery of life everyone wants to EXPLAIN are ever present, but for her to say "F--k the LOA", is her agenda, not humanity's. Miss Teal speak as if she's back 11 years ago. Wake up beautiful Ms Teal ~ gather in your newbies before they catch on while they're becoming better people.

I was surprised to see the animation parts, in that video, were seemingly done by the same that did Spirit Science - who knows.

Well, there's Joyce's $2 worth (long not necessarily in value )


No problem, glad I could provide content... your post leads me to a few questions...
So you talk of intention vs ulterior motives, could you expand on this and how it affects the LOA? I think this is the part that trips me up.
What do you mean by ulterior motives? Ok, I have watched certain spiritual leaders/ teachers or maybe a few that were not particularly spiritual but that taught about the LOA, and they claim they can manifest stuff just because they want it at that time. It's more than Teal Swan (I will get back to her in a moment), there were others. There was a guy, I will have to look for him, his name was Steve something and he was not particularly spiritual but he taught the LOA and he said he can manifest anything he wants. For example, he says he can manifest coins on the ground and so can his kid (he had taught how to do this). Ok, so his intentions are just that he wants or needs some money, right? Is that an acceptable intention? Because, obviously, it works for him.
It seems less than pure in some way, it is not a need, just a want for him but he can do it. So I'm curious to understand where the line is drawn. Also, how to manifest extra money in particular when I need it. I also wonder how the heck you would teach this to a kid, but that could just be because I am thinking of my kids, vs other peoples lol. Anyway, I can look for his full name if it helps, I'm just curious about what intentions work and what does not and why certain people can manifest random, un-needs and other people can hardly manifest needs. I am aware of clearing blocks and all that, I mean, I would like to understand it past that as I feel my blocks are for the most part, good and clear.

I believe though, there has been somewhat of a designated path in my life and that has something to do with what can happen as far as manifesting stuff. I realize this isn't spiritual but I'm still interested as it is useful.

Now on to Teal Swan, I am glad she came up. I used to like her and she was one of the first people I heard talk about the LOA, I'm interested to know more of your opinion on her, mine has changed a lot.
I watched a body language expert's opinion of her and that is when I really started to doubt her, at least her story she tells of her childhood. The body lang expert just had a lot of good points and I had to agree that her story of her childhood is sounding more and more shady the more I hear about it. At this point, I don't really believe her childhood story too much and makes me wonder what else she lies about. Although if she gets a lot of her information from reading lots of books (as the girl would lived with her claimed) than some of it, in and of itself, could still be useful to some people. So that's not to say every message is useless, but I don't want to follow a source I don't trust.

So thank you for the reply as I just want to understand it all lol
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  #14  
Old 17-05-2017, 09:10 PM
jro5139 jro5139 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lorelyen
I'll repeat my previous post. I was referring to the following clause of the original post.

which, as I interpreted it, was about acquisition of earthly stuff. "borrow......to the things you desire.... the state that you want to attract and you do so by being among the things that you want until it is fully yours...."
but the exhortation didn't quite make sense throughout, hence "interpretation". There were grammatical ambiguities that allowed different interpretations.

However, on my occasional visits here I read many posts about bringing abundance on oneself and silently ask an abundance of what? Abundance has a mundane meaning and on looking at posts closely, they often extend into this arena - earthly wealth and goods. There's a popular poster on this forum who rightly thinks there's no shame whatever in such a pursuit. There's nothing wrong in the acquisition of earthly goods except, like I said, it tends to tie one to the material earth. Fine by me. It could also mean an abundance of spiritual wealth (if that's possible) but would pose a very awkward question about the process....which brings me to the closing remarks in that previous post.

But like I say, it's an interpretation.



What do you mean it ties you to the earth? Do you mean with ether type chords, or your ether body, or what, exactly do you mean?
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  #15  
Old 18-05-2017, 08:15 AM
Lorelyen Lorelyen is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jro5139
What do you mean it ties you to the earth? Do you mean with ether type chords, or your ether body, or what, exactly do you mean?

