Will science ever accept?

[EdmundJohnstone]

I think that the biggest difference is that science can back-up the claims with evidence whereas spirituality is less credible because can't show proof but just faith like blindly believe without evidence

[neil]

Originally Posted by EdmundJohnstone

I think that the biggest difference is that science can back-up the claims with evidence whereas spirituality is less credible because can't show proof but just faith like blindly believe without evidence

Science can not back anything up, of a spiritual matter, because science can not sence/detect spiritual matter.

Where as some people..(Spiritual people)..have personal proof of spiritual matters, however they can not back it up with verifiable proof..obviously...BUT these kinds of spiritual persons do not need faith as they see, hear, sence & or feel spiritual matter..."& so they are not less credible".

& who cares about science when you have self verifiable evidence of spiritual matters.

[EdmundJohnstone]

Thank you for your response, what you wrote makes sense.

Spiritual people say that they had contact with higher spiritual beings that told them about Universe, how life emerged, how humans emerged on this planet, and that they also saw other planets. Why don't scientists accept these experiences?

I guess scientists would say that spiritual experiences are brain induced as hallucinations and also that after death we become unconscious forever since brain dies, scientists would say that also if someone is hit in the head will become unconscious and death would be the same, as spiritual people are considered charlatans scared of death as void

How do people that have spiritual experiences know that are not brain hallucinations or something induced by the brain?

Originally Posted by neil

Science can not back anything up, of a spiritual matter, because science can not sence/detect spiritual matter.

Where as some people..(Spiritual people)..have personal proof of spiritual matters, however they can not back it up with verifiable proof..obviously...BUT these kinds of spiritual persons do not need faith as they see, hear, sence & or feel spiritual matter..."& so they are not less credible".

& who cares about science when you have self verifiable evidence of spiritual matters.

[neil]

Originally Posted by EdmundJohnstone

How do people that have spiritual experiences know that are not brain hallucinations or something induced by the brain?

Well for me, I hear it, see it and feel it.
& "ALL" of any physical possessions that I use are interfered with by spiritual beings, in ways that are darn well annoying & amazing.

Anything mechanically opperated, LP Gass opperated, electrically opperated, etc..ie:- vehicles, computers, stoves, tools, chemicals...Anything & everything.

Not to mention the maddening crazy things that go on, in & of my body & or mind.

& those things are proof enough for me.

[neil]

Originally Posted by EdmundJohnstone

How do people that have spiritual experiences know that are not brain hallucinations or something induced by the brain?

Well for me, I hear it, see it and feel it.
& "ALL" of any physical possessions that I use are interfered with by spiritual beings, in ways that are darn well annoying & amazing.

Anything mechanically opperated, LP Gass opperated, electrically opperated, etc..ie:- vehicles, computers, stoves, tools, chemicals...Anything & everything.

Not to mention the maddening crazy things that go on, in & of my body & or mind.

& those things are proof enough for me.

[naturewalker24]

important to note: science is written in black and white. peace out.

This statement is ludicrous. It is an insightful look into the imagination of a nefarious scientist known for explorations of deep space...

by the way, deep space represents the search for history.

[SkyFeather]

I've had enough experiences to personally believe in the afterlife. The same time the thought that my vessel will be given back to the Earth for new life to emerge is a beautiful cycle of life. It is remarkable that we are all made up of star dust. There are countless experiences, and I am sure there are a few scientists out there trying to prove the existence of an afterlife. We have countless experiences some even physical. There are so many experiences/stories out there, shared too, how can they all be just a trick of the mind? At one point, someone's got to look at that as compelling data. Orbs in photos. Spirit photos. But, even inventions like "The Spirit Box" where people are speaking to a spirit through the box, not that I would recommend buying one it could be like the ouiji board just don't know who exactly is talking on the other end, but that there is technology out there. It's just right now doctors/Scientists have to keep belief systems separate from their daily jobs. We all have different cultures, religions, spiritual, agnostic or atheist views. But maybe in the future that will change. Technology and spirituality working together to help improve humanity.

