How does an old soul live in this world?

[7luminaries]

Originally Posted by naturesflow

This made me smile. A helpful piece of understanding.

I recall a while back a friend talking about old souls, young souls and for the first time I wondered if this was possible. I never thought about people in this way. I guess in understanding soul nature as a whole, it had to be welcomed in me as something not separated by age firstly as part of understanding deeper the nature of what is...I noticed that through those eyes it became much easier to see people as they are.

Hey there Naturesflow

Hahahaha!!! The "road trip" analogy made me LOL. Too funny!!!
I was never able to get away with that with my own son...only the truth would do, that and frequent stops every 30 or so mins when very young

One thing that is helpful is, as you say, to note that we are all individuals on our own journey. And we all possess free will and choice, whether emotionally and spiritually 1 or 100 -- no matter how many times we've been around the block.

In the spiritual and emotional realms, growing up is ultimately a choice...and IMO it begins to occur as we begin to take ownership for both ourselves and our own words & deeds -- and by extension for the collective (humanity), for Gaia, and for our contribution to them.

Thus spiritual and emotional maturity is IMO much more variable than physical maturity, and as you say has to be apprehended and considered individually. Folks who are brand new to incarnation (if any of those exist here?) might be expected to act out and pursue total indulgence .

But probably the majority who do that have been around the block many times but have not yet accepted that they will need to take ownership. They may be actively rejecting ownership so they can live the bliss of ignorance, until and unless they step outside that mindset.

And IMO...for whatever it's worth...the reason many actively reject ownership and growing up is that it can be quite painful to acknowledge one's mistakes and shortcomings...and equally painful to accept those of others which have cut you deeply. None of this can be changed in the past. It can only be potentially ameliorated and/or reconciled via authentic love going forward, in future, between the souls in question. Though, who's to say how long it may take for both souls to be a in place of love and reconciliation, sadly.

But with acceptance of ownership, we can consciously choose to be and do love and to bring that beauty and truth and joy to each moment. And that's a very powerful and beautiful thing. That's what many have yet to discover, or more aptly, to open to its acceptance at heart.

Peace & blessings
7L

[7luminaries]

Originally Posted by Jyotir

Hi wanchain,

The problems of old souls are distinctly more subtle than those of young souls.

That means ‘surviving’ and ‘thriving’ take on new meaning and significance given that renewed context.

Accordingly, frustration comes from the constant interface with one's own and others' ignorance or the stasis and complacency (a self-imposed stasis), which for aspirants often means continuing to utilize obsolete (therefore regressive) vs. progressive means. But it gets better with alignment to Spirit/the spiritual.

In this era, the chief issue or problem for old souls (who by nature are consciously aspiring spiritually) do not involve the means and methods of escape from an ignorant, divisive, and desire-filled world with its consequent suffering; nor a post-mortem ‘reward’ - but rather, its transformation here and now in the physical into increasing divinisation.

This means old souls are engaged in the relatively new task of transformation of ignorance within self - and significantly by extension - for the direct purpose of positively altering the nascent and growing human institutions that are the collective representations of individual selves which are creatively emerging in our globalizing world. And that includes business, etc..

In that sense, ‘thriving’ is about the joy of enthusiastic self-discovery - as mutually inspiring example - as a means for world transformation - in unity.

And a steadfast dedication to genuinely spiritual purpose in whatever context.

Note: Often it is the young souls who easily get discouraged if they don’t constantly get the bright lights, excitement, and ‘special messages’ grossly symptomatic of awakening. They get cynical, discouraged and dismissive about ‘spirituality’ - throwing cold water on, or condescendingly dismissing those who have sincere concern for these matters...seeing it as a fantasy, or mental fog of incessant ambiguity and confusion, mainly from self-doubt, because they aren‘t yet sufficiently grounded in the necessary faith, devotion, and dedication (without the constant ‘candy’ of reward and superficial self-gratification) and become cynically complacent, falsely confident, and critical, posing as wise old curmudgeons, dispensing drops of subtly disguised discouragement as ‘folksy wisdom’. Converesly, their own guides might even indicate to them, “don’t worry, this is your last incarnation” - like the family going to visit Grandma 500 kilometers away, telling the whining (“how much longer?”) child after 10km: “We’re almost there!!”

Consecrate your life to some dedicated spiritual practice that works for you and stick with it.
Any discouragement is inherently false.
It is the grounding in the spiritual that has an effect on the worldly in and through one's own life - not the other way around.

~J

Jyotir...you are a wise soul, my friend. I took some liberties to highlight some beautifully stated passages above. I just want to say that you have hit the nail on the head and provided clarity and insight to a sincere seeker.