I hoped my comment explained but since it doesn’t all I can offer is that acquisitiveness tends to make people put their faith and trust in material goods, what wealth can buy, and shields them from the chance to look at the riches in themselves as spirit, the value of experiences, the understanding of their relationships with material goods (what they REALLY mean to the them); and the value of those (people) and nature around them on the mundane, what they bring to your life and what you take to theirs that you can’t measure materially – trust, open-heartedness, reliability, steadfastness, appreciation, willingness to share what you have without depriving yourself.

Abundance (of material wealth) tends to inspire fear of unknowns – something religion has got away with since the beginnings. (You can’t promote religious ideologies without a material world against which to offset them so it would seem.) Acquisitive people are often afraid to die (in part because of the possible physical pain but also) because they’re forced to leave behind all they’ve trusted in about their lives – their “treasured possessions” and what they symbolise. They no longer control. They don’t want to leave the physical earth.

Does that help? There are no physical cords, no mystique about it. People fritter their lives accumulating wealth then at the end wonder what it was all really about!

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  #16  
Old 18-05-2017, 11:09 AM
jro5139 jro5139 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lorelyen
I hoped my comment explained but since it doesn’t all I can offer is that acquisitiveness tends to make people put their faith and trust in material goods, what wealth can buy, and shields them from the chance to look at the riches in themselves as spirit, the value of experiences, the understanding of their relationships with material goods (what they REALLY mean to the them); and the value of those (people) and nature around them on the mundane, what they bring to your life and what you take to theirs that you can’t measure materially – trust, open-heartedness, reliability, steadfastness, appreciation, willingness to share what you have without depriving yourself.

Abundance (of material wealth) tends to inspire fear of unknowns – something religion has got away with since the beginnings. (You can’t promote religious ideologies without a material world against which to offset them so it would seem.) Acquisitive people are often afraid to die (in part because of the possible physical pain but also) because they’re forced to leave behind all they’ve trusted in about their lives – their “treasured possessions” and what they symbolise. They no longer control. They don’t want to leave the physical earth.

Does that help? There are no physical cords, no mystique about it. People fritter their lives accumulating wealth then at the end wonder what it was all really about!


Yes, that clears it up. I agree about being materialistic, but when I learned about the LOA it told me that someone can materialize anything they want (within reason) and that would include friends, jobs, love...So more than just material wealth. And I'm not talking about stuff that is unrealistic to ones life. So for example, I have seen posts on this board where people claim they materialized a boyfriend. Just as an example of something not material.

But my issue is, why does it work sometimes and not nearly all the time, or for some people but not others? And I'm not talking about one thing over another, but anything one might want to materialize. Because it is described as a law, that leads me to believe it should work nearly always (I don't say always because there are always exceptions). But still, a "law" should be something one can depend on to be constant, but my experience with it was never constant. Maybe it's just me and I'm a **** poor materializer, but it's not from not clearing blocks and it's not from not doing all the other suggestions on LOA.
Then I read some other opinions from people on this board that are wise, and they say things like, it has to be meant to be, and it also involves the needs of others and this is all fine and makes sense, but my issue is....This sounds less to me like some special "law of attraction" and more like Life.
Life, the way it is and always has been. Nothing special or different about it. Just life, the way it has always worked. Really more of a crapshoot.
And I now think the fault of my dissolution with the LOA may be that I had faulty teachers from the beginning, that led me to believe it was something it wasn't. Like a magical cure that, if you follow the instructions, will allow you to bring to yourself anything and everything you want. Which obviously, didn't work. So while when I first discovered the LOA I found it to be very empowering, after the dissolution of trying to practice it, it then became very not empowering.
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  #17  
Old 18-05-2017, 04:46 PM
Lorelyen Lorelyen is offline
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I also think it is empowering in a kind of way. At least it tells someone that if they can't be optimistic they won't attract optimistic people/situations. One has to believe in oneself and ways and means to do that aren't always spelled out in any of the texts I've read. Difficult, yes, because the authors aren't the actual people they're addressing and a one-size-fits-all solution doesn't work with spirituality (as religions have found out).

