Done with the New Age

[r6r6]

New Age is eternally with us as sensorial awareness and conscious adaptation to an eternally existent present time, that is eternal change.

Here and now consciousness is based on a fading past and dawning future...thank Buck Fuller

We recall the past and anticipate the future....thank you bucky Fuller

We do all of this within context of the eternal ...'now'...

Temporal time recalls and anticipates, and this recalls thinking or at least some genetic patterning associated with our environment that causes us to build shelter, move to lower or higher ground or fly south for the winter etc......

r6

[r6r6]

jonesboy--I have given many examples to the words for energy.

Again Ive repeated ask you for direct answer that defines clearly, and specficially what this "energy" is. You do not answer in own words with even a few sentences.

You just don't like them is all.

You dont like what Ive stated nor what I asked from you.

Here are some more writing to help you understand.
Please read them this time;
Prana: the Universal Life Force

See my repeated replies to your prana as oxygen. You dont like and never will. IN-spiration is IN-spirited. No oxygen IN-spired means no life for the human and same goes for many other biologicals

Oxygen is energy in the form of matter. More specifically oxygen is a collection of fermionic matter and bosonic forces as an element of nature.

If those two articles don't answer your questions nothing will.

Side tangents to a simple request of you to respond directly to my question regarding your generalize "energy", with clear specific definitions.

You dont because you have nothing valid to offer us as an explanation beyond, your indirect answer of if I told you "blissful" and "ecstatic".....stuff that all humans experience, day by day to whatever degree month after month and year after year.

r6

[jonesboy]

Originally Posted by Rokon

I agree that the use of the word "energy" in spiritual, new age parlance is painfully blurry. Have you ever listened to reiki practitioners converse? And for some reason in the circles there is a reverence, or deference, that allows the users of the word "energy" to keep the meaning blurry.

People can verbalize the type of energy they are referring to if they choose to. Can people describe dreams? Do people understand the difference between violent energy and pleasant energy? How about fourth chakra energy, can that be differentiated from third chakra energy? YES!

And secondly there is the issue of credibility for skeptics that have to hear it. If someone is talking about how important and useful and imperative "source" energy is, or I AMness, or universal then if they keep saying "I can't describe it you have to experience it first". That sounds like a insincerity. A fakeout, like perhaps you are describing something you read about and are passing it off. If it was real then certainly one could at least define the energy as something that can be shared.

I have described it many times. Furthermore I even shared my old practice log and what I was experiencing at the time. If one was to read it it would have shown me asking questions about then energy moving throughout my body, kundalini waking up and the bliss of my heart opening.

Energy is form and that form can take on many different attributes that one will/can experience as one progresses. Eventually we realize we are that energy be it called kundalini or universal consciousness.

The energy can feel like wind blowing against your face, heat in your spine, crawling sensations as it wakes up. As one progresses one begins to feel the energy as ecstatic/orgasmic as it hits ones obstructions.

I shared that also in my link earlier.

I really don't know what else to say,

Tom

[jonesboy]

Originally Posted by r6r6r

Again Ive repeated ask you for direct answer that defines clearly, and specficially what this "energy" is. You do not answer in own words with even a few sentences.


You dont like what Ive stated nor what I asked from you.

See my repeated replies to your prana as oxygen. You dont like and never will. IN-spiration is IN-spirited. No oxygen IN-spired means no life for the human and same goes for many other biologicals

Oxygen is energy in the form of matter. More specifically oxygen is a collection of fermionic matter and bosonic forces as an element of nature.

Side tangents to a simple request of you to respond directly to my question regarding your generalize "energy", with clear specific definitions.

You dont because you have nothing valid to offer us as an explanation beyond, your indirect answer of if I told you "blissful" and "ecstatic".....stuff that all humans experience, day by day to whatever degree month after month and year after year.

r6

Ok then

Have a great day

[r6r6]

Originally Posted by jonesboy

Energy is form

Energy is fermionic matter and bosonic forces and any collection thereof ex oxygen the element IN-spired by humans and many other animals to live as an independent individual.

Energy = physical ergo a synomynic set as physical/energy.

Form boards ex plywood is used to give a specific shape to any physical/energy medium ex concrete.

Form is the shape. Shape boards can be plywood or other physical/erng mediums.

