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Go Back   Spiritual Forums > Spirituality & Beliefs > Death & The Afterlife

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  #11  
Old 03-02-2017, 03:01 AM
jimrich jimrich is offline
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There is a 'trick' to working with or sitting with someone in grief. It's basically about how to calm down and LET the Griever vent or express (cry, rage, laugh, etc). It takes guts to allow someone to have their feelings WITHOUT intruding by offering: tissues, advice, a lecture, talking, consoling, pats on their back, and subtly trying to STOP the Griever from VENTING. I've seen it over and over at sharing meetings when someone breaks down and starts weeping and it's happened A LOT to me!
Many people carry hidden emotional pains, so open expressions of painful feelings BOTHERS them who are secretly in pain and they will do whatever they can to STOP (fix) the weeping or grieving person.
Just sitting there and quietly LISTENING TO the Griever is good enough but very few can do that - not even some Counselors and Professionals! These "Professionals" seem to believe that it's their DUTY to "cheer up" a Griever but they are really just trying to protect their own unhealed grief from being TRIGGERED by the Griever!
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  #12  
Old 03-02-2017, 06:47 AM
Tricia Tricia is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jimrich
My experience is that my late wife is not only over in the Afterlife now but she is quite often right here with me and she shows up in many subtle and simetimes blatant ways, especially in dreams so I rarely have that painful "missing" her feelings since she is not missing at all. If I were you, I'd go see a psychic or medium and allow your mother to come to you and show you that she is not "missing" and is right there with you in all kinds of ways and then you might FEEL or notice her around you which could reduce the painful sense that she is "missing" or not there. I feel so good and happy when my late wife is here, which is most of the time, so I have no need to get sad, lonely and "miss" her. I am not psychic, although she was/is, but I do "experience" her presence and it doesn't matter to me if it's only my imagination, memories or foolishness so long as I KNOW that she is alive and well and is still right here except that it's a slightly different dimension or realm. For her, coming to me is easy but I cannot to into her realm just yet unless I learn to do it which is why I mentioned a medium or psychic who can access that realm and bring your mother into the dialogue or meeting. My late wife brought my (dead) mother her and did that for many of her grieving clients so it's not so strange and perfectly normal for those over in the Afterlife.
Again, know that they are still here and having contact with them can lower the sadness and grief because they are still here with us and not GONE away as we believe. This same thing can apply to "lost" pets who are still here with us but we cannot or will not notice and accept them so we HURT over apparently losing them when the truth is that we have NOT lost them.
James Van Praagh can say this better than me. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y4wqVUBfRtU
Your mother is very eager to tell you that she is still there with you whenever you are ready to hear and feel her!


Yes, I do understand what you are saying. I know she is around me, I've seen signs. A short time after she crossed over, I asked she give me a sign. That evening she did (profile photo) there have been other signs also.
My mother was a medium, so I basically grew up around mediumship. Knowing that there is life after death is comforting to say the least :)
Despite our loved ones being with us, doesn't take away the fact that their physical presence is dearly missed.
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  #13  
Old 03-02-2017, 04:11 PM
jimrich jimrich is offline
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Angel1

Quote:
Originally Posted by mihael_11
Wondering about what you, who dealing with grief, are actually lacking.

I'd say you are lacking: self love, self respect, self worth, self esteem and some other self valuing elements now that the thing or person you DEPENDED ON for emotional support and LOVE is gone. So, when something "important" is missing, you are left to feel: empty, frightened, lonely, unsafe, insecure, unloved, unwanted, deprived and left with no reason to "go on" without the SIGNIFICANT support of a spouse, parent, sibling, friend, pet, etc. In short, you are lacking a self reliant and loving ego/self now that your "significant other" is gone! You are left Empty Handed! It's a form of Codependency in which the one left behind once DEPENDED on the one or thing that is now gone and that DEPENDENCY can be painful when the thing you DEPENDED ON is taken away - like kicking a crutch out from under a cripple!
The only solution to painful Codependency is SELF RESPECT or Inter-dependency - a much healthier state of mind than sad and sorry DEPENDENCY! Babies and little kids are naturally DEPENDENT but are trained as soon as possible to stand on their own two feet and lovingly take charge of their own lives, otherwise, they will be sad and sorry DEPENDENTS for the rest of their life.