I believe as a law it's flawed. Like only attracts like in the grossest sense like in the optimism/pessimism thing. Love might attract love except...can one "be" love enough to attract it. Love (so I read here often enough) is an etheric energy but it must also be a 'state of being' to comply with the like attracts like law. How does one achieve that state of being? The nearest I can think is someone is at peace, optimistic, emotionally balanced (between pure, intuitive emotional reaction, and intellect) and self-motivating to enjoy all they must do - work, hobbies, spiritual observances etc. One can project what one believes love to be but whether it'll attract love in an identical form (i.e. like=like) is questionable because our individual concepts of love are unique and very different.

Like attracting like seems very rare in the physical world and since our manifesting arises from and is usually about the physical world I can't reckon on the principle ceasing to exist with LOA. In the real world like usually attracts an opposite or is drawn to a void.

Just my reckoning but those who seem more successful at it aren't practicing it at all. They're affirming. They've fixed their focus on something and (properly practiced) those affirmations are guiding their behaviour toward the target. Successful people in the commercial world do this naturally. They stack the odds in ways subtle and otherwise to achieve. Think of someone like Donald Trump. He didn't get where he did (with his huge and rather beautiful building in NY) by buying a book on LOA (or equivalent). He had an aim and single-mindedly pursued it. His affirmation at each stage was "I'm going to do it." "I'm going to get a good deal."

Doesn't matter whether you like Trump or not the principle holds good. Focus, affirm, don't look for results but acknowledge them when they appear and move to the next stage.

I won't self-quote aside from saying that I think I've been fairly successful in my aims. I'm no Trump but a spiritual leaning led to acceptance and use of advice from successful people and observation, all adding up to the same thing. One can buy as many books or teachers as one likes but if the focus and motivation aren't there, including timescales, nothing can proceed. You know what I reckon? Too many people want LOA results without doing any work. Miracles do happen, sure, but most "getting what you want" takes work.

Also, too many people are selling books with wonderful intentions. The road to hell is paved with wonderful intentions. So disappointment/disillusion is often the result. The only teachers of any spiritual use are those who can help us find the signposts, not tell us what we should be doing or which route to take.

But like I say, these are just my views. If someone wants something big then they might have to start in small, manageable stages. Defining what they want and an initial guess at those stages do seem to yield better results.

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Old 18-05-2017, 07:09 PM
jro5139 jro5139 is offline
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You hit on my problem exactly, I spent so many years of putting enomerous effort into things and seeing little to no results. School, jobs that turned out to be a waste of time, LOA, that now, I just refuse to do it anymore. I just refuse to put an enormous amount of work or energy into something unless I KNOW the results will equal the effort. I just can't do that anymore and with the LOA I just saw too many times, no result. I spent years believing I would have results with things and in the end, nothing. So now, to turn around and trust something with no guarantee of results, I just can't do it anymore.

Another thing I found was when I was listening to these spiritual teachers, their messages always made me feel good for a while, but they always lacked practical advice, so in the long run, nothing ever changed. Maybe what I needed was a more practical how-to book, instead of a vague spiritual message.

I don't know about attracting love by being love, I felt like I was in a good place but that doesn't cause the rest of the world to be, and I'm finding it a struggle to deal with the energy of others at times when it's overtly negative. But within self, I am good.
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Old 25-05-2017, 05:47 AM
girlsearching girlsearching is offline
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Thanks for the helpful tips on using The Law of Attraction. I need to start applying to my life because I tend to be self doubtful .
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  #20  
Old 03-07-2017, 02:18 PM
positivity_ftw positivity_ftw is offline
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Very nice thread, some very nice LOA concepts here. thanks
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