Geometry is shape. Geometry is subcatagory of mathematics ergo abstract concepts of mind/intellect ergo metaphysical-1.

r6

[r6r6]

JB/Tom--The energy can feel like wind blowing against your face, heat in your spine, crawling sensations as it wakes up. As one progresses one begins to feel the energy as ecstatic/orgasmic as it hits ones obstructions.
I really don't know what else to say,

And I addressed those indirect answers of ecstatic and blissful as feelings, nothing more nothing less that all humans experience.

Just as all humans experience wind blowing on their face.

None of that takes any special practice to percieve, enjoy as pleasure or as pain. A bittter blowing/flowing wind or water can also cause pain.

Again no special practice is needed. Energy = energetic. People like feel of motion, untill it is too much motion or in incorrect direction etc....

r6

[Holly]

Originally Posted by jonesboy

...
Prana: the Universal Life Force
Swami Satyananda Saraswati
Zinal (Switzerland), September 1981
In the physical body we have two types of energies. One is known as prana and the other is known as mind or consciousness.

jonesboy, I'm glad you posted this! The post was most informative and it gives a framework I've never really encountered before. (I did research some of this previously but I found it harder to understand then than I do now, for some reason o.O) Incredibly useful to have names for different types of energy! I do think 'energy' is a very generic term.

I'm going to do some research into this. I always had the feeling that spirituality had science behind it. Fascinating! :)

[jonesboy]

Originally Posted by Holly

jonesboy, I'm glad you posted this! I'm going to read both articles, but the post was most informative and it gives a framework I've never really encountered before. (I did research some of this previously but I found it harder to understand then than I do now, for some reason o.O) Incredibly useful to have names for different types of energy! I do think 'energy' is a very generic term.

I'm going to do some research into this. I always had the feeling that spirituality had science behind it. Fascinating! :)

Hi Holly

The Yogis can go into a lot of detail. I have to admit when I first started it was a little much for me but as you know. Once you get to that level things kinda click.

I would also encourage you to read up on qigong. It is all about energy as an example:

This thread is just to quickly discuss the nature of the jing, qi, and shen that we use in neidan practice, as opposed to Qigong.
The Jing, Qi, and Shen that we use in Qigong are considered mostly as post heaven energies which can in some way to controlled by the mind. The yuan jing qi and shen that we practice in Neidan are pre heaven energies and can only be indirectly activated by the mind. They are not able to be led around like yi, qi, and li etc... can be.

I used that so you could find the terms to research them.

A great book is The little book of Hercules:

Using the Greek story of the Twelve Labors of Hercules, which outlines the progressive stages of spiritual development that spiritual practitioners in all spiritual traditions go through, this book presents full details on the step-by-step progression of the physical transformations that occur to practitioners. Whenever someone starts to consistently cultivate spiritual practice in a devoted way, there are physical changes that will occur to the human body. These physical transformations, called "gong-fu" in the eastern spiritual schools, are non-denominational signposts of spiritual progress. If you cultivate spiritual practice sufficiently then these phenomena will arise. If you don't practice correctly, they simply won't appear. Their appearance is a matter of proper devoted effort. These phenomena include such things as the awakening of kundalini (yang chi) within the body, the opening of the chakras and purification of the body's energy channels, hormonal transformations, the calming of consciousness, the experience of refined mental states described as "emptiness," and various other mental and physical phenomena. Normally people think these phenomena only occur to individuals following eastern cultivations traditions such as yoga, Buddhism, Hinduism, Taoism, and Vajrayana. However, these phenomena that arise are totally non-sectarian and non-denominational. They equally occur to devoted spiritual followers within Judaism, Islam, and Christianity. If you cultivate spiritual practices sufficiently, these purification transformations will occur and if you don't cultivate meditation or other spiritual exercises, you will not experience them. Your religion has nothing to do with it. All genuine religious traditions employ cultivation practices designed to help you achieve a quiet mind. Because thoughts die down due to these practices, this resulting mental quiet is described as peacefulness, silence, cessation, calming, purity, and emptiness. Your mind empties of busy thoughts and so you begin to experience mental peace. When your mind quiets, proper spiritual practice requires that you remain aware during this experience rather than try to suppress thoughts from further arising. The practice of maintaining awareness while mentally quiet is called witnessing, observing, knowing, or introspection. As the mind quiets, you continue to watch your mental continuum but without attaching to it. The gradual calming of your mind results from successfully letting go of thoughts, and because your body’s life force (chi) and consciousness are linked, as you let go of thoughts you also drop the habit of clinging to the energies you normally feel in your body. With proper spiritual practice you learn how to detach from these energies and let them function without interference. Once you learn how to do this, your kundalini energies will arise and their natural circulation will start to transform your body. Those energies will open up your chi channels and chakras and transform your physical body, purifying it. As your chi purifies, so will your emotions and habit energies. As you progressively let go of your chi, it will also revert to its natural circulation which has been suppressed by errant thought patterns. Cultivating a quiet mind leads to your kundalini arising, those energies purify your channels and chakras, that purification leads to a greater degree of mental purity or emptiness, and the two components of body and mind reach ever increasing levels of refinement. This book presents full details on this step-by-step progression of transformations that occur to practitioners on the spiritual trail. It covers the meditation practices that successful adepts have traditionally used throughout history, and non-denominationally links the gong-fu experiences of these practitioners with the stages of the spiritual path and the ultimate quest for self-realization, or enlightenment.

