anyone ever experienced oneness?

Originally Posted by TzuJanLi

Greetings..

I agree.. i would ask for no one's 'allegiance', ever.. and, at the same time, i would welcome the company of those that have no 'allegiance' to beliefs and come to understand Life on 'their own' terms, and whose understanding does no unnecessary harm..
Nope, not interested.. if i should stray from clarity, i would hope for the honest counsel of my companions..

Be well..

Agree. Sooner or later allegance will bring compromise. I also welcome the company but not at the cost of integrity of expression.

Originally Posted by Neville

I actually like this.I mean really like it. It has a resonance, However much like that darned barbed wire fence that Steve McQueen comes a cropper on in the Movie The Great Escape, and it don't matter how many times I watch it, or how much I root for his character in the Movie. The barbed wire fence always cuts his escape bid short of success.

With the above analogy in mind, I refer you back to my observation in post 212 above.


Things are only ever going to be as you perceive them to be, this applies to me as much as everyone else.

What you think is what you think. What I think is what I think.

there's a certain resignation arrived at once one realizes this.


It seems that even a pneumatic hammer won't break the skin's on some rice Pudding's.

Neville,

Don't bother, I mean seriously..don't waste your writing. I know you are trying to further your understanding but sometimes ignorance is bliss, just look and see how many people around you are in this state of bliss.

Originally Posted by Neville

Neville,

Don't bother, I mean seriously..don't waste your writing. I know you are trying to further your understanding but sometimes ignorance is bliss, just look and see how many people around you are in this state of bliss.

Ignorance is certainly bliss especially when it concerns things outside our conscious understanding, be content with what one has at this time, many do who have far less!!!

Love
Mathew

Originally Posted by Buzz

Support is fine, it is blind allegance that has always seemed misplaced to me. Spiritually speaking, why would we hitch our pony to another's wagon? Just sayin' is all.

"None are more hopelessly enslaved than those who falsely believe they are free." - Goethe

Observations:

But Buzz, the individual who is engaged in blind allegiance is blind to the fact that they are in allegiance to something.
The aware observer of the blind person can see the allegiance, but because of the
"blindness", the lack of self awareness, the allegiancer cannot see they are doing so.
To the blind allegiancer, they are not doing anything harmful to themself because they cannot see they are,
and may respond with puzzlement when another expresses their concern for them.

Lack of self awareness, i theorise, must be dealt with first, otherwise
one could risk repeatedly and unsuccessfully alerting the person of their self harm.
One may ask themself after X amount of time, "Why isn't my message getting through?"
It may be the other needs it and they can't see or the message is inappropriate for them, that the messenger has the sight issue.

And, just for fun, where do you suggest "blind allegiance" should be placed, as opposed to "allegiance"?

Originally Posted by Mathew

No I'm sincerely sorry by making such uncalled comments about a person I didn't know, I think it was in the heat of the battle with AC, I have got to kool it....& I thank you for sharing some of you experiences with me & thank you for your down to Earth attitude.

M-G was in a battle?
~stands up with furious anger, looking around the office~
WHY DIDN'T I GET THE MEMO?

Originally Posted by Mountain-Goat

"None are more hopelessly enslaved than those who falsely believe they are free." - Goethe

Observations:

But Buzz, the individual who is engaged in blind allegiance is blind to the fact that they are in allegiance to something.
The aware observer of the blind person can see the allegiance, but because of the
"blindness", the lack of self awareness, the allegiancer cannot see they are doing so.
To the blind allegiancer, they are not doing anything harmful to themself because they cannot see they are,
and may respond with puzzlement when another expresses their concern for them.

Lack of self awareness, i theorise, must be dealt with first, otherwise
one could risk repeatedly and unsuccessfully alerting the person of their self harm.
One may ask themself after X amount of time, "Why isn't my message getting through?"
It may be the other needs it and they can't see or the message is inappropriate for them, that the messenger has the sight issue.

And, just for fun, where do you suggest "blind allegiance" should be placed, as opposed to "allegiance"?

Yes people cant see until they see..........and some people need to see the bigger picture to open their awareness to that space.........and then of course it becomes their choice how they see it then.

Greetings..

Originally Posted by silent whisper

Yes people cant see until they see..........and some people need to see the bigger picture to open their awareness to that space.........and then of course it becomes their choice how they see it then.

It's amazing what you can 'see', when you stop 'looking for something'.. until people understand 'how' to see, they will be influenced by those telling them 'what to see'..

Be well..

[Jyotir]

Originally Posted by Mountain-Goat

"None are more hopelessly enslaved than those who falsely believe they are free." - Goethe

Observations:

But Buzz, the individual who is engaged in blind allegiance is blind to the fact that they are in allegiance to something.
The aware observer of the blind person can see the allegiance, but because of the
"blindness", the lack of self awareness, the allegiancer cannot see they are doing so.
To the blind allegiancer, they are not doing anything harmful to themself because they cannot see they are,
and may respond with puzzlement when another expresses their concern for them.