I too continue to pursue study of ethics and learning and mysticism within my base tradition, despite the problems I have with its iniquities, inequities, and injustices. For all that, for the committed seeker there is still nearly unparalleled mystical insight into the heart-led consciousness...and I do continue to reap the rewards. Another thing I respect about this tradition is its longstanding emphasis on thriving disagreement, constant reinterpretation, and the necessity of alternate and minority opinions to be good and necessary on principle. This is the only tradition that would have me anyway, then, most likely And we do need our spiritual communities and our meeting houses...as well as our own contemplative practice.

A bit off to the side....What I find interesting is that although I have free and unfettered access to practiced spiritual teachers, including in the area of mysticism, the deepest teachings are basically not written down and I suppose it's the same everywhere. Because folks were concerned that others would worship the guides as divinities?...and yet in other, non-Westerm traditions, this is more or less already true...and much of their mysticism is also not written down -- though arguably some of which is more readily known to those who sit in circle in spirit within the community (I drop in sometimes, particularly to some Tibetan sanghas). What are your thoughts on this?

Peace & blessings
7L

[7luminaries]

Originally Posted by wanchain

Yes, I notice that as I allow more free flow of energy to pass through me, I find that there are more people to support me. The thing is, I am not letting go fast enough, so although those people are there, I am not able to benefit from their availability.

I am seeing my resistance to let go. Mostly fears. Fear of disapproval, judgment, condemnation, aggression, intimidation, etc. My physical body still holds a lot of wounds relating to those fears.

I was so so so disappointed with myself this morning when I didn't tell my boss what I am feeling. I was so disappointed with myself that I wanted to cry. He is very hard to catch, but this morning he phoned me out of the blue to check up on me. Fear of authority. Aside from that, I also didn't have the clarity, so didn't know what exactly to tell him.

Wanchain, hello there! What you're feeling is very normal. Many if not most of us have some or many of these traumas you mention, and they do tend to trigger some sort of fear-based response. It will take time and patience, balance and lovingkingness, to work through these things. I made it past marriage and had my child only to accumulate some severe emotional trauma en route to expanding awareness and taking on a more expanded ownership. There's nothing to show for it except the scars and the wisdom But I sought the wisdom, and so in obtaining it, I am now freed to go forward having done everything possible to facilitate reconciliation.

I think advice you have already got from others on cultivating your inner life regardless is spot on...that will serve you well wherever you go.

In the most basic form, this is simply developing a regular reflective and meditative practice...and perhaps also finding a community of fellow travellers where you feel welcome and accepted and positively supported on your journey.

Remember that much of this is hard work, rewarding yet sometimes grueling, bitter work, and that you will need to take time for self-care and healing. You will need to develop discernment and discrimination for those situations and those persons who are egregiously unkind and without remorse. Applying that discernment is absolutely an aspect of being and doing authentic love in the world...for the highest good of yourself equally to others, and vice-versa.

Whilst you establish your personal practice (key) and perhaps also find a community (always helpful), you may do as Jesus recommended to "get by in a pinch" and which applies to so much of life...Give to Caesar (the boss, society) what is Caesar's and give to God what is God's (your heart and soul, your engagement with yourself and your life, love and devotion )

Peace & blessings
7L

[naturesflow]

Originally Posted by 7luminaries

Hey there Naturesflow

Hahahaha!!! The "road trip" analogy made me LOL. Too funny!!!
I was never able to get away with that with my own son...only the truth would do, that and frequent stops every 30 or so mins when very young

Hey there 7L am glad you found a good lol. I am confused about what I might have shared about the road trip analogy..lol. Did I say that? And where did I say that? My apologies if it was me. Sometimes I type things and POOF! they have gone from me, all the while oblivious that I did type them.. .(intuitive flow can be like that)

One thing that is helpful is, as you say, to note that we are all individuals on our own journey. And we all possess free will and choice, whether emotionally and spiritually 1 or 100 -- no matter how many times we've been around the block.

Yes I understand what your sharing here. I am of the awareness that choice and no choice come into the picture through the unknown and known aspects of ourselves as individuals and as a greater interconnectedness of life. So the greater association of interconnected ripples will become part of our no choice aspects as well as our subconscious unaware aspects. In the awareness of both these, I tend to walk the middle path of this and just accept and see life as it is.

In the spiritual and emotional realms, growing up is ultimately a choice...and IMO it begins to occur as we begin to take ownership for both ourselves and our own words & deeds -- and by extension for the collective (humanity), for Gaia, and for our contribution to them.

