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Go Back   Spiritual Forums > Spirituality & Beliefs > Love & Relationships -Friends and Family

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  #21  
Old 24-02-2018, 08:17 AM
Raziel Raziel is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by angelic star
In the above statement , I talked about my friend being serious and committed, in a casual response to the OP. And my friend is a very serious and devoted girl. She is in love and the guy who married is madly in love with her. He traveled half way across the continent to marry her and spend a lifetime with her. I don't think they like the idea of a third person in the dynamic. Lots of couples don't like the idea of a third person in a dynamic up until old age. They will frown at the idea of it. It's not a new concept lol, has been going on for ages now.

I think here some people entertain the idea of being liberal, and for others to understand their 'point of view' but maybe they are only triggered by people who are devoted and faithful to each other or the concept of being faithful/ devoted to each other. They don't like the idea of commitment to one person. That is the only thing that triggers them.

That was a stone cold stunner of a good way of putting it!


The liberal minded often present themselves as breaking social norms or changing out dated notions but they fail to see that it has all been done before.

It's not new or original.

Many people do hard drugs right up until it kills them - swearing that others are just being closed minded.
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  #22  
Old 24-02-2018, 08:54 AM
angelic star angelic star is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Raziel
Many people do hard drugs right up until it kills them - swearing that others are just being closed minded.

Haha yeah, and feel no one can tell how much damage there is behind those beliefs and actions, just so no one would look down on them.
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  #23  
Old 24-02-2018, 09:01 AM
Lorelyen Lorelyen is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Raziel
Its in an earlier posting:

"Though the phrase soul mate gained steam toward the end of the twentieth century, the idea goes all the way back to Plato’s Symposium, written in 385–380 BCE.
In Symposium, when the two dialogists discuss love, Aristophanes tells Socrates that human beings used to have four arms, four legs, and two faces, and they were happy and complete. But Zeus was jealous and split them in two with his thunderbolt, and now humans spend their lives searching for their other half. This idea of an “other half” has been with us ever since.

But the phrase soul mate itself was first recorded in 1822, when the poet Samuel Taylor Coleridge wrote in a letter, “To be happy in Married Life . . . you must have a Soul-mate.”

So two halves of a whole, two halves of a union/bond.

You used a term incorrectly - no big deal

Well, you always have to consider a cultural context. We've moved on a lot since Plato's time! Nuances are lost in translation sometimes, particularly with classical ancient languages.

But I will concede. Having a soul mate takes two people.

(In part, I've given up on the word "love". It's meaningless to me - too waffly, too non-specific. It hides many lies of people's motivations. The classical view of emotions no longer works for me.)
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  #24  
Old 24-02-2018, 09:19 AM
angelic star angelic star is offline
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Sometimes if you read books on what saints or yogis said a hundred years ago, it almost feels years ahead from now already. That's because wise words are just that, they are not limited to time and come from deep set of realizations, that masses benefit from, many years. Wisdom never grows old.
If some traditional belief from ancient times was propagated by a wise man it can certainly hold value and insight.
Not all old beliefs or value systems are outdated.
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  #25  
Old 24-02-2018, 09:43 AM
Raziel Raziel is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by angelic star
Sometimes if you read books on what saints or yogis said a hundred years ago, it almost feels years ahead from now already. That's because wise words are just that, they are not limited to time and come from deep set of realizations, that masses benefit from, many years. Wisdom never grows old.
If some traditional belief from ancient times was propagated by a wise man it can certainly hold value and insight.
Not all old beliefs or value systems are outdated.

How many thousands of times has it played out before?

We've gotten to human sacrifice, inquisition, emperors marrying their horses previously but it makes you wonder the small incremental steps taken before hand.

For certain hippie culture was very much a fraud & a fad - yet its impact on individuals was/ is long lasting.
Democracy is the best thing humans have come up with to allow individuals their voice yet too many wish to burn it down & replace with ideas & systems historically proven to be unworkable.

It's great to question why things are the way they are but making up their own answers seems to be some peoples full time job.
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  #26  
Old 24-02-2018, 10:52 AM
Lorelyen Lorelyen is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Raziel

For certain hippie culture was very much a fraud & a fad - yet its impact on individuals was/ is long lasting.
I can't believe that you, declaring you come from England, could claim it a fraud. You must be very pro-establishment. It was a revolution against the austerity of the 1940s and the authoritarian parents it spawned. It HAD to be fomented by the young because they were the ones in cultural prison. Besides, it wasn't a fad, it was stamped on by the establishment (as will New Age spirituality be, when it becomes a similar threat)! Remember, "the pill" appeared in 1961. Apparently that changed things rather a lot.

I only wished I'd lived through those times. All I have on which to reflect is my parents' bound copies of most of the OZ magazines, a few books, LP record covers, photos of the contemporary styles and plenty of anecdotes.


Quote:
It's great to question why things are the way they are but making up their own answers seems to be some peoples full time job.
Quite. Get to know someone in the UK who lived through and was absorbed by the 1960s/70s.
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  #27  
Old 24-02-2018, 03:00 PM
Tortoise Walks Tortoise Walks is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Raziel
So what?

Why not be an adult & accept the term as it was meant instead of trying to undermine the bond it describes by trying to have your cake & eat it & then go back for seconds?

Having your own truth does a person no favours, it says that they cannot be incorrect as they define their own reality.

I used to use the word "approximately" wrongly - now I just don't use the stupid word.