[HITESH SHAH]

Originally Posted by EdmundJohnstone

Will science ever accept spirituality in terms of souls and afterlife?

Will science ever accept objective verified proof? It seems that science doesen't accept at all subjective proof like reincarnations, NDE, mediums communication, even if they are verified and confirmed

Why doesen't it accept reincarnation verified evidence, NDE, and mediums? Can there be a hidden reason behind not admitting this?

The science which you talk about is normally material science . Now by definition the material science deals with matter which can be seen ,heard , measured .So it is possible to come upto some numerical axioms in support of material science .

So when material scientist hear about spirituality , they insists the same set of measurability for spirituality . They ask proofs , evidence and numerical expression . But this (arithmetic expression ) by its very nature wrong . Because the subject matter of spirituality is spirit which is invisible which can only be felt .So asking for tests of material science is extremely wrong . They must be made to understand limits of material science . If you ask hard core scientist to reduce their day to day routine subjective matters like taste , beauty , smell , melody to arithmetic numbers , they themselves will say its folly and will not recommend to initiate any scientific project for the same . He will instead give you worldly advice that 'taste of the pudding is in eating ' . So insistence on numerical tests is frivolous and unacceptable . They must be made to realize their limitations.

Denial of numerical expression is not denial of evidence and test. So if I mug up spiritual laws and speak them better , I do not and can not claim to be spiritual giant .World and spiritualist community will likely and rightly ask what my spirituality has really resulted in and accordingly only they will judge my spirituality . The documented experiences of well meaning selfless wise people is an ample evidence for world and scientists to accept .

Finally even social science like economic / politics / psychology too dont have numerical axioms . Yet scientist readily accept it as science.

As to after life experience here is the explanation . All the religion without exception talks about afterlife in one way or the other . The accounts and visualization of after life may differ in style and words . But one underlying commonality for all the experience without exception is that 'Soul exists after death '. So coming to the evidence for spirituality is
documented experiences of well meaning selfless wise people .So when largest number of great people around the world have claimed that there is afterlife and spirit exists after death , there is no need for any evidence any more . It's an axiom and its a law ( the ignorance of which is perilous to ignorant only) .

Now what kind of afterlife is there its for spiritual scientists ( who accept the fundamental law as aforesaid ) to discuss and visualize in amicable manner without demeaning any other's experiences. Non-believers should not be allowed to question and weaken the convictions of spiritualists .

[HITESH SHAH]

Originally Posted by EdmundJohnstone

Fair enough.

So what is your take on the energy inside us? What happens when we die? Energy can't be destroyed but conserved. Does it get conserved in the ground to grow plants and feed bacteria, to hear up the air,

You are close to answer of re-birth .

is it the end of our existence and consciousness?

NO

Or does it conserve as going back to a different realm (dimension) of spirits?

At the time of death , consciousness and body gets separated . They both get to life appropriate body and spirit gets together (either in any vegetation , animal species or human species ). The granularity of this life may not be retained as far a body is concerned . The species one gets in re-birth depends on his/her evolution . God is extremely loving he does not intend to punish anybody . He gives us a form which we really lived all these life , which we dreamt day in day out .

[EdmundJohnstone]

Hello HITESH SHAH,

Thank you so much for both of your replies, much appreciated ! Both of your messages made a lot of sense

Regarding the 1st post/reply involving Science : can we be sure that the immaterial/non-material world really exists? That there is more than just the physical world? (That spiritual experiences are not just imaginations/ fairy tales invented by ancient people as they couldn't explain phenomena?) Were the ancient people right about saying that we are/have spirit/soul and having spiritual afterlife?

Scientists would say that there is no scientific proof/evidence for spirit, or that the spiritual experiences are hallucinations, because when someone dies would go eternal unconscious/void, like before he or she was born) (Current science would say that just the material/physical exists going as low as quantum level)

Yes, I agree with you that skeptics shouldn't interfere with spiritual people

Peace