[running]

Originally Posted by jonesboy

I have given many examples to the words for energy.

You just don't like them is all.

Here are some more writing to help you understand.

Please read them this time;

Prana: the Universal Life Force
Swami Satyananda Saraswati
Zinal (Switzerland), September 1981
In the physical body we have two types of energies. One is known as prana and the other is known as mind or consciousness. That means, in every organ of the body there should be two channels supplying energy. Modern physiology describes two types of nervous systems - the sympathetic and the parasympathetic, and these two nervous systems are interconnected in each and every organ of the body. In the same way, every organ is supplied with the energy of prana and the energy of mind.

In yoga, the concept of prana is very scientific. When we speak of prana, we do not mean the breath, air or oxygen. Precisely and scientifically speaking, prana means the original life force.

Prana is a Sanskrit word constructed of the syllables pra and an. 'An' means movement and 'pra' is a prefix meaning constant. Therefore, prana means constant motion. This constant motion commences in the human being as soon as he is conceived in his mother's womb. Prana is therefore a type of energy responsible for the body's life, heat and maintenance.

Nadis, chakras and the distribution of prana

According to yoga, tantra and the science of kundalini, prana is supposed to originate in pingala nadi. Within the framework of the spinal cord, there are three channels known as nadis in yoga. One is called ida, another is pingala and the third is sushumna. Ida nadi represents the mental energy, pingala represents prana or pranic energy and sushumna represents spirit or spiritual awareness. These three nadis originate in mooladhara chakra, which is situated at the perineum or cervix. Pingala nadi flows to the right from mooladhara and continues to cross ida at each chakra all the way up to ajna.

There are six chakras through which pingala nadi passes. The first one is mooladhara chakra from which it originates. The second is swadhisthana where the nadi crosses to the left. The third is manipura chakra where the nadi crosses to the right. And the fourth is anahata where the nadi crosses to the left. The fifth is vishuddhi where the nadi crosses to the right and the sixth is ajna where the nadi terminates from the right. Similarly, ida nadi also crosses at each chakra but in the reverse order. Every sincere yoga aspirant should have a clear understanding of the pathway of these three major nadis.

Pingala nadi is the distributing channel for prana in the body, and from each chakra the pranas are disseminated to every organ of the body. From swadhisthana the pranic energy is distributed to the genito-urinary system. Manipura chakra supplies prana to the digestive system and anahata supplies the respiratory and cardiovascular systems. From vishuddhi, distribution takes place to the ears, eyes, nose and throat, and ajna chakra is the distributor of energy through which man's brain is fed.

The fuel of life

Prana is not merely a philosophical concept; it is in every sense a physical substance. Just as radioactive or electromagnetic waves exist even though we can't see them, in the same way, in this physical body, there are pranic waves and a pranic field. Now, each of us has a certain quantity of prana in our physical body and we utilize this in the course of our day to day activities throughout life. When our prana diminishes, sickness sets in, and when we have plenty of prana, every part of the body is in perfect health. If we have an excess of prana, it can be transmitted to others for healing or magnetism.

The inner prana can be stimulated by the practice of pranayama and thereby increased to a greater quantum. The brain requires maximum prana, and for the practice of meditation, it needs an increased supply. It is for this reason that we practise pranayama before commencing our meditation practice. If we are not able to supply plenty of pranic fuel to the brain, the mind becomes very restless and disturbed.

