Is it alright for a Buddhist to pray to lord Jesus?

[markings]

Originally Posted by Gem

I find is freedom isn't about 'becoming enlightened', but more like the true state of consciousness is 'you, just as you are'.

That is why I rarely talks about being enlightened and refer to liberation.
Liberation from what 'you are not'

[markings]

Originally Posted by jonesboy

Thoughts aren't bad.

Silence and or ignoring thoughts is not the goal.

The one is there with thoughts or no thoughts as well.

Some are not bad and others are.
The goal to to eliminate the thoughts which keeps one from the One, to stay with your kind of language use more than I like.

[jonesboy]

Originally Posted by markings

Some are not bad and others are.
The goal to to eliminate the thoughts which keeps one from the One, to stay with your kind of language use more than I like.

Thoughts or no thoughts they don't matter.

The goal isn't changing your thoughts either.

Read the Dzogchen thread on Contemplation.

Thoughts are just energy, silent or not. One of the first steps is to reside in that energy and be unattached to the thoughts. It is not a witnessing.

Next one becomes the energy of the thoughts...

As we clear away more and more obstructions, letting go of our issues.. Yes our thoughts change but it is a letting go, a non attaching that does it. Non attaching isn't an ignoring or a silencing of ones thoughts, that is more along the lines of repression.. it is a letting it pass through without it affecting you.

Be like the sky...

[sky]

Originally Posted by markings

Some are not bad and others are.
The goal to to eliminate the thoughts which keeps one from the One, to stay with your kind of language use more than I like.

Yes I agree, Buddha taught that thoughts should be identified as skillfull or unskillful and then choose which need ignoring and pushed away.
In the Buddha's discourse on the forms of thoughts he taught 5 ways of dealing with disturbing thoughts, it's quite long so I wont copy and paste but it's worth reading..

[jonesboy]

That is like saying to someone caught up in drugs.

I like the thoughts about partying and doing drugs tonight, but I am going to ignore the thoughts about getting caught by my parents, needing to bum off of someone to get some etc..

I will just choose the good thoughts about getting them...

That is not the goal.

[Bohdiyana]

Siddhartha sure had a goal. He left his wife and kid to go after it. But then he stayed close to them as they ended up in his future organization in various ways.

[Bohdiyana]

Originally Posted by jonesboy

Thoughts or no thoughts they don't matter.

But everything you just posted was thought. Why post thoughts? We must think they matter or are important?

Are there different sources of thought? So some are worth posting or believing in?

[Bohdiyana]

Originally Posted by jonesboy

The one is there with thoughts or no thoughts as well.

But see what do you mean by "one is there with their thoughts?"

Say I'm enlightened and I am there with my thoughts, what is the relationship between me and my thoughts? It can't be the same as a normal person who is with their thoughts. So what is the difference?

[jonesboy]

Originally Posted by Bohdiyana

But everything you just posted was thought. Why post thoughts? We must think they matter or are important?

Are there different sources of thought? So some are worth posting or believing in?

In no tradition will you find where they say thoughts are bad. Thoughts will always happen one way or another. The Buddha when he taught was thinking.

The first thing that makes them different as we advance along the path is the detachment to them.

You may for example be able to reside in the Witness as you go about your day and feel great from the detachment and then all of a sudden your ex shows up and bam you are caught up in emotional issues.

As you progress you are able to catch yourself before you get upset it is no longer an automatic response. One is able to just let it all float on through them. When the issue has been truly let go off no negative emotion or energy or thoughts occur.

How much different then is the conversation and the relationship with the ex then? Everything changes. :)

Not to mention when you get to that level of being what your daily experience is just being. At this point one truly understands what joy and bliss is and has no doubt it is ones true nature.

When one is filled with joy, an open heart and are able to not get caught up in local mind stuff, like it doesn't even arise. That is where an enlightened being is coming from when they are thinking. In a very basic way.

[Bohdiyana]

Originally Posted by jonesboy

In no tradition will you find where they say thoughts are bad. The first thing that makes them different as we advance along the path is the detachment to them.

I think there are some contradictions there the way you worded that. If there was nothing wrong or bad about thinking, why would anybody want to be detached from them? Why not try to be more attached to them if they are all good? So obviously there is something bad about them or you would not have a whole religion dedicated to telling people to learn to be detached from their thoughts.

What you said is kind of like saying, there is nothing wrong or bad about a pit bull who was trained to attack all people on sight. Well yea if nobody ever goes near him all is good right. But he has a potential to do harm if we give him an opportunity to attack us. It's the same with thought. Yea if we are detached from them we don't experience their bad nature, but you can't say it is not there.

I think there are two distinct types of thought which correspond to our two possible states of consciousness. One which is "bad" is somebody who is largely unconscious and so their habits and conditioning and emotions drive thoughts and the reverse, thought drives their actions and emotions etc and there is no space between them and their thinking. So hate and anger and fear etc runs their lives. They are largely on auto pilot and conditioned to act good or bad. In these people, their conditioning runs their lives. Then there is a higher consciousness self aware person who is detached from thought yet can use to it talk and teach etc. So thought would not be bad in these people since it has no effect. It is a tool they use to communicate out of awareness.

Originally Posted by jonesboy

You may for example be able to reside in the Witness as you go about your day and feel great from the detachment and then all of a sudden your ex shows up and bam you are caught up in emotional issues.

As you progress you are able to catch yourself before you get upset it is no longer an automatic response. One is able to just let it all float on through them. When the issue has been truly let go off no negative emotion or energy or thoughts occur.

How much different then is the conversation and the relationship with the ex then? Everything changes. :)

Not to mention when you get to that level of being what your daily experience is just being. At this point one truly understands what joy and bliss is and has no doubt it is ones true nature.

When one is filled with joy, an open heart and are able to not get caught up in local mind stuff, like it doesn't even arise. That is where an enlightened being is coming from when they are thinking. In a very basic way.

Yea that is true in most I think. Sometimes we are able to be clear and detached and self aware and other times we get sucked back into thought. Or one can say there are some "blind spots" where the person is clearly attached to some things and not others but of course they don't see it all. I think it's a bit like pealing an onion. You can remove a great deal but not be at the center yet. We miss things. Like obviously if a person has any kind of reaction to a post on a forum, they are attached to something they could learn to notice and let go of. They have a self awareness blind spot. But these are normal and a part of the journey.