Existing societal structures are not breaking away, that is fantasy. With the sheer amount of Muslims, Mormons etc in the world your guaranteed that a leftist utopia will never happen.

As far as I ever knew the word soul mate is used popularly (in this forum as well) with two meanings: One being the ONE as you quoted about and the other being soul group of many people who come into your life and help you grow. Just sharing how I am understanding/using the word.

The existing societal structures breaking away was in my own life/experience. Wasn't really making a claim about the whole world.

Truth or ... I have a heart center and that is how I make my choices. I do the best I can with that... it is not about being right or wrong to me... it's about what feels in alignment with my heart more than any set of words. Each moment I get to choose my direction.
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  #28  
Old 24-02-2018, 03:57 PM
Tortoise Walks Tortoise Walks is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Raziel

That's just being a cheat surely?


If its same sex & the husband doesn't mind then that's what we used to call "kinky".

Perhaps you made a mistake getting married, perhaps your more fiends now than lovers but no point claiming everyone you fancy is a soul mate.

Ever considered that neither are soul mates - that you like two different people for two different reasons?

Not Soul mates - your self convincing to justify two separate feelings.

Usually people choose which relationship they wish to continue with - your being greedy. That's your prerogative & I'm taking a factual tone not a judgmental one.


I am being greedy and a cheat because YOU think I should handle my relationships differently? Because I am brave enough to allow love into my life without resistance, share honestly with those I love even when it is hard, and it looks different than how you do it?

Why is there special permission in your rules for one form of openness but not another? Doesn't make sense to me. What if it's a matter of the husband and the wife both don't mind and both support caring, supporting connections as ways and opportunities to learn about and discover more about ourselves. We haven't even broached the gender/sexual orientation spectrum...

Marrying my husband was not a mistake. Falling in love is not a mistake. Shifting relationships is not a mistake. Nor is it greedy. To me this is all part of my path to self discovery and individuation and soul growth. And yes as I understand it I have many soulmates that enter my life at perfect timing for various reasons. Why do you take offense or care to discredit who I consider a soulmate or not? Or if I happen to share sexual energy with one or the other? The energy I'm talking about was not just lust anyway... and is not something I really have any control over...
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  #29  
Old 24-02-2018, 04:37 PM
Raziel Raziel is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lorelyen
I can't believe that you, declaring you come from England, could claim it a fraud. You must be very pro-establishment. It was a revolution against the austerity of the 1940s and the authoritarian parents it spawned. It HAD to be fomented by the young because they were the ones in cultural prison. Besides, it wasn't a fad, it was stamped on by the establishment (as will New Age spirituality be, when it becomes a similar threat)! Remember, "the pill" appeared in 1961. Apparently that changed things rather a lot.

I only wished I'd lived through those times. All I have on which to reflect is my parents' bound copies of most of the OZ magazines, a few books, LP record covers, photos of the contemporary styles and plenty of anecdotes.



Quite. Get to know someone in the UK who lived through and was absorbed by the 1960s/70s.
.
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It was a fraud,

If you don't believe me check out everyman 1978 Where Have All the Flowers Gone?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p04ch9n9

Your explanation forgets the American side of the coin also.

My parents were/are hippies - Dad is pushing 70 and still has long hair but it was a cultural "revolution" that was marketed & advertised. Hardly going to bring anything down now was it?

It's not their fault, they were naive kids but they were conned & soon turned onto other things when real life came knocking.

New age is no threat to any establishment, they had ago at the head shops because of the potency of items sold. I purchased salvia with ease for example.

Why they allow the Friday/Saturday night debacle via alcohol is beyond sense.
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Last edited by Raziel : 24-02-2018 at 05:47 PM.
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  #30  
Old 24-02-2018, 05:16 PM
Raziel Raziel is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tortoise Walks
I am being greedy and a cheat because YOU think I should handle my relationships differently? Because I am brave enough to allow love into my life without resistance, share honestly with those I love even when it is hard, and it looks different than how you do it?

Why is there special permission in your rules for one form of openness but not another? Doesn't make sense to me. What if it's a matter of the husband and the wife both don't mind and both support caring, supporting connections as ways and opportunities to learn about and discover more about ourselves. We haven't even broached the gender/sexual orientation spectrum...

Marrying my husband was not a mistake. Falling in love is not a mistake. Shifting relationships is not a mistake. Nor is it greedy. To me this is all part of my path to self discovery and individuation and soul growth. And yes as I understand it I have many soulmates that enter my life at perfect timing for various reasons. Why do you take offense or care to discredit who I consider a soulmate or not? Or if I happen to share sexual energy with one or the other? The energy I'm talking about was not just lust anyway... and is not something I really have any control over...

If a person is married, takes vows & lives a life with another its a responsibility to avoid feelings for others by giving distance. Those yearnings are for the spouse.

I already said my words were not made in judgement - just common sense.

What is the point of a marriage if you decide to include others?

It sounds as though labelling multiple soul mates absolves some responsibility.

My advice regarding the idea of & terms of use of the world "soul mate" was for the original poster & any lurkers within the thread. Just as car salesmen throw in positive ideas & wording so do those trying to justify themselves to others.

I already said that I care not for a persons choices - they are theirs - but a soul mate is classically two halves of a whole, I raised this point & sourced it for someone interested in fact over feelz.



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Last edited by Raziel : 24-02-2018 at 08:19 PM.
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