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Go Back   Spiritual Forums > Religions & Faiths > Judaism

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  #11  
Old 31-07-2016, 05:36 AM
Tom Howard Tom Howard is offline
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Originally Posted by Skull
Never mind Tom's confusion or pretensions.
Confused I may be, but never pretentious
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  #12  
Old 31-07-2016, 07:43 AM
Clear Blue Sky Clear Blue Sky is offline
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Originally Posted by Still_Waters
I can't translate Hebrew, so I didn't understand RabbiO's answer either. If you figure it out, please share.


Once I pulled my nose out the translator and dictionary, and thought with my heart through the perspective of my past experience, perhaps 'kept' and 'reckless' do mesh with this 'knowledge' that is given shown.

That stage when I reached to God and pleaded, always reaching out to grasp, and so determined, walking blind with the *?* that some firm ground would rise to take my footfalls.

Still, the junction of growth were when the blind faith walking and the true heart struggle grappled of unity.

Funnily enough, at the time the red string kept falling off my wrist, I had a beloved mixed dog who was a star in obedience, when the Israel Canaan dog had just been admitted to the American Kennel Club. Long-time friends at the club I had thought to be ethical suggested I register him *as* an Israel Canaan dog so he could compete and win prizes in the Obedience competitions. I refused. The breed has its own destiny to step into; we another, but the purported core goal/deep meaning was the same.
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  #13  
Old 31-07-2016, 03:01 PM
Still_Waters Still_Waters is offline
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Originally Posted by Clear Blue Sky
Once I pulled my nose out the translator and dictionary, and thought with my heart through the perspective of my past experience, perhaps 'kept' and 'reckless' do mesh with this 'knowledge' that is given shown.

That stage when I reached to God and pleaded, always reaching out to grasp, and so determined, walking blind with the *?* that some firm ground would rise to take my footfalls.

Still, the junction of growth were when the blind faith walking and the true heart struggle grappled of unity.

Funnily enough, at the time the red string kept falling off my wrist, I had a beloved mixed dog who was a star in obedience, when the Israel Canaan dog had just been admitted to the American Kennel Club. Long-time friends at the club I had thought to be ethical suggested I register him *as* an Israel Canaan dog so he could compete and win prizes in the Obedience competitions. I refused. The breed has its own destiny to step into; we another, but the purported core goal/deep meaning was the same.

That is beautiful, particularly the part about "walking blind with the *?* that some firm ground would rise to take my footfalls".

That sounds like true SURRENDER to me, and that is the way that I try to live --- surrendering to the divine spark inherent in all whereby the answers to all questions (*?*) are revealed. It's not in the words but in the "heart", as you duly noted.

It is wisely said that "instructions are needed only so long as one has not surrendered completely". With complete and total surrender to the divine inherent in all, books and words and lectures become unnecessary and actually superfluous other than as a common ground for communication in forums such as these.
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  #14  
Old 01-08-2016, 05:59 PM
Clear Blue Sky Clear Blue Sky is offline
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Originally Posted by Still_Waters
That is beautiful, particularly the part about "walking blind with the *?* that some firm ground would rise to take my footfalls".

That sounds like true SURRENDER to me, and that is the way that I try to live --- surrendering to the divine spark inherent in all whereby the answers to all questions (*?*) are revealed. It's not in the words but in the "heart", as you duly noted.

It is wisely said that "instructions are needed only so long as one has not surrendered completely". With complete and total surrender to the divine inherent in all, books and words and lectures become unnecessary and actually superfluous other than as a common ground for communication in forums such as these.


The *?* isn't denoting any kind of question, just when I came to it the option of words to describe what I was referring to lacked all-encompassing precision and I did not know what word to put there. Faith, audacity, foolish-wisdom, courage, surrender, humbleness, trust? boldness? challenge? stubbornness? arrogant mage pride?

By your last paragraph though looking soberly at the human condition, instruction will always be needed. I think an early mistake (?) I made was in approaching God with empathy.... the notion that if I could imagine myself walking around in God's shoes I could figure God out and then ascertain the truth and right judgment/assessment of God. Kabbalah at its start acknowledges that God is unknowable, that there are many interfaces expression of God in the world/human condition, and that the business of humans is to respond to the presence and the inter-action of those interfaces, and to know their place and path and places, and to reach. I think a person raised with a full (FULL) understanding of the Hebrew language and the true resonant full meaning of those words, who had read and learned and walked the walk and lived the life, would gain much richness from that study contemplation journey. For the outsider to that rich ancient culture perhaps as you seem to suggest it would be better served to look direct to god for other paths of understanding. But always that faith/courage/*?* that we grow toward God even knowing that ultimate knowing of God is unknowable.
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  #15  
Old 02-08-2016, 02:22 PM
Still_Waters Still_Waters is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Clear Blue Sky
The *?* isn't denoting any kind of question, just when I came to it the option of words to describe what I was referring to lacked all-encompassing precision and I did not know what word to put there. Faith, audacity, foolish-wisdom, courage, surrender, humbleness, trust? boldness? challenge? stubbornness? arrogant mage pride?