Lack of self awareness, i theorise, must be dealt with first, otherwise
one could risk repeatedly and unsuccessfully alerting the person of their self harm.
One may ask themself after X amount of time, "Why isn't my message getting through?"
It may be the other needs it and they can't see or the message is inappropriate for them, that the messenger has the sight issue.

And, just for fun, where do you suggest "blind allegiance" should be placed, as opposed to "allegiance"?

Hi Mountain -Goat,


"Blind allegiance" imo, should be reserved for the Highest, Source, the Supreme, God.
'Blind' applies to faith, not reason. Reason - perhaps more appropriate as a bargaining method of convenience for 'regular allegiance' - is the rationalized acceptance, by comparison of appearances in ignorance. Whereas faith is actually some partial awareness or limited recognition of higher principle in the being - a truer knowing, but not yet fully or completely experienced - at first a glimmer, a whisper, a feeling or intuition.

Interesting that the above construct was intended as an illustration of inter-personal dynamics, but takes on another significance when applied - and it could be just the same - to intra-personal as well. In that case it represents the dynamic of ego, and the gradual incursion of higher principle; or if not successsful, the continued subservience of the being to the ego - as aptly illustrated by the Goethe quote.

At first ego cannot 'see' or 'hear' the 'message'. Then it can, but doesn't want to, it resists. The first incursions of higher principle are mysterious, unpredictable, irregular - even intrusive. But these whispers and glimpses continue until there is sufficient awareness that some process has begun, hence 'awakening'. In a subsequent resistance phase, typically the ego rebels, doesn't want to relinquish sovereignty. (This can be seen even in many stubborn arguments here, which are simply projections of ego resistance in various forms in and through individuals inter-personally.)

When the practice of self-examination, discrimination of consciousness becomes more and more regular and deliberate - the higher consciousness begins to take over the process itself as the ego accepts and surrenders increasingly to that process allowing for the constructive transformation of the being - the 'message' is accepted, gets through - meaning the being becomes more attuned to the higher consciousness available within.

~ J

Originally Posted by Jyotir

Hi Mountain -Goat,

Hello again, Jyotir

Observations:

"Blind allegiance" imo, should be reserved for the Highest, Source, the Supreme, God.

I see no productive reason why blindness should be applied to any interaction with reality.

'Blind' applies to faith, not reason.

A person can be blind when using faith or reason.
The term "blind faith" was an invention of peoples of reason who could not clearly see the principles of faith,
or they observed the behavior of people of faith who could not clearly see the principles of faith.
Or some other reason that i am too joyfully tired to contemplate.

In that case it represents the dynamic of ego, and the gradual incursion of higher principle; or if not successsful, the continued subservience of the being to the ego - as aptly illustrated by the Goethe quote.

At first ego cannot 'see' or 'hear' the 'message'. Then it can, but doesn't want to, it resists. The first incursions of higher principle are mysterious, unpredictable, irregular - even intrusive.
In a subsequent resistance phase, typically the ego rebels, doesn't want to relinquish sovereignty. (This can be seen even in many stubborn arguments here, which are simply projections of ego resistance in various forms in and through individuals inter-personally.)

When the practice of self-examination, discrimination of consciousness becomes more and more regular and deliberate - the higher consciousness begins to take over the process itself as the ego accepts and surrenders increasingly to that process allowing for the constructive transformation of the being - the 'message' is accepted, gets through - meaning the being becomes more attuned to the higher consciousness available within.

I do not subscribe to the theory of a separate individualistic self aware thinking and feeling entity known as ego that resides in a self.

Originally Posted by Mountain-Goat

"None are more hopelessly enslaved than those who falsely believe they are free." - Goethe

Observations:

But Buzz, the individual who is engaged in blind allegiance is blind to the fact that they are in allegiance to something.
The aware observer of the blind person can see the allegiance, but because of the
"blindness", the lack of self awareness, the allegiancer cannot see they are doing so.
To the blind allegiancer, they are not doing anything harmful to themself because they cannot see they are,
and may respond with puzzlement when another expresses their concern for them.







Lack of self awareness, i theorise, must be dealt with first, otherwise
one could risk repeatedly and unsuccessfully alerting the person of their self harm.

One may ask themself after X amount of time, "Why isn't my message getting through?"
It may be the other needs it and they can't see or the message is inappropriate for them, that the messenger has the sight issue.

And, just for fun, where do you suggest "blind allegiance" should be placed, as opposed to "allegiance"?

I don't know. Maybe facing each other. Whadya think this is Feng Shui 101?