Quote:
You get connected to someone and have an experiences together until seperated... What is this, that then misses?
I'd say it the Dependent/Needy Ego that "misses" something or someone because it was not taught to stand on it's own two feet with love and respect.

Quote:
My experience is, that always keep your emotions checked.
By that, I assume you mean to keep your emotions in a healthy, balanced and self-reliant state so you are not devastated if and when something important is missing such as a friend, parent, spouse, pet, etc.

Quote:
Maybe you are talking to part of her, that is still with you?
They are ALWAYS still with us but many of us are so fragile, needy and DEPENDENT that we are in pain, misery and sorrow WITHOUT the emotional support of the missing one UNLESS they can be back here again and SUPPORTING our fragile, needy egos like before the loss.
If and when I "miss' my late wife, it is ALWAYS due to my ongoing egoic needs for her emotional/physical SUPPORT - much like a crutch provides! I feel less and less PAIN as I take responsibility for my own egoic needs and life. I need to depend on and trust ME from now on! I am getting used to being my own boss, making my own decisions and living my own life now as a single INTERDEPENDENT dude and, should I find another partner, I will do my very best NOT TO become Codependent again and loose myself in the union!!!!
If this seems harsh and heartless for the Grievers out there, I apologize but this is my REALITY so take what you want and leave the rest.
Good luck getting over your sad, lonely and painful EGOIC NEEDS now that your crutch is gone. My crutch is gone and now it's my duty to stand up and walk on my own two feet!
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  #14  
Old 03-02-2017, 04:37 PM
mihael_11 mihael_11 is offline
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Haha, very nice. I find this true. Dependency is the reason for all this. For me they said, i am very self standing, i find this important for me.

So, you are aware of what is going on, keep the good work in further developing. No need to be afraid on your own, it is possible. When i find myself a partner, it will be two self standing peoples together for other reasons to support one other too deep, better to remind one another and guide. I don't see this dependancy as healthy but it is path that serves for some different reasons. What can you learn from it?
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  #15  
Old 04-02-2017, 03:38 AM
shoresh shoresh is offline
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Jim, thank you for sharing your experiences with your wife. I know Elisabeth Kubler-Ross had workshops while she was alive called Life Death and Transition. Anger release was covered. I love her work, and one of her trained counselors, Carol Kearns, helped me after the loss of my beloved son.
My own point of view, I don't think there are necessarily levels as much as different vibrational realities...you tune into them...
Tricia, nice picture of the spirit energy...
Finally, you may find this piece by Alan Wolfelt to be of help --
I found this article from Dr. Alan Wolfelt to be very helpful, especially in the beginning:
*
Companioning the Bereaved*from Dr. Alan Wolfelt
*
During this time, while many have been helpful, there are always those who just don't know how to respond, or ignore you because they can't deal with it or worse start telling you how to manage your grief...and they don't have a clue...

The following advice on how to help someone in grief by Dr. Alan Wolfelt really spoke to me on how to help those of us in deep mourning....especially the listening of stories, told and retold...

His idea of truly being a companion to those in grief is what I have needed in my own journey through losing now my second son....

" To companion our fellow human beings means to witness and learn as opposed to playing the 'scientific expert.' My 11 tenets of companioning the bereaved are as follows:
Companioning is about honoring the spirit; it is not about focusing on intellect.
Companioning is about curiosity; it is not about expertise.
Companioning is about learning from others, it is not about teaching.
Companioning is about walking alongside; it is not about leading or being led.
Companioning is about being still; it is not about frantic movement forward.
Companioning is about discovering the gifts of sacred silence it is not about a filling every painful moment with talk.
Companioning is about listening with the heart. It is not about analyzing with the head.
Companioning is about bearing witness to the struggles of others; it is not about judging or directing those struggles.
Companioning is about being present to another person’s pain; it is not about taking away or relieving the pain.
Companioning is about respecting disorder and confusion; it is not about imposing order and logic.
Companioning is about going to the wilderness of the soul with another human being; it is not about thinking you are responsible for finding the way out.
You’ll note that a central role of the companion to the mourner is related to the art of honoring stories and being taught by the true expert—which is the person going through the experience.