As you mention choice again I thought I might touch upon this once more. In the awareness of all life as it is, I tend to look at life as it is and let these ideas of choice and ownership go but model what I know myself to be. Even as I know in myself my own journey has been to awaken in this way and I also am around others who are in this way too and I see that in their own process and life, they often catch up to themselves even as they may detour away and struggle in some way. They are often 'aware' to know and so it opens them to see themselves more naturally through choice. When I look into life I see that many people are playing various roles supporting the whole and the individual nature of themselves in so many ways. Some of those roles as humans on earth, suffering and in struggle, are held captive in ways that choice through process is not there for them. Of course our inner world of choice, if aware we can, can determine how we feel and respond at any given time to any situation, but that to is through the known and unknown of itself anyway. The external that we participate in, often reflects something greater than ourselves so sometimes we can see in life choice and betterment may not always be the case. Sometimes getting through the struggles and suffering are the cycle that we reside in and continue to be a part of until one knows more, is supported more and sometimes through others. So life is very complicated and difficult in me now to pinpoint this whole choice thing. I look into life with a greater picture in myself now and try to just see it as it is. As it needs to be for now and live my life accordingly.

Thus spiritual and emotional maturity is IMO much more variable than physical maturity, and as you say has to be apprehended and considered individually. Folks who are brand new to incarnation (if any of those exist here?) might be expected to act out and pursue total indulgence .

I suppose I look at each of us as vessels that support the whole. I do understand we have an individual nature and process as one in all that, but ultimately we are supporting the whole wherever we are as it is and has been created. I see the streams of life creations as they can be and are through our own human creations through all streams we come to know and experience also. I am aware now more so in myself, the deeper I go into myself, the less I need to create life into something, more aware of life, aware of myself deeper and move as that. So all these ideas about what life is and what it is being and why, tends to move me into this point of emptiness I know in myself and I often explore these things from there. I understand within this point of emptiness everything resides as one awareness so again the middle path of myself in this looks at this as just life experiencing itself. How it is and knows only to be as itself where it is and resides within. Of course I know the potentials within the human expression but whether that is for this life, another or never I have no concept. I have a sense of past lives but nothing solid. Its like a fading memory now that I have healed emotionally through those streams of my interconnected lives and this life as one. But that makes sense, because of how I can now view myself and the world around me. Seeing myself as life aware and connected to something beyond just my human self on this earth in this life and previous lives. For me the choices are in me aware of what is important to me for my life. At times I bring that awareness into a greater awareness of others as one and it opens up my choices as to how I am in all that aware of them and those interconnected ripples. For me it is all discernment aware of more than just my own individuation now.

But probably the majority who do that have been around the block many times but have not yet accepted that they will need to take ownership. They may be actively rejecting ownership so they can live the bliss of ignorance, until and unless they step outside that mindset.

I feel we can reach certain points of awareness and settle into that sometimes, which is ok. Its all part of experiencing and seeing where we can immerse as our creation in this way. Sometimes staying in those spaces can be important, to learning more through that experience we have decided fits our process for now. Of course life often intervenes if we are to know more, life works like this, so It becomes easier if we are open to life and the changes it might submit us to, to know more, find more life in us we might be holding in and down. I am more of a free spirited explorer, so I will be open even as I don't know, some find this a challenge. To me the unknown walk was where I had to learn deeper, that simple tasks like waking up and just engaging the day as it is, is important. To let go of the need to make be, set down as, but rather just be present with what is. It was valid learning to come into the space of letting fear and control go and understand how to move more in harmony and trust of life. In some ways I suppose this served me to also not have to strive and struggle also. Always knowing life comes to me in its own time as I need and perhaps life needs me to be a part of.

And IMO...for whatever it's worth...the reason many actively reject ownership and growing up is that it can be quite painful to acknowledge one's mistakes and shortcomings...and equally painful to accept those of others which have cut you deeply. None of this can be changed in the past. It can only be potentially ameliorated and/or reconciled via authentic love going forward, in future, between the souls in question. Though, who's to say how long it may take for both souls to be a in place of love and reconciliation, sadly.

Ownership and process is tricky, we are all so unique in the greater points of life and where each one is aware and open to know, that again the unknown is what the greater web of life will bring life to each one as each one can manage through their own process. So the reconciliation process can be in any form either through choice of self or the choice of others supporting because they themselves are aware to do so and the other may not be. Even life experiences can be a proviso for reconciliation, without human intervention. One thing I am aware of is the deeper you go into yourself, the more aware you become, the more you realize the nature of what is and you can only do your part in truth of yourself aware to do so, even as others may not be, you move as you know you can be. People reconcile in so many ways to themselves. Death is a reconciliation process for some. Finding true love is another way for others. Living in a hell hole can be a provision of opening deeper to love through ones own suffering. Again I can only be personally responsible to myself and my own awareness as one with all life aware of life as it is. And there are so many ways to experience and learn through the life process.