By your last paragraph though looking soberly at the human condition, instruction will always be needed. I think an early mistake (?) I made was in approaching God with empathy.... the notion that if I could imagine myself walking around in God's shoes I could figure God out and then ascertain the truth and right judgment/assessment of God. Kabbalah at its start acknowledges that God is unknowable, that there are many interfaces expression of God in the world/human condition, and that the business of humans is to respond to the presence and the inter-action of those interfaces, and to know their place and path and places, and to reach. I think a person raised with a full (FULL) understanding of the Hebrew language and the true resonant full meaning of those words, who had read and learned and walked the walk and lived the life, would gain much richness from that study contemplation journey. For the outsider to that rich ancient culture perhaps as you seem to suggest it would be better served to look direct to god for other paths of understanding. But always that faith/courage/*?* that we grow toward God even knowing that ultimate knowing of God is unknowable.

Nice post.

Of course, God is "unknowable" and that is exactly why one must go through "the cloud of unknowing" and SURRENDER completely to that which lies beyond it all. Books and scriptures and teachings can only point to that which is unknowable and which cannot be described in words. They are useful until they are no longer necessary except as a means of communication in forums such as these.

In any case, I agree with you that "looking soberly at the human condition, instruction will always be needed." However, for those few who discover the "straight and narrow path", surrendering to the guru within that is inherent in all is all the "instruction" that is ultimately needed. The mystics of various traditions support this point and to claim that this is no longer possible is highly questionable.

One must set one's sights high lest one slip into the conventional. (Keep in mind, however, that what is "conventional" for one may not be conventional for another.)
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  #16  
Old 02-08-2016, 04:05 PM
Clear Blue Sky Clear Blue Sky is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Still_Waters

In any case, I agree with you that "looking soberly at the human condition, instruction will always be needed." However, for those few who discover the "straight and narrow path", surrendering to the guru within that is inherent in all is all the "instruction" that is ultimately needed. The mystics of various traditions support this point and to claim that this is no longer possible is highly questionable.

One must set one's sights high lest one slip into the conventional. (Keep in mind, however, that what is "conventional" for one may not be conventional for another.)


Four learned men and a garden. :)

In my own life God has put me in a liminal time. I ask myself, why? One answer beign it is not liminal to keys that are core, that are always front-center-root-core of all that is done. But on matters of Kabballah whch is what this forum is for, I think others answers are best awaited.
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  #17  
Old 02-08-2016, 06:57 PM
Still_Waters Still_Waters is offline
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Originally Posted by Clear Blue Sky
Four learned men and a garden. :)

In my own life God has put me in a liminal time. I ask myself, why? One answer beign it is not liminal to keys that are core, that are always front-center-root-core of all that is done. But on matters of Kabballah whch is what this forum is for, I think others answers are best awaited.

If the "four learned men and a garden" is a reference to Rabbi Akiva and the "other three", your point is well taken. Rabbi Akiva does seem to have discovered the "straight and narrow path" whereas the other three reportedly were not as successful.

Truth is Truth regardless of the names by which it is called and the words which are used. However, as you indicated, "other answers" may indeed be "best awaited" here.

I'm out of this thread.
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  #18  
Old 03-08-2016, 08:32 AM
Tom Howard Tom Howard is offline
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Bless the wicked

When one encounters a rude, negative, mean person, one should pray to YHWH to bless them, because they are more miserable than oneself. Read more about it at http://spiritualityquest.org/apology
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  #19  
Old 10-08-2016, 12:52 PM
AHIYAH AHIYAH is offline
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Originally Posted by Still_Waters
I can't translate Hebrew, so I didn't understand RabbiO's answer either. If you figure it out, please share.
I'm a bit rusty on the Hebrew but the first word he used is Khochma and is translated a wisdom, the second word is NisaTorah, sorry I don't have the suffix but the rest of the word refers to the Torah and that's without the Waw letter so this could mean something completely different but my take is the "Wisdom of Instruction/Instructions.
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  #20  
Old 22-09-2017, 08:34 PM
arkansaspaul arkansaspaul is offline
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Kabbalah, to me. Is the spiritual journey to our Creator. Ive studied the Torah, Koran, Bible, and a plethora of other texts. It is that striving to become like our creator, the ascension of our spirits that is Kabbalah. Eeverything serves its purpose in this life. You can make it as simple, or as complicated as you wish. Every man and womans path is different, though we coincide. Do not brow beat another persons methodology or technique. Always be ready to uplift those who are asking for it. Thank you =]
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