When the brain is receiving a deficient supply of prana, you suffer from nervous depression or nervous breakdown. Then the whole body perspires, there is trembling in every organ, you can't stand, your mind is unsteady and you are constantly thinking negative thoughts. You can't even sleep and you don't want to talk or think. This state indicates that the brain is only receiving a very small quantity of prana.

Increasing prana

You should not think that just by practising a little pranayama you are sending a lot of prana to the brain. The process of supply and assimilation of prana into the brain is very complicated. The brain is a subtle instrument and it can only be enriched by the subtle form of prana and not the gross form. Therefore, when you practise pranayama, you will have to convert the prana into a subtle force.

Deep breathing alone is not enough to stimulate prana. By breathing deeply, you stimulate your respiratory system and the blood circulation, but if you could examine the brain at that time, you would see that it is least affected. However, when you practise pranayama with concentration, as shown by scientific studies, the brainwaves undergo a significant change and the limbic system is also positively influenced.

Conscious and unconscious breathing

http://www.yogamag.net/archives/1982...prana582.shtml

Pranayama – Cultivating the soil of the nervous system

From: Yogani
Date: Wed Dec 10, 2003 0:21pm

New Visitors: It is recommended you read from the beginning of the archive, as previous lessons are prerequisite to this one. The first lesson is, "Why This Discussion?"

It is common knowledge that when a friend is upset, really upset, it is good to tell him to breathe, to take slow, deep breaths in and out for a while. This invariably has a calming effect on the nervous system, mind, and emotions.

Why? Because it loosens the nerves. Tension constricts our nerves, and this restricts the flow of consciousness through us. Breathing slowly and deeply loosens our nerves, facilitating the flow of consciousness through us, and this has the desired relaxing effect.

To say that consciousness flows through us is a bit of an over-simplification. While, in truth, all is the flow of consciousness, it is more descriptive to say that the "life force" flows through us. What is the life force? It is the first manifestation of consciousness in matter. It is called, "prana," which means, "first unit." In the string theory of modern physics, the miniscule, subatomic energy strings thought to be the building blocks of everything in the universe might well be analogous to prana. In any case, we know that influencing prana (the life force) in the human body has significant effects on our nervous system, and our experience.

Meditation is a way of influencing prana with the mind taking the lead. The human mind arises from a flow of energy through the nerves of the brain. In meditation, we systematically allow that energy (prana) to become still, which brings us to the underlying cause of that energy. We experience it as pure silent bliss consciousness. In meditation, the attention is easily brought beyond the mind, and beyond prana. It is an extraordinary natural ability we have.

Besides meditation, there are other ways to influence prana to facilitate the purification of the nervous system for joining of our inner and outer nature. As mentioned, managing the breath can have a noticeable effect on our experience. By restraining the breath in certain ways we can produce certain predictable effects. This is the science of "pranayama," which means, "restraint of prana." In terms of what we do externally, it is called breath control. But there is more to pranayama than physical control of the breath. Other actions are brought to bear that deepen and broaden the effects of the breath. The mind is involved, and so is the body in ways other than by controlling the breath. Taken together, these actions loosen and cultivate the nervous system in ways that greatly enhance the effects of our core practice of meditation.

Think of the nervous system as the soil, and of pure bliss consciousness as the seed. We have been awakening the silent seed through regular daily meditation. Now we will be cultivating the soil of our nervous system so the seed of pure bliss consciousness will grow to be dynamic and strong in us.

How does the breath affect the flow of prana in the body? There is an electromagnetic relationship in the body between the breath, the mind, the flow of prana, and every aspect of our biological functioning. All of these are connected. This is why, when we meditate, the breath is automatically subdued and the whole metabolism slows down. During pranayama, when we consciously slow down the breath and mentally take it along a particular pathway, we influence the flow of prana in that pathway. It is a kind of induction. It is like inducing an electrical current in a wire with a magnet. So, using the breath in coordination with the mind, we are able to engage in selective purification of a particular channel in our nervous system that plays a leading role in the rise of enlightenment. This channel is the tiny thread-like nerve that runs up inside the spine and through the brain. It is called the "sushumna." Purifying and opening this nerve is where pranayama and additional advanced yoga practices will be focused.

http://www.aypsite.org/39.html


If those two articles don't answer your questions nothing will.