But with acceptance of ownership, we can consciously choose to be and do love and to bring that beauty and truth and joy to each moment. And that's a very powerful and beautiful thing. That's what many have yet to discover, or more aptly, to open to its acceptance at heart.

Peace & blessings
7L

I suppose right now, I just feel very comfortable being myself as I am. I know I am connected deeper to myself now and so it is easier to be myself in the world more open and clear about who I am. I have a past process that has allowed me in this life to let go of what I am not, to open to feeling more connected to myself not the conditioned self who feared deeply. So I now find so much joy and beauty in my world, love being myself and love this life. I try now to just accept life as it is, be myself and bring what I am to the table, very aware of others as they are. I listen as deep as I listen to myself which is supportive to them where they are too. If we are blessed as this life to have the gift of spiritual growth and healing, that can only as itself lead and support the world around it more naturally as the world is.

I have always been a believer in
BE the change you wish to SEE
For me that means you literally do become the other person where you seeing is wanting change through them. If you go that deep into your own being and seeing to become the change in this way of what they are offering, then there is always the opportunity to give and receive as one source in this way as yourself. There is no separation in this way of being and seeing as I experience it.. Everything forms itself through that interconnectedness of life as one source in you. I guess you may relate this as total acceptance of what is. Moving and living a life as that acceptance aware of all life as life presents itself to you.

[shivatar]

Originally Posted by wanchain

Hi all,

I am trying to collect ideas on how an old soul can survive in this world. If you have ideas on how to manage in the corporate world, that would be even better. But would be nice to also know if an old soul can thrive in this world.

Thanks.

Wanchain

How to survive.
1. get a job.
2. keep job no matter how tough it gets. If it gets too tough, look for new and less stressful job that pays the same or better (always possible, just takes effort).
3. pay bills on time.

How to thrive
1. learn to communicate with inner self.

there are 999^infinity ways to thrive, the inner self knows them all. You should ask your self what thriving and surviving means to you, not us. We will just give you our opinions, but its your opinion that really matters to you.

maybe you just needed to be reminded of that. If not, I'm sure plenty of people will give you advice that works for them as well as you. However, the best advice will always come from within.

[Rah nam]

Originally Posted by wanchain

Hi all,

I am trying to collect ideas on how an old soul can survive in this world. If you have ideas on how to manage in the corporate world, that would be even better. But would be nice to also know if an old soul can thrive in this world.

Thanks.

Wanchain

It is very simple, first practice dispassion include compassion and humility and you will find you can live just about anywhere. This is not entirely correct, most likely you will move into a situation were you are comfortable, or were you can work on your remaining challenges.

[uloDoe Youn]

In an day and age where u can be possible, let the old soul relearn and grow. With time on the side, remold. Get time let you rewind, and measure out mind, Dont let a world fool you, give chance another chance to define. Old young, can have a chance, even in a cooperate setting, give in to Life another chance.

On a personal note, if you inquire finances and the right of its stability, then you will lay down what got the old soul in you, and re/Learn the new scoop, so that both young and financed you may become.

Change your hair style; attire or a remedy to the sElf so that you may maintain. This to alternate you from the old/man/sOul

If it is ; you can do it...

[lemex]

Originally Posted by Centered

I only choose that out of love and kindness, if someone doesn't know they are destructive, then this gives them the opportunity to find the love within themselves to heal.

Amazing insight imo. Yes, love is never wasted as we thought, is it even if you can't see it! Amazing!!!!! For those not seeing, hate does the same thing. It is not that you are taken advantage of which is often seen as expressed but the opportunity is not taken. Synchronicity and opportunity?

[Centered]

Originally Posted by lemex

Amazing insight imo. Yes, love is never wasted as we thought, is it even if you can't see it! Amazing!!!!! For those not seeing, hate does the same thing. It is not that you are taken advantage of which is often seen as expressed but the opportunity is not taken. Synchronicity and opportunity?

Stretching, or finding total awareness would allow for non-infringement on freewill, and allow the individual soul to see the ripple effect they release, on the universe, be it constructive or destructive.

Awareness imo is the greatest gift we can get, or give in this universe. If I could gift something to each one of you it would be awareness, whether it would be used would be up to that individual.

Peace and Love,

Centered.