Yes, I realize that the art of honoring stories sounds soft to scientists, but the good news is that it seems to work, and I plan to keep on teaching about the long-held understanding that telling and re-telling personal stories of love and loss are essential elements of supporting people in grief."
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  #16  
Old 04-02-2017, 04:51 AM
jimrich jimrich is offline
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When I first went into support groups and encountered some weeping Survivors, I had a deep need to cry also and at first believed that I was somehow FEELING their feelings. I was a little embarrassed at their open weeping and held onto my feelings as much as possible. But after a while and some education in the groups, I came to realize that my need to weep was coming form my own repressed and painful well of unhealed grief so I, like some of the others, began to LET my tears come out - sometimes in torrents! It amazed me to see how many Survivors and others resented and resisted my grief and tears but, once I decided I had a right to cry, nobody could stop or SHAME me for weeping in their presence.
My biggest surprise was to realize that the folks who resented or resisted my tears were AFRAID that I would trigger their carefully held in and protected pain and tears and might force them to begin SHAMEFULLY WEEPING too. They didn't want to feel the Shame of openly crying for "no good reason" and feared the open weeping of others that might break them down and get them crying too. What a shock!
I had the silly idea that I was hurting and offending others when it was their own bottled up pain and grief that was hurting them - NOT ME! Once I realized that they were actually hurting them selves and tying to punish or STOP me, my tears flowed much better and freer until most of it is gone now.
Since my late wife crossed over, I've had a few grief attacks and my tears are allowed to come out now without any guilt or fear of the bad reactions from others.
It's weird that our culture has not taught us how to process pain and grief in a healthy and reasonable way! I guess we are all still carrying those STOIC Pioneer attitudes and survival beliefs about BEING TOUGH and in control. How sad!
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  #17  
Old 04-02-2017, 07:32 PM
7luminaries 7luminaries is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jimrich
There is a 'trick' to working with or sitting with someone in grief. It's basically about how to calm down and LET the Griever vent or express (cry, rage, laugh, etc). It takes guts to allow someone to have their feelings WITHOUT intruding by offering: tissues, advice, a lecture, talking, consoling, pats on their back, and subtly trying to STOP the Griever from VENTING. I've seen it over and over at sharing meetings when someone breaks down and starts weeping and it's happened A LOT to me!
Many people carry hidden emotional pains, so open expressions of painful feelings BOTHERS them who are secretly in pain and they will do whatever they can to STOP (fix) the weeping or grieving person.
Just sitting there and quietly LISTENING TO the Griever is good enough but very few can do that - not even some Counselors and Professionals! These "Professionals" seem to believe that it's their DUTY to "cheer up" a Griever but they are really just trying to protect their own unhealed grief from being TRIGGERED by the Griever!

You're right...the tissue might be ok (or welcome!) but only if it's not intrusive. It is triggering.
And often ( not always but if they're ok with it), a gentle hand on the shoulder or even a hug is far better than anything we could say.

Peace & blessings
7L
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Bound by conventions, people tend to reach for what is easy.

Here we must be unafraid of what is difficult.

For all living beings in nature must unfold in their particular way

and become themselves despite all opposition.

-- Rainer Maria Rilke
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  #18  
Old 10-02-2017, 10:12 AM
jimrich jimrich is offline
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Lately, I've kept a few note pads around here to jot down things that come from my late wife or that I want to send to her. It's fun to give and get short little, happy, feelings messages to and from the Afterlife and pretty much confirms that "they" are still alive and well over in that realm. I may not do this jotting down notes for the rest of my life but it's real nice for now and I can speak to my late wife anywhere and anytime with or without a note pad.
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  #19  
Old 18-02-2017, 05:36 PM
7luminaries 7luminaries is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jimrich
Lately, I've kept a few note pads around here to jot down things that come from my late wife or that I want to send to her. It's fun to give and get short little, happy, feelings messages to and from the Afterlife and pretty much confirms that "they" are still alive and well over in that realm. I may not do this jotting down notes for the rest of my life but it's real nice for now and I can speak to my late wife anywhere and anytime with or without a note pad.

Very nice thoughts Jim, and spot on IMO

Peace & blessings,
7L
__________________
Bound by conventions, people tend to reach for what is easy.

Here we must be unafraid of what is difficult.

For all living beings in nature must unfold in their particular way

and become themselves despite all opposition.

-- Rainer Maria Rilke
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  #20  
Old 18-02-2017, 05:42 PM
shiningstars shiningstars is offline
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Agree, 7luminaries!

shiningstars
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