Incredible stuff Tom! Thanks for posting. Maybe start a thread on it if u feel up to it. I would but im without the knowledge. Ayp is like the hook up for great info. My god do i wish i knew about it when i was goimg through it.

[SeaZen]

Originally Posted by Holly

It's supposed to be that way but in my personal world, it wasn't terribly liberating. It was actually sometimes very limiting. Pushy believers, as well as my own fear often lead me to believe things that didn't help at all in the long run. It's also very hard to find your path when other people are pooh-pooing your direct, personal experiences left and right, and saying you must be mentally ill.

Sounds like you need to be careful about who you share your spiritual path with. People who act as you describe don't sound like new age let alone friends. I find it preferable to share compassion rather than my belief system with others.

In the early days of development I wasn't dealing with my spirituality. I was dealing with my mind, and my mind (like others, I imagine) is delicate! The spirit knows what it needs, no problem..but the mind can be impressionable and easily upset. It can also block your conscious awareness of spirit so that you wander about lost.

Hmmmm...I think you may mean ego, but yes it is good to quiet the mind (like you do when you meditate) in order to "hear" whats good for you

Sometimes, mentally fighting some of the new age poppycock that got thrust into my brain was harder than fighting my own demons. At that point...meditation alone would have been better for me. it would have taken my focus off the outside world and put it inside where it needed to be, and it would also have cut out a lot of pain and still achieved the same result in the end.

Yeah...but that goes back to the number one new age rule...if something doesn't resonate with you about the new age, no problem, discard it and use whatever does resonate. Most every new age author I read says this.

Mmm :) That's the theory, but I found that hard. My mind needed safety, and having to discern what works when you have little direct experience is VERY hard. I was in a dark night of the soul, I needed a METHOD and FAST, something that would ease the pain when the doctor couldn't find a cause for my emotional and mental trouble ;)

Was it an MD or a psychologist? Psychologists are very adept at counseling you and getting to root of the emotional and mental trouble you described. All MD's do is prescribe pysch meds. If it was a psychologist you saw, I would recommend finding another as that person may not be the right fit. Counseling is spiritual as it is also a journey of self discovery.

Instead of having a central authority you have multitudes of individuals telling you how right or (more often) wrong your personal beliefs are, which can leave you feeling very alone! If I hadn't had an angel to fall back on, I would have given up on spirituality entirely very early on because I could barely find my path at all for all the voices shouting at me to believe one thing or another!

Sounds religious if you ask me...When you run into those folks, don't walk away...RUN!!!

(I'm not saying we should have a central authority. I'm just saying; this is the dark side of the new age for me.) The new age is supposed to be love and light and it's great when it works...it's just that sometimes it doesn't. Or perhaps I'm a particularly sensitive person who just doesn't get on with it?

On the contrary! It sounds like you did get on with it by ignoring the self righteous and following what works for you! Thats what the new age is about...CONGRATS!

I'm not so invested in thoughts and beliefs anymore. Now I use my own guidance.

Thats what the new age I read wants you develop in whatever way works for you

But when I was still new, my mind was very active, I was spiritual wholly through the way I thought and believed...new age teaching and practises often made development unnecessarily hard and complicated. I won't throw out the good ;) There are good aspects. I'm just...trimming...off the bits I don't find very helpful. (which is most of it.) ;)
I'm just offering my perspective. I did a lot of the new age practises and exercises myself and yes, they helped in different ways, though not nearly as much as my guide did. Looking back I can see I could have cut the journey down by a third and made it much less painful by just taking the advice I received in my first week of exploration; just meditate. Everything you need is already inside you.

We all have our unique process to reach enlightenment. No one path is same. Thats good to hear you discovered yours! When you said all YOU need to do is meditate, I thought you were speaking for everyone else...

That person was right. There's no harm in saying I agree with them now. Others will just have to take what they take from that, like I did. What's more, if one person takes my advice and halves their suffering, my time typing will have been pretty well spent, LOL!
;)

Well if your advice resonates for some, then your time will have been well spent! Don't expect it to resonate for all though like some of those self righteous folks you mentioned previously I think the lesson here is for the individual to go with whatever feels right for them and to discard the rest instead of "all you need to do is this or that or all of the above"